Is the fear out of proportion?

[Hotlungs]

I’m asking this genuinely as I struggle with anxiety and have a tendency to catastrophise.
I read yesterday that 99.5% of people will survive if they have the virus. Whilst I understand that people are worried they are in the 0.5% is the fear rationale? The press describing it as a ‘killer virus’ and people saying they don’t want to go to the supermarket incase they die. Obviously I’m not talking about those in the vulnerable group.
Are we doing poor risk management? Again to clarify I don’t mean the current lockdown situation to protect the NHS (which is needed) but I mean the fear of it.
We are more likely to die in our cars but we risk manager that (with precautions) to still use them. What are people’s thoughts?

As someone who has lost a parent to covid, this thread fucking stinks.

I'm sorry your lives have been inconvenienced, but this is serious. It won't kill you to stop going out for dinner, or to the gym, or to the hairdressers for a while. It might just save someone else though.

And to anyone who says "I'm only 40 and fit as a fiddle", it's not just about you. Even if we assume you'd survive it (which is not guaranteed), if you're out and about you're potentially spreading it around to others who are more vulnerable. Just have a bit of cop on and some decency.

If this outbreak had stayed in China or been in Africa only, it wouldn’t even be on the news anymore. Some people are deemed expendable In this world but when it’s on your own doorstep it suddenly becomes a major thing and everyone must be saved at all costs.

Over £1m people a year die from Malaria, most of them children. I don’t see any huge fuss about that. Is it just a case of out of sight out of mind?

1m not £1m

Think you were nearer the mark the first time Hairy..

The best way to protect vulnerable people is to reach herd immunity 'using' healthy people. This is either achieved by stopping lockdown and people catching it. While the highest risk individuals continue to shield. Or we all hide until/if a vaccine is developed (and how long would it take to know if it effective? Several months after it is in use I would assume).

Ending lockdown is not selfish... it is the opposite

It would be an even bigger national tragedy if vulnerable cancer patients were exposed to Covid on a hospital ward. It would take just one infected patient or healthcare worker. That's if they could access any kind of treatment, which is unlikely in the second wave we'd get if we ended lockdown prematurely. Around 100 healthcare staff dead already. That's in lockdown. Many many more would be at risk if it ended before we were ready. No-one will get medical care if the staff are all off sick or dead

Why not do what Germany has done?.Start easing lockdown when it's safe to do so. Possibly starting in regions with low number of cases. That seems to be a popular idea amongst many posters in those areas. Whether they represent the majority where they live I don't know. Safe, not only in terms of lives directly at risk from Covid, but safe enough to avoid the NHS completely collapsing because of sheer numbers of Covid patients and staff off sick (and dead). Safe for the economy too. As the Bank of England governor has warned, a premature end to lockdown and the stop, start, stop, start return to work that would entail will cause far greater economic damage than longer initial lockdown.

More haste less speed. Why don't people want a sustainable end to lockdown? Why aren't they satisfied with our very high position on the world Covid death rate table? Why do they want to ensure we take the top spot by pushing for a second wave - with the economic devastation and NHS chaos that would cause?

Why don't they want us to take the fairly simple and achievable (other countries have managed it) measures necessary for a safe easing of lockdown? Mass testing (using accurate tests), enough PPE for frontline staff, enough equipment, staff, beds, drugs, for hospitals, masks for the public.

I think the instant gratification entitled me,me, me culture with no thought to the consequences we've become used to in this country has a lot to answer for. It's why we end up looking back several months with hindsight instead of having used foresight back then. Hopefully this time round common sense will prevail and the government won't make the same mistakes twice. We need adults making decisions, not toddlers who have no concept of the need sometimes to wait for things we want.

I console myself with the fact that the stupid people don't have much impact on policy anyway

If it wasn't for the stupid people running the country we wouldn't be in this situation.

@Cherrycee I'm really sorry. There are some real selfish tossers on this thread. I don't think they represent the majority of people though.

If it wasn't for the stupid people running the country we wouldn't be in this situation.

True but even they aren't as stupid as some of the people on this thread.

elephantsumbrellas How do we achieve herd immunity when we don't yet know if people gain immunity? So far it looks very possible that they don't.

Do you see 30-40% of the UK population as expendable? That's how many are at higher risk from Covid. That's rather a lot of people. Some of the conditions with the highest Covid death rates are very common (perhaps why the government didn't include them on the shielding list). Do you see BAME communities as expendable? It's disproportionately affecting them.

What do you think happens to the NHS when we get the second wave, ending lockdown before we're ready would bring? How will people (Covid or non Covid) access care when staff are off sick or dead? When hospitals are overwhelmed by Covid patients? When one unknowingly infected patient or healthcare worker infects the whole ward of vulnerable cancer patients?

What happens to the economy when there's widespread Covid running unchecked through the UK? Workers off sick, many bedbound for weeks (that's the fit young and healthy), lots dying? How do people get to work or hospital when transport workers are off sick or dead? Who will want to trade or invest in the country with one of the highest Covid death rates in the world? What foreign tourists will want to come to the infected UK?. Tourism is an important part of our economy. As for us going on holiday. Certainly not abroad. We will be quite rightly banned from entering other countries.

We don't need to hide until we have mass access to a vaccine or drug treatments but we certainly should follow the lead of countries like Germany. Mass testing, PPE, masks for the public. Not too difficult to achieve. Then we'd be ready to look at easing lockdown.

@ToffeeYoghurt

I think most people do want that. I think the press conference tonight focussing on testing was helpful. There needs to be more of that sort of information given out.

