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An Emergency Universal Salary paid to all...

291 replies

PieceOfMaria · 19/03/2020 11:27

Regardless of means.

The idea currently being mooted the government.

I have an issue with this, or at least with elements of it. I don’t need the money. My DHs industry may well be impacted in the long term like everybody’s, but in the short to medium term he can WFH and is being paid in full and that’s pretty unlikely to change due to the nature of his sector. Plus we have ample savings.

Plenty of people including many retired people on comfortable pensions with relatively few outgoings won’t need the money. People who already exist entirely on benefits could argue that they need more money, but they can’t really argue that the CV crisis has left them much worse off than they already were, with the possible exception of those whose children were getting free school meals and now won’t be.

The people who will REALLY REALLY need the money are most self employed people whose work will dry up overnight. Low to middle income working people who were only just managing to keep the plates spinning anyway and now must be feeling sick with worry about their finances. Many household name firms will potentially go under because of this. People who work in small businesses and services that are dependent on footfall and face to face interaction are extremely vulnerable right now and will be losing their jobs as we speak. Airline staff are now facing redundancy or long periods of unpaid leave.

I don’t want any money Boris. Please, please means test this, so there is more to go around for those who are genuinely going to struggle within weeks or even days. I’m not one of them. There will be hundreds of thousand of people who can say hand on heart that they are not one of them either.

OP posts:
DGRossetti · 19/03/2020 14:06

The government needs to cut down on military spending and look after its people.

If only we could turn Trident into ventilators ...

DistantVworp · 19/03/2020 14:11

Surely a way around means testing would be to make it a universal benefit, but companies would deduct from pay? Obviously up to the limit of actual pay (so if you earn £500 a month and the amount of UBI is £1000), you wouldn't be paid a negative amount. And if you have two jobs you could elect which one the deduction would apply to.

This would also really help employers by reducing salary costs and improving cash flow, while ensuring that higher earners aren't getting a benefit that they don't really need. It's the only thing I could think of that wouldn't make administration a massive burden. You would still have situations where as a household you could end up with discrepancies (eg for us, DH is SAHD and I'm a higher earner - his wouldn't be deducted from pay but mine would be, leaving us better off).

Self-employed people would be better off than employed people however, as I can't think of an easy way deducting except through self assessment, and that has its own issues.

Xenia · 19/03/2020 14:17

Some self employed people do not earn enough to pay tax and self assessment is done about 18 months after you earn the money so would not pay the rent next month for lots of them.

RosesandIris · 19/03/2020 14:20

I have two family members who have lost all their income overnight because of this virus. One of whom has high rental to pay in London. They desperately need help. Even if they claimed Universal Credit they would have a long wait for funds. It's a real crisis for them and neither of them has any savings.

Rocketmam · 19/03/2020 14:22

@NotDisclosedToday do your dc also have a respiratory illness which is made worse by low temperature?

Did you miss the previous poster with a disability mentioning this? Do you imagine they will be the only one whose health affected?

People like you are infuriating, such an extremely limited imagination and lacking in empathy. Can never see any situation past their own nose. Spiteful is the only word I have for it.

Tanith · 19/03/2020 14:22

Last week, Yougov had a question about a Universal wage: it asked if @£94 per week was manageable.

thetoddleratemyhomework · 19/03/2020 14:25

I think if we were paid it, I would try to find a way to donate it or repay it. Would be good if there was an option to reclaim it if made redundant later in the same year maybe. maybe should just be paid to everyone who put their hands up?

AvonBarksdale99 · 19/03/2020 14:26

A universal income is a great idea, not just now but in general. If it replaced all benefits the amount saved on administration/beaurocracy would take a big chunk out of the cost. And especially now it would reassure a lot of people and stop the economy from stagnating too much. Hope they do it and then keep it after things get better...

StillDisappointed · 19/03/2020 14:29

I really hope they do something like this. My poor dads work dried up overnight.
He's a self-employed black taxi driver in London. 59, working 18 hours a day and barely breaking even, with 2 conditions that puts him at high risk.

He has no idea how he's going to pay his food, rent and bills.

This would immediately take pressure off of him and ensure that he could go home and stay there for a while.

