All the doctors dying are Asian - what’s going on?

[MMXVi]

And why is nobody asking questions about this?

I’m over-invested in the answer because my sister is a doctor very much on the frontline, and we’re of Indian ethnicity. I want her to be protected and if she’s facing some sort of additional genetic, behavioural or dietary risk I want that flagged up to her and other doctors PDQ, not to mention their patients of the same ethnicity.

If I see another glib and possibly slightly racist response about BAME people being poorer and therefore more prone to underlying conditions I’ll flip my lid totally by the way. There’s a world of difference between an Asian hospital consultant on £150k in stockbrokerville and someone Asian on the breadline in an overcrowded council flat, and it isn’t helpful to lump them together in this instance.

So far, I’ve seen a thread about Vitamin D3 deficiency making darker-skinned people more susceptible to respiratory illness. That makes sense to me, and I’ve already ordered some from Amazon for my sister as well as the rest of our family.

My mother (not medically qualified) has a touching belief in the anti-inflammatory and anti-carcinogenic powers of turmeric so I’m making daal as we speak.

My dad (retired very senior doctor and the veteran of more than one pandemic) says probably multi-factorial, but as he’s currently recovering from cancer and therefore very high risk, I’m not going to make him elaborate.

Any other ideas and theories?

Anyone else concerned about why the press have neglected to mention this glaringly obvious information?

Professor thank you for all that you and your colleagues are doing. I live in London and every doctor I have seen, from GP to consultant, in recent years has been of BAME heritage. In every case the treatment and courtesy has been exceptional.

They say that in the US it has disproportionately affected the African American community too. It is very concerning.

Yes, and being vastly underreported. It is mainly in the cities in poorer areas where there is a lack of healthy food and help. They’re happy to report any crime there, but nothing about the higher risk Covid-19 is to them.

Good on Ireland. Interesting about the policy in Finland and the fact they’ve eradicated deficiencies in the population with a supplementation policy. It will also be interesting to cross reference this with how they are doing with regards to the virus. Haven’t seen many stats.

I've seen some limited information about blood types
I think it was something to do with A
But I am not sure
Ill look into it and come back

Only 12% of doctors in the UK are Asian. (8% are from India and 4% are from Pakistan.) Obviously this will be higher in cities, but it's not true to say that it's because most of our doctors are Asian. 74% are British, and 10% from the EU.

Thank you to everyone continuing to post on this thread, which is very helpful for me on a practical and psychological level as well as an intellectual one. I am glad questions are being asked.

My sister has definitely had her BCG - as far as I know, it’s compulsory for healthcare workers.

Is that Asian ethnicity though, or Asian as in came over from Asia to work in the NHS? Many of thos British doctors in that 74% will be of Asian (or African) descent I am sure. I can'y imagine anyone who has been a large hospital or GP practice recently can believe that 74% of doctors are white British!

@Delatron - I just checked UK statistics and Finland on Worldometer. Gosh, I hope the reporting parameters are different. Otherwise, we are doing extremely badly compared to them.
Finland
Cases 2605
Deaths 42
Recovered 300

UK
Cases 65077
Deaths 7978
Recovered 135

Surely more than 135 people have recovered and left UK hospitals? This must be a reporting anomaly. Does anyone know why it is so low on Worldometer?

My sister isn’t a vegetarian, although many Indian communities are, so the iron supplementation was a good shout, thank you.

I realise I have made an error in using the term ‘Asian’ as an umbrella word to describe a very disparate group of people.

Hindus have a completely different diet to Muslims, and different social habits. We don’t have consanguineous marriage, at least not in the north of India.

Ugandan Asians are a very different beast to Indians from Britain. This is where socio-economics plays a big explanatory role.

I've been to a large hospital four times since January, about 90% of the staff are white; all of the doctors/consultants and most of the nurses. So yes, I can believe it, but I suppose it would be difficult to believe if you live in a city like London or Birmingham.

So sorry, of course I meant British Indians from India.

I live in a village, all the doctors working out of our GP surgery are Asian. The NHS would fall apart without immigration and the descendants of immigrants.

but I'd be interested anyway if anybody has some info on anemia/low iron counts).

I don't have any formal info but interestingly I have macrocytic anaemia, Hb currently 100 so low but not terrible but oxygen saturations are between 89 and 91 ( was due to be investigated before all of this and presumably now on hold). I'm not iron deficient though and low oxygen may not be due to anaemia at all as I also have co2 retention.

Finland has a population of 5 million though in quite a large land space. There are more than 9 million people living in London alone! It's not comparable.
On another point, I tick the box 'Indian or british Indian' as I was born here but am of Indian descent. I presume most people would tick that box and would count in the statistics of asian doctors. Although I agree it's difficult to see 74% of doctors being white British.

@greathat In the 1970s there was a huge recruitment drive in Indian universities to fill posts in rural UK communities, especially very poor ones, in which a White British doctor would refuse to work.

Most of the students had never been to Britain, and so they had no idea what places like Wigan and Darlington were like. But in those communities, who had often been deprived of medical care for years, they were welcomed with great enthusiasm and open arms, and so they stayed. Recruited from the universities they themselves had attended, had kids who followed them into the medical trade. That’s why you get Asian doctors in weird clusters in unexpected places all over Britain.

I think also in Finland the BAME population is much lower and their population is much healthier( less obesity) therefore the recovery rates being better- even though the recovery rates sound weirdly low. Surely everyone tested positive who has not died has recovered?

@EthelMayFergus this is not correct. More than 40% of certain classes of doctor are in fact ethnically Asian, and 30% overall.

www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/workforce-and-business/workforce-diversity/nhs-workforce/latest#by-ethnicity-and-grade-medical-staff

@EthelMayFergus you might be confusing ‘British’ with ‘white’ there?

Re Finland in the article linked above it says Finland has an official policy around vit D supplementation and has eradicated deficiency. Maybe that is s contributor to their stats?

Another question about D3 - are the recommended safety margins for supplementation just too low for efficacy in dark-skinned people?

Just as the BMI margins are probably wrong, IME anyway.

Should doctors be using norms from countries of origin, not countries of residence?

As an aside to the main topic in this thread: In comparing countries on the Worldometer it's probably clearer to compare cases per million population and deaths per million. In Finland it's 8 deaths and 470 cases. In the UK it's 118 deaths and 959 cases per million.

Also on the subject of recoveries, Ireland has reported 25 recovered cases where Finland (similar population) has reported 300! I dont know why there is such a difference, Ireland was stuck at 4 recovered for ages. I imagine/hope the real figure is higher.

@MMXVi

That is a really good question! I hope someone can answer that.

I also wondered whether these doctors and medical staff had received BCG vaccines as children?