Are the working class are being sacrificed to save the middle class?

[YakkityYakYakYak]

From a northern, predominantly working class town but have lived in the south for 15 years in a fairly middle class area.

There just seems such a stark difference between what we and most of our friends here are able to do (working from home, sheltered away in our houses, or able to take mortgage breaks if we need to stop working for a while) and what my family and friends in my home town are having to do (all still having to go out to work in care homes, factories, supermarkets, etc with very little protection).

DF who is close to retirement, has been classed as a key worker in the food supply chain. So he has to go to work every day in a dirty factory where absolutely no precautions have been taken to mitigate his risk of catching it.

Not sure there’s any point to this rant really, and I know there are no winners in this situation but I can’t help feeling that the working classes aren’t being protected at all and are basically being sacrificed to save everyone else.

I do also think there is a North/South issue here too. As someone who has never lived south of Manchester, I do feel that the South East have absolutely no interest whatsoever in the problems faced by the 'North' and our complaints are often ridiculed and ignored. Suddenly now London is facing this crisis, the whole country has to go onto lock down.

This ^^^

Yes. Only some jobs are actually needed.
The idea we need other jobs to create wealth, is because that is how the system is set up. No one actually needs marketing officers for example. We only have those jobs because we are in a system that needs people tp buy things they don't actually need or even want.

Haven't read full thread.

The middle classes will lose out too - I'm seeing so many stories of redundancies on LinkedIn. There were already lots of contractors looking for jobs with the upcoming changes to IR35 regulations (now postponed but damage still done). So many people in my network are already out of work and this will only worsen with the pandemic.

That would depend whether you think doctors and teachers are working class?

I think we are realising just how important the working class are but I don't think there's anything sinister about it, just that their jobs require contact and can't be done from home.

His employers should be protecting all their staff as best they can, especially the more vulnerable though. As a good working class lad, is he in a union?

Doctors aren't working class under any definition of the term and never have been.

Obviously they are doing more for the middle classes or they would be paying a universal basic income rather than paying people 80%.

I see what you mean.

Doctors aren't working class, though.

And it's hard to see an alternative.

Everyone is safer if a proportion of the population lock down and reduce pressure on the NHS.

Many apparently secure people are also just a few paychecks away from insolvency and many at home cannot work.

Fatted rather than London having absolutely no interest whatsoever in the problems faced by the 'North , it appears to be YOU who have no concerns for problems outside your area. You honestly think that now London is facing this crisis, the whole country has to go onto lock down???? THIS IS A GLOBAL PANDEMIC. Do you honestly think that Spain, Italy, Australia, NZ, New York and the like are all going into lockdown because 'London has an issue' and that 'no one cares about the north of England? There is definitely some geographical small mindedness being displayed here but it is not from Londoners, it's from you!

I don't even think it's a north/ south divide. More south east/ everywhere else divide. I doubt people in the south west are suddenly missing their cheap access to brilliant public transport, or their wonderful amenities and well funded resources anymore than the rest of us are.

Also the city versus small town and rural divide. I say city, but it's mainly London ime.

'Twas ever thus.

@TolpuddleFarter as you are comfortable could you perhaps pay your mother’s bills for her and encourage her to look after herself?

I notice there's no round of applause planned for supermarket workers, or bin men, or those working in chicken factories who are also working harder during this crisis.

Hats off to the NHS staff, you are hugely appreciated during this time. Supermarket staff are also on the frontline though, we should appreciate and respect these people more.

Anxiety, countries make decisions about when to start and end lockdowns based on the spread in their own countries, not in the global spread.

I think supermarkets could close and operate on a scaled up click and collect/ delivery only system. Although this might mean recruiting more staff at least there won't be as many random people wandering around the supermarket so it would be a closed system. Collection could be outside on a timed basis. It is not fair on workers otherwise. Care workers obviously can't work like that but at least it could slow the spread in the general population.

Until last week I was working in retail (non essential) and I did have this feeling like our lives and health just didn't matter as much as everyone else. My company wouldn't let us wear gloves and had no distancing measures, the shop was always crowded and I was so anxious because I have asthma. I was told we were expected to carry on working unless our legs dropped off.

