Why do schools need to go back to get the workforce back?

[Pitaramus]

I keep hearing talk of the “need” to send kids back to school so that their parents can get back to work. I’ve never really seen school as sufficient childcare to enable someone to actually go to work. My youngest child’s nursery is 8-6 and open about 51 weeks a year. That is childcare. School is 9-3 and is shut for 3 months of the year anyway.

Surely one parent in each family unit (assuming the family has two parents) could go back to work without schools going back. A certain percentage of families of primary aged kids have one stay at home parent anyway because of the cost of the wrap around care they’d otherwise need. And all parents whose children are 13 plus could also go back to work.

I just don’t see the schools being shut as being a massive barrier to a lot of the work force returning, particularly given that they are only open 9-3 anyway and they are due off for may half term and then the summer hols which means you’d be getting 9-3 “childcare” for 12 weeks between now and September.

Of course there will be some who can’t work without school and the after school and breakfast clubs that some schools offer but these people must be in the minority if you’re looking at the workforce as a whole. I know in my workplace I’m one of three people out of about 40 with primary aged kids where both parents work. Luckily I’m managing to work from home as I have quite a flexible job.

If the cost of the furlough is the problem (which I’m sure it is) why not furlough one parent in each family with young kids where both parents work and then everyone else can go back as and when it’s safe to do so.

If parents want to work, then don't have children and palm off to childcare! Get a pet instead!
@SoloMummy
All working mums stopped working now the economy really would grind to a halt.
Stop trying to wind people up I know your bored but please don't embarrass yourself with outdated and silly comments .

I echo your post @tontie

Seriously. Go fuck yourself you smug judgy arses.

Let's hope if @solomummy needs treatment at her local hospital the nurses & docs who are also mothers don't agree with her!

Would you all agree that y10 and 12 may as well give up now?

I think you're right Solo all those selfish mums working in the nhs, teaching and working in supermarkets should either stay at home with their kids or let their partner stay at home, after all it should be quite feasible to sustain a whole family on the epic wages they will be getting!

Breakfast and after school care cost us about £15/day. I earn more than nmw but even at nmw that only costs two hours pay out of the eight I work.

So yes, schools being open from 8:45-3:05 makes working affordable and logistically practical for us thirty nine weeks a year.

And.... our wrap around care is awesome. The play workers are fantastic. We are currently paying 15% to them to top up the govt furlough pay and cover overheads but they need to return to operation if they’re not going to end up bankrupt and making the staff redundant

4.6 million households with both parents working, 1.6 million working lone parents, so 6.2 million. Maybe a fifth with kids old enough to be left. So 5 million who need childcare, out of a total 31 million workers.

84% of the workforce can go to work without schools reopening.
Although not if you worked in a restaurant ...

Family of aliens 👍
Is it 1950?

@JellyBabiesSaveLives

That 31 million workers isn’t households is it? So 2 parent working families equals 9.2million of the 31million workers So add on single parents that’s 10.6million,

I was just questioning that @BrieAndChilli as it looked too low considering 3 out 4 mothers with you can't divide households by millions working

with should be work

Flaxmeadow
It's because some of us have pride in caring financially for our children.
And yes sahm parents rely on us to pay there taxes right?!

Wow this thread is shocking! Some people have such outdated views about women working!

I work part time, and tbh I resent the suggestion that I should have “got a pet” instead of had children. What a thing to say. Women are still people you know. And some of us actually built our careers before children and have the right to continue in the workplace afterwards If we choose to. It doesn’t make us bad parents. I don’t judge those who choose to stay at home, so please don’t judge me or others.

Coronavirus is bad enough without a load of people slating each other on Mumsnet. Isn’t this meant to be a supportive forum?!

I am teacher at a secondary school and I would be very concerned about reopening before a test for the Corona virus was widely available.

At the moment we are providing online education for our students, and in doing so we are protecting the health of our students and their families (including key workers).

To my mind the sensible course of action (especially since the exams have been cancelled) would be to continue the online education until the Summer holidays at the beginning of July, and then by the start of the new term in September hopefully a test for Corona virus will be widely available.

We are still open for a handful of children of key workers and 'at risk' children. We can keep them safe, as due to the the small numbers we can enforce social distancing. Having said that, we still had to exclude three as they kept ignoring the distancing rules and put the other children at risk.

The problem is that as soon as the schools reopen any attempt to enforce social distancing will be impossible. The classrooms are not physically large enough to keep thirty children two metres apart, and if you think children will comply with social distancing rules during break times you are living on another planet.

