DH won't keep kids at home

[WaitingForTheTsunami]

I'm pretty sure IANBU but have no idea how to resolve the situation, grateful for any ideas.

I'm a doctor in a specialty that is VERY involved in the current crisis. I am currently on maternity leave with DS2, and due to return in 2 weeks. Initially I will be working 3 days a week but expect that I'll be asked to increase to FT soon. I may even be asked to move out and live in accommodation nearer work to limit risk to my family/repeated isolations due to poorly kids/reduce commute between shifts safely.
Under ordinary circumstances, both DSs should have been attending nursery, and DH would have been doing the drop-offs/pick ups as it's near his work (I have a long commute and work long shifts so can't do it).

DH is not a keyworker. He works full time in academia in a subject which can almost entirely be done WFH (as he frequently does) but cannot be easily done while looking after kids - need to be able to concentrate for long periods to read papers, do statistics etc. He wants to continue to send the boys to nursery because he can't work at home while looking after them. Nursery seem to be happy to keep them based on just me being a keyworker, they haven't asked about him - in many ways it would have made the situation easier if they had refused to take them!. I would really prefer him to keep them home, as plenty of families are having to find a way to manage around this situation and it would be safest for everyone to do so. I'm not particularly worried about them catching it (in fact think we may have just had it - coming to the end of 2 weeks of feverish, coughing isolation) but about minimising spread as far as we can.

I've tried pointing out the government advice, the medical advice, appealing in as many ways as I can, but he wants to continue to send them to nursery unless it's legally or physically impossible. Ultimately as he is going to be responsible for them while I'm off to work, it has to be his decision and his responsibility so I can't force him. What can I do to persuade him?!

Your dp is obviously not a keyworker and needs to get over it...you stated he often wfh

Would a nanny suit?

How about you eamil the nursery making it very clear that dh is working from home. I am sure they will clarify very quickly that you are putting their staff and their families at risk because dh is a prat.

What guidance have his institution given? I'm an academic and my university has been very clear that they understand some of us are limited in what we can do at the moment and assured us there are no consequences. I'm fortunate that both of us are at home so we can juggle but I have a colleague in your husband's situation. His wife is a doctor in a London hospital; she's working six days a week. They have three children so he's doing very little work at the moment. We all know and accept that that's how it is.

Unless he's an academic doing pandemic statistical modelling, there's no excuse for this. There simply isn't any need to focus on writing or research at present, and 1000's of academics are juggling kids, animals and all kinds at home, no-one is working flat out whatsoever and many posts on twitter suggest that other than teaching, most are doing very little beyond that.

He's just a cheeky fucker who thinks his work is very very important and doesn't fancy looking after his own kids. Academia is full of men like that and women who mysteriously believe them.

How important is it to you that they don't go to nursery? Depending how you feel about it if you want to stop him you could apply to the family court for a prohibited steps order and let the court decide whether they go. It clearly wouldn't be a good option for your relationship though.

I work in academia in a very similar sounding field to your dh. I am managing to wfh with a toddler and a 7 year old I’m home schooling. We are NOT key workers.

In fact, the university is closed. We literally aren’t allowed into the office by security unless doing COVID-19 research. We also aren’t expected to work anywhere close to our normal hours and we still receive full pay. Your dh can manage just like most of his colleagues already are. If necessary, he can take leave. All research is pretty much suspended anyway and I work in a very top Russell Group university in a health sciences faculty, so not like it’s not incredibly relevant. But people have very pressing caring responsibilities right now and that’s completely understood, especially if you are NHS.

Unless his academic research is directly related to this pandemic and ending it, there's no reason why his employers can't cut him some slack and ease off on his deadlines. He's dodging his responsibilities as a dad because it doesn't suit him. I'd lose respect for my partner if he did that.

Private nurseries in my area also told only to take in children where both parents are key workers. You are both being dishonest with the nursery. To put in perspective my school is a hub for kids where parents are key workers taking in several high schools and primary schools - they had three kids in last week- that’s how seriously people are taking this which is absolutely right.

There are parents taking unpaid leave to look after children whilst their key worker partner goes to work. All he has to do is work from home.

I would worry less about him being annoyed and more about why you aren’t being more assertive and being respected by him. If anyone should be listened to in this it ought to be a doctor.

If you are going to send those kids in remember you bear the consequences, can he really be comfortable with that? So worse case scenario here you get it at work, give it to the kids who spread it to the workers or other kids who go home and spread it to others that die, is he really willing to be responsible for that? I’d be getting him to be the one going in and being dishonest - I bet the workers in the nursery will be thinking he is out risking himself doing good in society being a key worker - let him lie to their faces instead of you.

@Logoplanter, not strongly enough to take it to court and effectively end my marriage.

He'll be the one going in and if they ask he won't lie. I filled in a declaration form that I was a key worker but nothing about him.

I think the best option would be to see if he can get furlough for childcare purposes, while still sticking to my position that I don't think they should go in. Thanks for the moral support to keep badgering...

There is no way I would send my children to nursery or school unless I had absolutely no choice.

Can he not take annual leave considering you are extremely important person right now?

