Extremely vulnerable vs Vulnerable

[Hibuscusbusiness]

Slightly confused by the new directions given today. So I understand that this’ll ode in the highly vulnerable group have to self isolate for 12 weeks.... but what are the rest of the ‘vulnerable’ group meant to do!?! Pregnant women/over 70s/ some other underlying health conditions......?

They are still supposed to be following the social distancing advice as stringently as possible, but don't have to stay inside for 12 weeks.

I'm expecting the letter this week. :(

The same as what they should have been doing already - social distancing but taking extra care when doing so and being particularly stringent in avoiding unnecessary contact.

What does this mean for work? I am guessing as a teacher I cannot be in, but other jobs?

I'm a teacher. I'll be setting work electronically for the pupils and doing other planning and paperwork as well as looking into the new (Wales) curriculum.

Sorry to hear you are expecting the letter drmadelinemaxwell - 12 weeks isolation is tough xxx

Anyone know which group bronchiectasis will be in? It’s driving me mad not knowing. I guess those in the highest risk group will get their letters first?

What do we mean by extremely vulnerable?
People falling into this extremely vulnerable group include:

1. Solid organ transplant recipients

1. People with specific cancers:

people with cancer who are undergoing active chemotherapy or radical radiotherapy for lung cancer people with cancers of the blood or bone marrow such as leukaemia, lymphoma or myeloma who are at any stage of treatment people having immunotherapy or other continuing antibody treatments for cancer people having other targeted cancer treatments which can affect the immune system, such as protein kinase inhibitors or PARP inhibitors people who have had bone marrow or stem cell transplants in the last 6 months, or who are still taking immunosuppression drugs People with severe respiratory conditions including all cystic fibrosis, severe asthma and severe COPD.

1. People with rare diseases and inborn errors of metabolism that significantly increase the risk of infections (such as SCID, homozygous sickle cell).

1. People on immunosuppression therapies sufficient to significantly increase risk of infection.

1. Women who are pregnant with significant heart disease, congenital or acquired.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/guidance-on-shielding-and-protecting-extremely-vulnerable-persons-from-covid-19/guidance-on-shielding-and-protecting-extremely-vulnerable-persons-from-covid-19#what-do-we-mean-by-extremely-vulnerable

oops, got the numbers wrong there.
The info is right but it's 6 groups (COPD got tagged onto the cancer list)

Have they advised what people should do if they don't live alone? Should the whole household stay in? Unless it's a large house with at least two bathrooms I don't see how the most vulnerable will be protected.

Yep - I understand the list of extremely vulnerable, but the government had initially suggested a much larger group of ‘vulnerable’ people so just wondered what the rest of that group should be doing now! Especially if they are teachers or in other professions where social distancing is not possible?

You aren't the only person confused. It's another goalpost that has been moved. Last week the original list had my DH on it (not as in Mr Piggy specifically named!)And diabetics etc. It's a bit like how the imagined keyworkers list changed ....

I now don't understand how the ordinary vulnerable group is different from what everyone is supposed to do.

Cynic in me thinks this us tied up with the provision and cost of food parcels.

It just recommended social distancing as much as possible and work from home if you can.

Which means nothing if you are in a job where you can't WFH.

However, all teaching union and headteacher union advice says that asthmatics should not be in school. I had to fight for this and it wasn't a popular request.

Ps DH is indeed a teacher. As am I.

Piggy I'm cynical too. I wonder if it's because too many keyworkers would be included especially if the advice extends to household members. So many people have certain conditions. Asthma for example, which has been increasing in places like London because of the pollution. Diabetics have also grown in number.

Yes I also strongly suspect they decided the numbers requiring support of food parcels etc would be too great with the original list. But it does make it tricky to know what to do now! I feel like I am letting people down by not going in :(

I haven’t had to fight too hard not to go into work so far ... but suspect that will change tomorrow. This me wondering if there was any official advice about what to do!

The definition between Vulnerable, as in receives a flu jab( I do and have Cerebral palsy) but the super vulnerable shielding group category all involve disease and illness which have an immune system cause Eg chemotherapy immune suppression Transplant Anti rejection suppression would be critically affected if their immune system was overloaded with Covid 19 That's just my understanding( Diabetic parent passed away in similar( not Covid 19!) circumstances

I don't think anything has changed really - when the list of vulnerable people came out last week, the government made it clear that there would be further guidance to follow on a smaller subset of extremely vulnerable people but that it would take more time to identify them and contact them all. That's all that's happened now, nothing has changed for the vulnerable group - the advice is exactly the same as it was last week. I don't think there was any prospect of the vulnerable people (diabetes, non-severe asthma, over 70s, pregnant etc) being asked to go on full lockdown with no face-to-face contact with anyone for 12 weeks as that would have impacted a massive number of people and been totally unworkable. These new measures are quite extreme (eg, you're supposed to live totally separately from anyone in your house) and are really targeted at those who are the very highest risk.

It may not have changed in their minds but it very much counters what has been said by, in.particular, Boris. He is the first person I heard to say the word shielding : on the one Show and this was about the elderly.
Up til two days ago there were two lists , a sort of list A and B. The B list was their high concern list and the people who were told to await information. This definitely included those with heart disease. The thing about immune systems makes sense but Copd isn't an immune condition. It seems they have also separated heart and lung.

Don't get me wrong , I don't want DH to be confined but I do think it leaves a group of people confused. And I reckon it will lead to a swathe of older people and diabetics suddenly thinking they are safer than they are.

And, agree, think these vulnerable people who work may get less support from employers now.

Even the teaching unions have said the household partners of vulnerable people should (not may) attend work on a Rota. But I suspect that is because they were worried there would be lots of them.

It's not strictly true that the extremely vulnerable seal themselves away in their home. There is stuff about kitchen use etc and it is all rather depressing but they don't have to be locked up.

When you say the total numbers would be unworkable... they'll suddenly work when all of us are in lockdown anyway!!

I have an 8 year old in the extremely vulnerable group, how on earth are we meant to live separately from them in the same house? No cuddles? Cooking her own meals? We live in a small house with one bathroom. It's not practical for the vast majority of people so we will all stay in to protect her.