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The exit plan and schools.

611 replies

NeverGuessWho · 05/04/2020 13:58

I know this whole thread will be hearsay, but I’m just interested in hearing people’s opinions of where schools are likely to fit in to the exit plan?

A friend thinks they will be opened early on, as this will free up more people to work, and hence enable furloughed workers to return to work. This will crucially save money.

IMHO, schools will be one of the last restrictions to be lifted. Once schools are opened, there will effectively be multiple mass gatherings in every town and city, all at the same time. Surely this will result in a surge of cases of the virus.

Unless of course, they pursue the antibodies/certified passport route?

What do people think?

OP posts:
Piggywaspushed · 09/04/2020 10:15

How can 400 year 10 students spread out across available English teachers? I don't get that at all. It would need a complete retimetabling.

I reckon primary will be back first.

I have just been in the supermarket ... till guards and gloves for all employees, distancing marks in aisles and at queuing points and one way systems (and most toilets and the café closed). I have no faith in many schools to sort any of this kind of thing out. No doors to touch as permanently open , also.

Appuskidu · 09/04/2020 10:23

I reckon primary will be back first

Social distancing would be impossible and I don’t think even our government would want to try testing this with hundreds of small children coughing, licking and hugging everyone.

Which is why I still think it’ll ultimately be all or nothing and I think they’ll drag their heels on it as well.

cantkeepawayforever · 09/04/2020 10:26

May be if we reopen and some staff feel they are too vulnerable we could do a scheme where those ones are seconded to work in some area with worker shortages

In the school I work in, around 50% of the staff are in the shielded group or the vulnerable group (remembering that all those in the latter group who are already employed by Tesco / Sainsbury's etc as delivery drivers etc have been sent home on full pay, so there is no opportunity for them to be employed in the supermarkets). Can a school be safe with half of its staff absent, particularly as creating any form of social distancing within classes will entail MUCH smaller classes, needing more staff?

aut0replenish · 09/04/2020 10:52

I’ll be happy to go back when numbers of infections and deaths have dropped; when it is deemed safe for my husband to be back in his office; when I can get a haircut and when I can do my shopping without plastic screens to protect staff and stickers on floors keeping distances.

DBML · 09/04/2020 11:04

When we were told on the Wednesday that schools were closing; we all assumed it would be until after Easter. It was not a celebration because at that point we all had exam groups and it’s a crucial time. We spent the next two days putting together exam papers; revision documents; work packs and trying to cram as much as possible into the kid’s brains...but we assured them we’d see them soon.

On the Friday, we were exhausted. No one had had a break; a lunch; a good meal for that matter; much sleep or any time in a couple of days. We had been so busy. We had stayed after school for training on Google Classroom; Teams and Zoom until late.

We were called to the hall for a meeting before the school closed.
At this point we were told how we’d be teaching remotely. That the expectation would still be high. Hours the same and our remote classrooms monitored. Fine.
We were then told that the LEA had said not to expect to be back before September, so get anything from your classroom that you need as you won’t be allowed back in the building. We were told we’d be also taking care of key-workers children, but this would take place at another school in the LA. That it would be a hub.

We we’re all stunned by the end of the meeting. We’d never experienced anything like this. We worried about our exam pupils. Many staff were extremely tearful.

We went and packed away our classrooms. We grabbed as much work as we could in big shopping bags to bring home along with our computers. It was like the day you break up for the summer holiday, but a sadder, more uncertain and worrying version.

We then met one last time to say our goodbyes to each other as a staff. Cue more tears. Eventually we were told we had to leave the building and we watched as the caretakers counted out the staff and then locked the doors.

I drove home bewildered...how can this be happening.

The news about exams settled our worries a bit. Only to an extent. The emails began to roll in every few minutes from SMT. Before, our work life balance was protected. No more! - ‘Work around your families’ meant that you could be contacted any time of the day or evening. My phone dinged with emails and messages between 6am and 10pm. Do this; you need to do that. All of SMT now trying to prove to the councils and gather evidence that we’re working. It’s been hard.

No harder I suspect than anyone else. In some cases still easier. The people losing money. The people losing family. It’s a horrible time.

Some good has come from this. Air pollution and noise pollution down. You should see the flowers and trees bloom by me. Like never before. We have had birds and bats we’ve never seen before in this area. Bees and butterflies in their hundreds.
People around here shout an enthusiastic hello across the street glad to see a face. People post offers of help through the doors, the support is incredible.

We really are all in it together, which is why I’ve decided to how out of this thread as it reminds me of the negativity and daily battles of the average teacher trying to prove they work hard.

With regards to the original question, local councils are the ones who have told teachers not to expect to be back before September, through SMT. It’s for planning reasons really and no guarantee.

We hope to be back sooner, but obviously would rather it didn’t end up costing lives, which it would right now.

We’ll end up going back, when we’re told to. I guess no one can know any different.

Have a lovely day all and sorry about the long post!

Piggywaspushed · 09/04/2020 11:13

A lovely post but I can't help picking up on the air pollution and noise pollution (and the fact that your school held a meeting at a time when staff should not have been gathered together..)