I know doctors and nurses are putting themselves at risk and saving lives in the process, but they get protection - and I know there have been issues with ppe, but people actually care about that. And they get recognition too. Nobody cared about me and my colleagues working on nmw. I want to clap for the NHS, they deserve it, but I think everyone else who's keeping the country going by working in supermarkets, factories, essential services and so on, also deserve it.

@Cissyandflora certainly not rich enough to support her and my dad in their home (he doesn't work - he's a bit of a dosser, which is also a big part of the problem) Could afford to take her in, but don't think she'd go for that!

I do feel that the working class are the most demonised. Someone mentioned something that reminds me of my childhood. The amount of times we heard "if you do not work hard in life you will be a binman or end up in McDonalds. Like there is anything wrong to work at these jobs. Anyone who is able to work deserves respect regardless of the job. Also, many graduates and qualified people work in these jobs nowadays. A degree does not guarantee you a job at JP Morgan.

Also, we see the same with people on benefits. People before this crisis, "too many people on benefits are lazy" "their benefits should be cut." Now some find their selves in a situation where they have to claim universal credit. Never look down at anyone, things can change in an instance is the motto we should all live by.

Hopefully by the end of this we will have a bit less snobbery towards people working in "low skilled" jobs.

@damnthatanxiety I live in Wales actually.

Secondly, the same problem is no doubt happening across the world. The virus is spreading around densely populated areas. Madrid, New York etc. I'm sure you'll find plenty of people in low income semi rural areas of other countries across the world with the same complaints as me.

As for geographic small mindedness, I've lived in three countries. Have you?

Agreed OP. I am watching gobsmacked as the "essential workers" turn up at my neighbours homes. Gardeners, housekeepers, cleaners and my personal favourite a tennis court maintenance person. These people have obviously been told that they won't get paid unless they work and so are having to put themselves at risk.

But then look at the royal family happily self-isolating with teams of servants and protection officers still in place and still no doubt unable to squeeze their own toothpaste on to a brush. WW1 saw enormous changes in the way society lives and at the end of this I hope we see something similar.

I agree Op. The supermarkets are making huge profits from this crisis at the expense of the frontline workers. The supermarket bosses have not issued their staff with any protection like masks and gloves and not protected them from aggressive shoppers, all the while allowing panic buying for weeks and not keeping their shelves stocked with necessities. The big supermarkets should hang their heads in shame, they are raking it in and I bet none of that profit will be passed on to their frontline staff, it's a fucking disgrace.

Yanbu and it is part of the reason I told my cleaner that I would be paying her not to come to work for the duration!

I don't think it is deliberate but the inevitable consequence of this style of lockdown is that white collar professionals are almost all tucked away at home while cleaners /carers/retail staff / delivery men/factory workers etc all have to go into work

(NB my dad is a judge and was still commuting by train to work when we spoke the other day so it is not just the working class roles but there is a huge imbalance)

To all those mentioning Doctors, yes I completely agree that they are mainly middle class and are also making huge sacrifices. I have a few friends who are doctors and nurses and I couldn’t be more in awe of the work that they do.

And I do get that this will be immensely difficult for all sorts of people. DH and I would probably be considered middle class now (although I don’t think the boundaries are that clear cut) and this will have a big financial impact on us with me unlikely to be able to work with no childcare. Lots of our MC friends are sadly facing redundancies and uncertain futures.

But I do think that the loss of life will inevitably occur disproportionately within the working class population who are far less likely to be able to work at home.

I know this is just the way of life and not a new thing, but I think this situation has really brought the class divide to the forefront. I hope, like others have said, this will give people more respect for those doing the ‘menial jobs’ that keep the country running. But more so, I hope that more is done right now to protect all those out on the front lines.

@Makeitgoaway yes he is a union member, he hasn’t mentioned the union being involved yet but agree that it would be a good idea for them to be. Although I’m sceptical about how much power the unions really have now. He’s been kicking up a fuss with his bosses himself though to try to get some changes put in place particularly around social distancing, hopefully they will start to take responsibility for the health of their staff soon. It would be good to see the HSE getting heavily involved in enforcing standards during this time too, before it’s too late for many workers.