Loads of academics are working from home at the moment, juggling research, teaching online, and looking after kids. Loads. He sounds like one of those male colleagues we all hate because, while the rest of us have to juggle our jobs with domestic and caring responsibilities, they help themselves several legs up the ladder by absolving themselves of anything that doesn’t help their career.

Can't take AL for 3+ months which is how long the worst is likely to last.

I'd rather work all day than look after two small children, the very thought!!!
He has to make a choice, work or children he can't do both. At least they are getting stimulated at nursery, better than being ignored at home by someone who is trying to work and then climbing the walls with boredom all night.

This is why men’s careers and income trajectory is unaffected by having children. They simply refuse to make the changes that mothers are forced to. In this case this father is needed to be badgered rather than looking into the interests of his own children. Men in academia reach much higher levels than women because a lot blatantly refuse to step up and make sacrifices making out that it is impossible to make changes to their working patterns where it is par of the course for women.

How about he looks after the DC all day, every day. Then he can fit in about 6 hours a day, 7 days a week of work, whilst they are asleep. Sort of like women doing PhDs often do.

My dp is in academia. I am a doctor. He is working from home and looking after kids. I think this is the best thing to do if you can - but our youngest is 5, whereas with a baby it will be much more difficult for him to work. I would expect his employers to be understanding though, lots in similar position.

Unless he has online/live teaching sessions to do he should be looking after the kids the 3 days you're working and then making up time when you're at home. You being a doctor and sending kids to nursery, mixing with other children of key workers is not a risk I'd be willing to take. I'm a key worker and chose not to send dc to school. Dh and I are managing between us.

@PestyMachtubernahme I have worked in academia for years. Have yet to see even one father look after the DC and make huge changes to their working pattern in order to do so.

Both my DH and I are key workers and had a place at school for our DD7. I have actually been WFH for 2 weeks and he is at home on and off. I thought initially that I would want her to go in and that it would be more stimulating for her but they had 100 kids turn up. The school were on their knees trying to cope with that number so I took her out after 1 day. No one should be sending their kids in if they have the capability to take care of them - we’re all just getting by but it’s fine. I wouldn’t actually be trying to persuade him I would just say “ they’re not going - it’s too risky. End of”.

The risk of getting fired due to insufficient research output in academia is almost nonexistent in the Uk. Especially in the current situation. I think it's just men in academia have too much ego to compromise their career/ "professional reputation " for family.

Tell him to he work weekends and be a proper father for 3 days a week.

Ask him does he really think his career advancement is more important than his children's safety? Would he like to tell the kids that?

TBH I'm unsure if it is just professional ego or that he gets very stressed when trying to juggle too much - has had to have time off sick previously when he's basically just fallen in a heap after a big deadline. Even if his dept were understanding (and I think they are as far as I can tell) he would be beating himself up and getting stressed at the kids if he couldn't work "properly." I don't think it's pure selfishness (though there is some of that), he genuinely struggles to see how he would manage as well as many others are. What I really don't want is to push him too hard to quit nursery, him be unable to cope with the boys and trying to work, have a MH crisis and not be able to do anything at all, by which point we'd have lost our nursery place and be totally fucked.

My husband and I are both keyworkers and last week, originally were sending DD to school but luckily were in position to not have to. That might change the longer this goes on but we'll do everything possible to avoid it. I was naive in beginning and was worried about impact of being isolated and away from school would have on there but thinking about it, majority of kids will b3 children of keyworkers exposed to this daily. We need to keep n7,bets to a minimum even at schools and nurseries. Your husband has ability to look after them, keep them safe and reduce the spread.
My daughter has likely had the virus over last 48 hours. It's been horrific and scary. Both her and I have been very strict with social isolation, cleanliness etc and the only feasible way we think she got infected was from my husband, a frontline keyworker being a carrier of virus but no symptoms and passing it to her. It's so contagious and you have to be so careful which you know.
I think it's either time to have a really brutal talk with husband and lay down law, cancel nursery or even be bit sneaky, go behind his back and ask nursery to tell husband they're refusing to take them. Having witness DD suffering over last couple of days I'd do what it takes to keep them at home. Good luck xx

"The risk of getting fired due to insufficient research output in academia is almost nonexistent in the Uk. Especially in the current situation. I think it's just men in academia have too much ego to compromise their career/ "professional reputation " for family."

This!

OP your husband needs to reduce his working hours, take paid or unpaid leave, so that he can do childcare the 3 days a week when you're at work. This still leaves 2 days a week that he can work (while you're doing childcare) plus evenings and weekends if he chooses to also work then.

Do you know how many other children will be at the nursery and whether any others are children of frontline healthcare professionals?

We got a nursery place for DS and considered sending him but decided the risk was too great that he could infect children of healthcare workers, putting them out of action, and they could also infect him and us.

Has your DH considered those risks? Does anyone in the family have any conditions? How would he feel if you had to self-isolate because one of the DC had symptoms - picked up at nursery - and couldn't work? Simply because he is not responsible enough to reduce his workload and step up to do childcare?!

If he's anxious about working less he probably needs to work on his anxiety. I know academia is tough but unless he works in epidemiology or similar his role is really not essential right now.