As I look out of my window there are 40 vans and lorries parked on my street , on verges , and delivering tarmac for a (non essential) building site It is no wonder people think schools can reopen! There are at least 60 construction workers in a small lot.

Lockdown! What lockdown??!

aut0replenish · 09/04/2020 11:16

That was a lovely post DBML.

Newgirls · 09/04/2020 11:16

Yes it would require complete retimetabling and moving teachers who are able to work to teach different subjects. It’s a complete headache.

Appuskidu · 09/04/2020 11:20

Fantastic post, @DBML. I agree wholeheartedly

Newgirls · 09/04/2020 11:25

Take care DB and we do honestly know you work hard and we do value teachers and honestly more than ever before. My eldest said the other day how much she misses her teachers and how it doesn’t make sense without them. Take care x

refraction · 09/04/2020 11:25

Agree about exam years y10 but these aren't the kids that need the care for the economy argument.

Newgirls · 09/04/2020 11:26

Good point refraction!

OxanaVorontsova · 09/04/2020 11:30

@DBML Have had so many of those feelings myself, both for my exam classes and my own daughter in Y11. However, the announcement about exams not going ahead came on the same day as the school closures, the afternoon of weds 18th, so we did at least manage to have a fond farewell with our exam classes before the end of the week.

Willyoujustbequiet · 09/04/2020 11:33

Captain

My trigger will be the vaccine/better treatment etc as I said earlier. Im a former nurse and have worked in a leading hospital in the north which specialised in infectious diseases.

I was scoffed at months ago when I tried to warn people. Laughed at when I wore a mask to the supermarket. No one is laughing now. My children are not guinea pigs of the state. They get flu jabs as they are on the vulnerable list. My family is dead, there is just me to look after them and I have my own health condition.

They arent going back for months. Next year if needs be.

Appuskidu · 09/04/2020 11:38

I agree there is a ‘primary=childcare’ argument, which probably exists in y7/9 as well as I’m not sure too many parents would be happy to leave 11/12 year olds home alone for 8/10 hours a day every day.

I just think that however they choose to ‘release’ people back out of lockdown, those people will be our mining canaries. To pick your youngest children, with whom it’s virtually impossible to implement social distancing, and decide they are your testers-with the whole country watching and holding you accountable-needs careful consideration.

MarshaBradyo · 09/04/2020 11:41

Agree Appuskidu
And the trouble with the test is that if it fails it’s too late to retract.

aut0replenish · 09/04/2020 11:42

It’s not just the children who need to be considered but the huge amount of adults who are needed too. Plenty of adults with non pre existing conditions are getting seriously ill with this. Then there are the other adults they’ll be in contact with.....

refraction · 09/04/2020 11:52

Agree Appuskidu
And the trouble with the test is that if it fails it’s too late to retract.

Agree and they have to think of the teachers in this too.

refraction · 09/04/2020 11:52

Sorry auto cross post

Appuskidu · 09/04/2020 12:36

Absolutely.

The main issue is going to be staffing anyway, I guess. Many schools (mine, certainly) couldn’t safely reopen until those vulnerable groups are told that they are safe to go back. I don’t that will happen before mid/late June (is that the 12 weeks?) definitely, but the government need to decide what happens to them after those 12 weeks?

The government need to be pretty sure they aren’t just sending them straight to their deaths as they will be held directly responsible for that decision.

If teachers who are pregnant/asthmatic/diabetic/lung problems/recovering from transplants or cancer/care for someone vulnerable are still not safe to come back after 12 weeks, then staffing/recruitment decisions will need to be made. There weren’t enough supplies to keep us open before the schools shut, so it might end up being 45 to a class ‘taught’ by a TA. I can’t see that being sustainable, fair on any TAs or a terribly good idea!

aut0replenish · 09/04/2020 12:41

I have no pre existing health issues however I am in my 50s and wouldn’t be able to spend my day in a small space with 30 little germ carriers behind a plastic screen.

Piggywaspushed · 09/04/2020 12:44

I think Who might be thrown to the dogs there are the staff in the second tier of vulnerable, so not shielded but told to exercise stringent social distancing. This includes most diabetics, anyone with a heart condition, most asthmatics and nearly all pregnant women.

Appuskidu · 09/04/2020 12:49

I think Who might be thrown to the dogs there are the staff in the second tier of vulnerable, so not shielded but told to exercise stringent social distancing. This includes most diabetics, anyone with a heart condition, most asthmatics and nearly all pregnant women.

Which is the bulk of those off in my school to be honest. We’d be able to staff properly if they were all told they could work again.

MarshaBradyo · 09/04/2020 12:55

If anyone was listening to R4 this morning they would have heard the wife of a man under 60 who other than diabetes was healthy, not overweight. Now on ventilator given nearly zero chance to live.

People will say oh outlier, you mostly die if you’re going to anyway. Not really working out like that though.

cantkeepawayforever · 09/04/2020 12:58

Which is the bulk of those off in my school to be honest. We’d be able to staff properly if they were all told they could work again.

Ditto - but as working in a school would mean no stringent social distancing, continuous exposure for 6+ hours a day: what is an acceptable death toll? Noting the 9 bus drivers in London who have already died?