For now, he continues to work; all day, every day. Sanitising his cab 4 times a day as well Sad

Gran22 · 19/03/2020 14:34

Universal Basic Income could be dealt with via HMRC. It would reduce the need for means testing, and could be clawed back via income tax from the better off amongst us. Personal allowances could be adjusted to take it into account.

lyralalala · 19/03/2020 14:37

Means testing and having a strict criteria is expensive and time consuming

For a one off “war” setting this is a great idea and should be paid to all adults regardless of income, work status or tax status

The small number who don’t need it and haven’t seen any negative impact to their income or outgoings will be massively outweighed by the people who’ve lost income, who’ve had increased expenses or both

It’s also not, imo, a time to get bogged down in long term benefits of this. Right now the government needs, for once in this saga, to take quick action in the right direction

gingersausage · 19/03/2020 14:40

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

StillDisappointed · 19/03/2020 14:41

@NotDisclosedToday where did you pull those arbitrary figures from?

SilverySurfer · 19/03/2020 14:41

Still no link provided to this.

I do not believe this will happen and it's pointless arguing about who should get it and how much because no-one will. This thread is giving people false hopes.

Waxonwaxoff0 · 19/03/2020 14:41

This is a great idea. I'm still currently working but I've been told I could be laid off in 2 weeks. Plus now schools are closed I have no long term childcare in place and I can't work from home. If by some miracle I don't get laid off, I have things in place until the end of the Easter holidays and then I won't be able to work due to childcare.

DistantVworp · 19/03/2020 14:48

Xenia - I didn't mean it would be paid through the self-assessment system. There would have to be some mechanism of claiming - even if it's just name, address, NI number and bank account.

For employed people (including self-employed people who earn through their own limited company) if you earn (say) £3,000 in a month, your employer would pay you £2,000 gross - effectively deducting the UBI you received. They would therefore save the £1,000 (in net pay and employees NICs / PAYE) and also £138 in employers NICs. The employee would also have an improved income as they wouldn't be paying tax/NICs on the £1000.

For unemployed people there would be no tax/NIC impact.

For self-employed people (sole trader) - it can't really be deducted from their pay, so it would have to be decided whether the UBI is taxable or not. If it is, then both self-employed and employed people would have to complete a tax return, massively increasing the administration costs. If not, then employed people would complete a SA return if usually necessary (eg higher earners who claim CB), and self-employed people would complete their usual SA.

Either way, it means that a self-employed person earning £3k/month would be better off than an employed person earning £3k/month, which is the issue that I don't know how to solve...

lyralalala · 19/03/2020 14:48

I think something fair would be £250 for the long term unemployed
£500 for high earners £750 for mid earners and £1000 for low earners @NotDisclosedToday

You’ve just quadrupled, at least, the cost of setting up and administering it...

Giving a set amount of everyone is the quickest, and most cost effective way, to do it

lyralalala · 19/03/2020 14:49

@SilverySurfer Boris was asked yesterday in his press conference if a universal income was something they were considering in the current circumstances and he said it was being looked at

StillDisappointed · 19/03/2020 14:51

My dad needs help now as a PP has said.

He has rent and bills to pay. He needs to eat. He needs to pay for his pre-payment prescription card so that he can get his essential medicines (especially so at the minute.)
If he can't find the money to pay for his taxi he'll have to give it back and that's his earning power completely and utterly gone (not that there's any work as it is.)

The government really needs to pull its metaphorical finger out of its metaphorical arse and get measures in place for those who need them the most.

SouthWestmom · 19/03/2020 15:02

Alloutoffucks we did save and then my son suddenly became disabled I gave up work we lost my salary and mortgage/council tax etc all stayed the same. Like I said we aren't Teflon. How much rainy day money do we have to save to satisfy you?

SarahConnorsPonytail · 19/03/2020 15:03

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

PieceOfMaria · 19/03/2020 15:08

Still no link provided to this.

It was in the Times this morning as something that was being discussed and considered. There is no point me posting a link because it's behind a paywall but there must be other references to it in the media because my son told me about it yesterday, before this morning's Times was out.

OP posts:
gingersausage · 19/03/2020 15:14

Why has the OP’s post telling me to fuck off not been deleted, yet my post telling her to fuck off has? Guess you need a 6 figure income to be allowed to be a bitch 🤣

viques · 19/03/2020 15:18

@Bettyismyfavouritesquirrel. Thanks for clearing that up. I hope it works.

SarahConnorsPonytail · 19/03/2020 15:19

Again, apologies if this has already been posted upthread.

Hopefully if an emergency Universal Wage hits people's accounts soon, and is more than just a token amount, it will help convince people to stay off work if they have mild symptoms or are at high risk of needing hospitalization for CV.

Surely the amount of money that this would save the NHS (and more importantly, the amount of lives it would save) would be worth it?

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