It is well know that schools spread viruses like wild fire. When the country had the Norovirus outbreak our students were dropping like flies despite our best efforts of using hand sanitizers, deep cleaning etc.

What many people seem to be willing to gloss over is that it can be several days before an infected person shows symptom of having the Corona virus, and some people can carry the virus without having any symptoms at all. Without a test we cannot even begin to protect our students against the virus.

Even though most children appear not to be seriously affected by the virus it does not mean they won't be returning from school with it and passing it to the rest of their families. And for those children who tragically do succumb to the virus; would you want to risk your child becoming another Government statistic?

If we reopen the schools without at least having a test available to determine who has the Corona virus, the gains we have made by having a lock down over the past few weeks will be lost.

myopinionismine absolutely not interested in a SAHM vs WOHM bunfight but taxes is a bit of a red herring. Let’s say my DH earns £60k, he’s taxed on all by about £12k of that and we receive no child benefit & no other additional support eg subsidies towards childcare. Meanwhile the house next door where both parents earn £30k each so a household income of the same can claim child benefit & 30 hrs a week free childcare.

Oh and meant to say the house next door has £24k before starting to pay taxes.

Obviously it’s a bit more complicated but still, as you mentioned taxes.

This is really interesting

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/766498/Childcare_and_Early_Years_Survey_of_Parents_in_England_2018.pdf

So in 2018, 75% of families with a child aged 0-14 used formal childcare, equating to 4.2 million families. If you double that to get numbers of workers, it’s 8.4 workers using formal childcare in a week. I wonder how many use informal childcare eg grandparents etc too.

I personally think schools will open mid june, mainly to spread the infection around a bit to save another massive peak and further lockdowns before Christmas.

A vaccine isn't going to be available before next year.

The economy won't cope without schools opening.

But with regards to other businesses opening, outside of retail most are allowed to open with extra measures. Construction and manufacturing never closed. I can see some retail establishments reopening with the same measures as supermarkets. I can't see pubs, restaurants etc opening etc. Or gyms and theme parks, soft plays etc.

But even without schools opening lots of people can return to work. Those that can't due to childcare could maybe be furloughed until September.

But the government didn't anticipate that so many businesses would close. So I can see pressure being applied after the 12 weeks for businesses to open again. There certainly isnt the economy for so many people being furloughed until we find a vaccine.

I also suspect that hospitals/gps etc will return to normal service and the Nightengale hospitals and care homes being used for Covid 19 patients.

@SoloMummy My husband died. That a good enough reason for you?

And before you take breath for "oh but that's an exception" remember how much more susceptible men are than women are to this virus. There will be a lot more fatherless children after this, and it will be no-one's fault.

Why does anyone care what I do with my children I wonder? If I go to work and leave my kids in childcare/with grandparents why does it affect anyone other than me and them?

I don't give a shit about SAHM's I don't know why they always get so riled up about us working mums.

🤔 why is it some people can't be happy with their own choices, they need to compete and tear others down. Smacks of a bizarre insecurity.

I've worked FT apart from 1y mat leave for each child. DP has been a SAHD, with kids going part time nursery from age 3. Interesting that women are attacked for working, men are given a free pass. Also interesting that if a woman works it is assumed that kids are in childcare 12h per day. Like it is impossible that Dads and wider group of relatives have a role.

The corona obsessed nutjobs who trawl and populate the COVID threads like flaxmeadow and solo have similarly dipshit, uninformed and very stupid views on other matters too. Shocker.

Insecurity, I would guess @BriefDisaster. Its not enough that their choice is a valid one, it must be the only valid one.

I think actually that very few families have one parent who is exclusively a SAHM. Of my extended family and friends, there are quite a few, but they're in no way the majority. The vast bulk of families I come across through school, old friends and work, have both parents working.

What is often the case is that one parent's work is focused on school hours. Inour case, that's DH. More than half of his working time is during school hours and the rest is in the evenings when I can be with the kids. I know many many parents at the DC school who are similar - working shorter hours, certain days, flexi time etc and propping up the rest with paid for or family support. Also, many of those jobs are lower paid, non-managerial jobs and/or working in support/caring/service roles and if this pandemic has taught us anything it's that these roles and those workers are essential to a healthy functioning society and economy.

Also, getting children back to school also gets teachers back at work, so it's a major part of the workforce the government can get back (I know many are doing work from home, but you know what I mean).