Smokers less likely to catch COVID-19?

[WorraLiberty]

Interesting link here from Sky News.

France are going to test nicotine patches on coronavirus patients and healthcare workers treating infected people, after initial studies suggested smokers were less likely to catch the disease.

I wonder if they turn out to be right?

Nicotine and vit d reduce ards.
It said it on the same study. But called use of nicotine likely unethical or something like that.

I wonder if they can get it down to a non addictive dose.
I think china confused the issue as they have such high smoking rates

That’s really interesting.

Obviously smoking more likely to kill you anyway but maybe consumption of nicotine could be a win. Is nicotine in itself dangerous?

It IS the roaring 20's all over again! Smoking will protect to! Smoke for your health!

Vapers will be delighted to hear this. Those that use nicotine in their vape I mean, like many I know.

Yes nicotine is a dangerous substance causing high blood pressure, narrowing of arteries and build up in arteries and all the associated risks. It's also highly addictive.

So there's that.

It IS the roaring 20's all over again! Smoking will protect to! Smoke for your health!

Not quite. There are lots of ways to ingest nicotine now that weren't available in the 20s.

There was some science bod suggesting the patches won't work because his theory (it was explained in more medical terms) was as the lungs are damaged from the smoking it stops the virus spreading into the full capacity of the lungs & that's why smokers don't get the more serious problems associated with covid.

Well, in that case, @WorraLiberty, the post large glass of wine summary is that nicotine decreases the number of ACE2 receptors, the thingamajig that the virus binds to.

Thanks @SmileyClare. Didn’t know that. Never sure what to attribute to which aspect of smoking.

Thank you goingoverground

I thought the dementia result was because of bad science. That is they excluded from the study people with a range of health conditions, and those health conditions were ones linked to smoking. Therefore you were comparing a group of normal non-smokers with a group of unusually well smokers.
The same could be happening with COVID in France, are those who are smokers who die less likely to be recorded as having Covid?

I would be very cautious with that data, especially as it looks at hospital admissions not deaths.

Falling out of a two storey window is more likely to result in a hospital admission than falling out of a 10 storey window.
This does not mean that those extra 8 storeys had a "protective effect"....

Interesting. There was also research about the BCG vaccine meaning you were more protected from the virus. We just don't know.

Still I might worry less about my smoking relatives now.

My theory is that smokers have hardened immune systems from the constant attack of chemicals.

Is this because smokers are less likely to live to old age and aren't in the most vulnerable groups? Does that make sense ?

I thought nicotine was no more dangerous than coffee. On it's own, it's a mild stimulant that releases dopamine. This explains the theory that patches have shown promise in helping with things like Alzheimers and Parkinsons.

The risk from Nicotine itself is that it can get you addicted to smoking. But why anyone these days would a foul smelling cigarette when you can it toffee flavoured is beyond me, unless they are already addicted to cigarettes anyway.

Either way, I'd be interested to know if it is actually the nicotine or if it's smoking.

Of course I'd hope that if it's true, it's nicotine, as that could actually help with relatively low risk. There are other ingredients in cigarettes that make it very addictive. I know I couldn't go a day without smoking, but I can easily go a day (or more) without vaping.

But... there's a realistic part of me that thinks it's probably the smoking, and not the nicotine. Don't your lungs basically fill with tar? It kinda makes sense to me (not backed up by any science!) that if you have all the little capillaries coated with tar then it would be harder for virus particles to infiltrate.

It's completely anecdotal but I know when I smoked I was A) thinner than I am now. I was a healthy size 6 and never put weight on whereas now I hover at a 10. And B) barely ever sick compared to my relatives who didn't smoke. I mean things like colds and flus. I realise of course this flips completely over the older you get and the longer you smoke.

Well this scientific paper tends to indicate that Nicotine is quite harmful. It is very addictive at considered to be at least as difficult to give up as Heroin.
Nicotine affects the heart, lungs, reproductive system and kidneys.

seems as if you can find a scientific paper for everything. Interesting one posted upthread that smoking downregulates the ace2 receptors - this one says it upregulates them....
academic.oup.com/ecco-jcc/advance-article/doi/10.1093/ecco-jcc/jjaa077/5821493

I'm finding it all very interesting. I was saying on another thread I read something about this a while back. It suggested ex-smokers were more affected by Covid than current smokers. If nicotine has a protective effect that makes sense. Ex smokers might have damaged lungs from smoking but won't get the possible benefit from nicotine.

Perhaps the evidence on nicotine's dangers or not dangers is conflicted? I'd heard similar to Rona Or might it affect people differently? Like some medications.

@MollyButton I tend to take these "scientific studies" with a rather large pinch of salt, especially ones that cite:

There are many nicotine preparations (nicotine gums, patches, e cigarettes and inhalational agents) that are freely available in most parts of the world. These products are being heavily promoted and marketed as magical remedies.

Real scientific and balanced language, right?

Dig a little deeper into half of these and you'll find many of them are actually funded by US big tobacco companies, who have a vested interest in people not switching to vaping. Nobody is going to switch from tobacco to nicotine therapy if they think the replacement is just as dangerous as the tobacco is.

I wonder if the effects of nicotine in (current) smokers is why there was not much discussion about smoking patterns when looking at why more men die of COVID.

If it is oestrogen which has the protective effect, it might explain why deaths appear to be higher in men and post-menopausal women

@SnydeValley Well if you don't believe science...And I can't see that big tobacco will gain much by that study. It clearly states nicotine is highly addictive. And that nicotine is harmful. That is just as much an argument against Tobacco products as nicotine alternatives. Also Big Tobacco are heavily involved in Nicotine replacement products.

That article wouldn't stop me switching to vaping/patches as a step to ceasing smoking (if I smoked). However it might strengthen me in the determination to make the step to total cessation of Nicotine products.
If you never make the step totally break the addiction it must be very very easy to return to tobacco in times of stress or when you can't get patches/vape liquid.

No, I agree with Snyde. Take for instance the claim that the LD50 for nicotine is 30-60mg for an adult. It's rubbish.

link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00204-013-1127-0

Also Big Tobacco are heavily involved in Nicotine replacement products.

What on earth makes you think that?

Yes, if I'm going out I don't take my vape any more because of this.

Same here and I don't take my phone out anymore either

Another poster mentioned about nicotine being harmful. Nicotine is addictive yes, and in massive doses can be harmful, but its not the nicotine in tobacco that does the physical harm, it's the tar that does the damage. This is why vapers notice a difference when they switch over from cigs. Vapers still get the nicotine fix, so dont crave a cig, but they are not getting the tar

It's good news in one respect because, if smokers are much more likely to die if they do get it, the fact that it is harder for them to get it may help them.

Obviously there are people who are addicted to smoking and you can't just expect them to go cold turkey and give up smoking during the pandemic. (I have a family member who smokes).

Maybe the answer is much simpler though in that smokers are constantly blowing out a plume of smoke that the virus struggles to permeate?

if smokers are much more likely to die if they do get it

That's not what the data shows.