Just saying “we can’t even begin to think about the end of lockdown” makes people think this could carry on for months and months. I suspect that is when you will get people giving up on the idea because some people will feel it’s not working so what’s the point.

The reality is that it is more likely that the lockdown will continue for weeks rather than months based on what is happening elsewhere with a slow release of lower risk activities first combined with the test and trace regime.

The government have only really made it clear today that they planned on operating a large scale test and trace programme. It’s been assumed it would need to happen but it hasn’t been explicitly addressed before now. I’m not sure playing their cards quite so close to their chests is necessarily helpful.

It won't kill you to stop going out for dinner, or to the gym, or to the hairdressers for a while. It might just save someone else though.

It's not just about that though is it, and that comment shows how small minded you are and what conftable existence you like have.

It's about a ressesion leading to more austerity and more cuts. It's about people in difficult home environments being trapped. It's about children missing out on education, sport and socialisation. It's about people living alone getting depressed from loneliness and isolation. It's about people losing their jobs, businesses and homes. People not being able to put food on the table. People already living in cramped, over crowded accommodation, no acsess to a garden, in some cases damp and mold infestations not being able to get out. Being able to go out to school or work or just to a mums group, or book club or round to friends and family is a lifeline for some people.

No one is saying fuck it, it's been three weeks we've done our bit let's just let it run rife. They're saying the lockdown has been long enough, let's start reducing some of the measures for people in the low risk groups and lower risk areas. Let's think about the consequences of the lockdown and how it will effect wider society. Is an extended lockdown worth the fall out?

@ToffeeYoghurt there is weak immunity and then the virus will continually be mutating anyway. You can't cure a virus with medication. You can't eliminate with immunisation. You can't lockdown the world and hide from a pandemic.

Do you see 30-40% of the UK population as expendable? That's how many are at higher risk from Covid.

Can you link where you got that information from please.

Every report I have seen says approx 80% of people will have little to no symptoms. Around 0.5%-6% could die. Around 15-20% will need hospital treatment but can recover as long as the correct medical care is avaliable.

So where have you pulled 40% are at risk of death from. Other than I assume out of your arse. Of course I'll stand corrected if you can link me a repeatable source.

It's not just about that though is it, and that comment shows how small minded you are and what conftable existence you like have.

The fact that you would tell someone whose parent has just died of COVID of being "small minded" and having a "comfortable existence" demonstrates what kind of person you are.

The fact that you would tell someone whose parent has just died of COVID of being "small minded" and having a "comfortable existence" demonstrates what kind of person you are.

Others of us are trying to deal with seriously depressed elderly parents who would rather take their chances with the virus with what limited time they have left, can't cope with the prospect of lockdown ad infinitum, and are shadows of their former selves.

I am 100% certain that there are far, far more of these, by orders of magnitude.

So please fuck off with this attitude.

@toffeeyoghurt the reason the common cold (rhinovirus plus Coronavirus) was so deadly to native Americans when brought over from Europe is because there was zero immunity.

The fact that you would tell someone whose parent has just died of COVID of being "small minded" and having a "comfortable existence" demonstrates what kind of person you are.

But woodchuck calling people tossers and stupid because they don't agree with you, also shows what kind of person you are.

Others of us are trying to deal with seriously depressed elderly parents who would rather take their chances with the virus with what limited time they have left, can't cope with the prospect of lockdown ad infinitum, and are shadows of their former selves.

I don't believe you. There's nothing to stop them taking their chances if that is what they really want to do.

So please fuck off with this attitude.

Please fuck off with your attitude.

woodchuck99 Thank you.

To MarginalGain and Naturalbornkiller you know NOTHING about me or my life, and you can go to hell with your attitude.

Easy to say the risks are worth taking when you haven't suffered the consequences.

So where have you pulled 40% are at risk of death from. Other than I assume out of your arse. Of course I'll stand corrected if you can link me a repeatable source.

It's absolute nonsense, covid19 will have a death rate of something in the range of 2 or 3 per 1,000.

It will be overwhelmingly comprised of obese/diabetic/hypertensive people over the age of 50, why not put them in the shielding group. I'm delighted to take my chances with these odds.

Around 15-20% will need hospital treatment but can recover as long as the correct medical care is avaliable.

I don't know about the quoted stat, but that percentage that need hospital treatment has always had the potential to turn into the actual death rate if hospitals are overwhelmed.

This had been a frightening aspect of the coronavirus since it emerged in China - not the theoretical death rate with appropriate medical care, but the hospitalisation rate that can turn into the death rate.

There's no point at all citing low death rates of around 1% for reassurance, if you can't guarantee hospital treatment for the much larger percentage of people who will need that.

Hence all the stuff about protecting the NHS. Plus of course there's the problem of all the non-covid hospital treatment that will go if there's a massive surge in cases.

I tend to agree that we need to start talking about the phases of being in and out of lockdown, but the idea some people have that we should just all get it over with because the death rate is very low generally is really a mistake. The death rate has the potential to be much higher if there's no treatment.

I don't believe you. There's nothing to stop them taking their chances if that is what they really want to do.

What don't you believe? That elderly people are struggling in lockdown?

Swine flu is actually worse! You would be better off getting covid 19 than any flu as it is a very mild version of the flu...

What don't you believe? That elderly people are struggling in lockdown?

You didn't say that they were "struggling with lockdown". You said they were seriously depressed because of it and shadows of their former selves and would rather take their chances than be in lockdown any longer. Sounds like a bullshit exaggeration to me. They can take their chances if they want to.