What's the right thing to do about cleaner: isolating as 70+?

[day1intheisolationhouse]

My DMum asked me advice for what to do about her cleaner as DM has to self-isolate as she's over 70.

I said I'd ask here as I have no idea (don't have a cleaner), but it sounded like a very mumsnet problem!

I suggested perhaps offering 50% salary as a retainer to keep her but not ask her to come, and DM said that sounded like a good idea but also she does need help cleaning. What should she do?

Considerations include:

• DM wants to be fair to the cleaner
• DM doesn't want to catch coronavirus!
• DM isn't keen on the idea of her place not being properly cleaned for 12 weeks or more
• DM has limited mobility, she could keep surfaces that are easily reachable clean but wouldn't really be able to do floors or clean the bathroom thoroughly, realistically
• The cleaner comes across London on public transport to DM's house
• I live 2.5 hours away and have DC. I don't drive but DP does. DSis lives 3.5 hours away (no DC).

DM does have a good bunch of friends locally but all of a similar age.

Does anyone have any suggestions or clever workarounds?

What's fair for the cleaner?
How can my mum get her house clean without risking getting coronavirus?
If the cleaner had coronoavirus but didn't know, how much risk would it be to have her come and clean for 3 hours or so? (And is it being unfair to ask her to come across London anyway?)

The cleaner usually comes every week and will be coming on Thursday this week as planned, it's what to do after that.

Thanks :)

They have advised social distancing for over 70s not self isolation

OK, whatever the name of it is, the point is to make an effort not to catch coronoavirus, isn't it?

So whatever it's called, the same question applies doesn't it?

Care homes, for example have banned family visits. Neither my DSis or I are planning on visiting DM unless she gets ill or really needs us for some other reason.

BBC says it's social distancing for now, but self isolation on the horizon:

Every Briton over the age of 70 will be told "within the coming weeks" to stay at home for an extended period to protect themselves from coronavirus.

When it happens, they will be asked to stay home for "a very long time", Health Secretary Matt Hancock said.

The government is to release social distancing advice for elderly people on Monday - but they will not yet be asked to self-isolate for long periods.

I've advised my mum to not have her cleaner any more. I don't know if she'll pay half or not but that could be a good idea for your mum. I think it's risky to have a cleaner at this time. Maybe assess things on a fortnightly basis and if you really need to do a clean you do it as you'll know if you've had any symptoms of corona too

I'm in my 70s, disabled with other health issues and will be asking her not to visit until we get some idea of how bad this is going to get - her other job is working in a shop so she is going to be exposed to lots of unknown people and I can't take the risk of catching CV from her. I've decided to pay her in full for a month and then to review the situation.

As far as keeping my home clean, I will do what I can and what I can't will be left undone until the cleaner returns. Keeping oneself safe is more important than a bit of dust or a few crumbs on the carpet IMO. I'm capable of washing up, cleaning kitchen surfaces, cleaning the loo with a loo brush and that will be about all I will worry about.

Good luck to your DM, OP.

If I lived close by I'd do it no problem. But I live miles away, have kids to look after and I'm not sure I'm any less of an infection risk than the cleaner?

I'm not planning on visiting my DM unless she needs me because she's ill or something serious like that.

Thanks SilverySurfer, good luck to you too

Difficult situation. I think I would pay the 50% retainer, have your dm clean as best she can and then you or your sister go and do a deep clean for her once a month. Wear gloves and a mask while you’re doing it and keep as far from your dm as possible.

I would continue to pay the cleaner as normal. Your mum is not a business depending on customers to spend money to pay staff. She can afford this. It sucks to have to pay for a service you're not getting but these are desperate times. I would get the cleaner to come every two weeks, so reducing contact, and be extra careful with hygiene for the cleaner, no cup of tea for them etc. Your mum could stay in her bedroom while the cleaner is there. She could also ask the cleaner to do shopping or something for them on other weeks maybe.
Whatever your mum chooses, I would definitely pay the cleaner full pay.

The other point is your mum's mental health. I imagine a cleaner is a lower risk contact, given that they're cleaning. Could it be an idea for your mum to buy some disposable haz mat suit things that the cleaner could put on when they get there so they could still do the cleaning?

I’d follow the video on bbc and treat the cleaner like someone you live with but are self isolating from. So have the cleaner come but stay in a room while they are there, leave money somewhere and ask them to leave all windows open. Ask them not to come if they have any symptoms (of course they shouldn’t but may as well say) and supply extra rubber gloves to be worn throughout.

Actually sorry, that BBC advice was form yesterday. Today's advice via Boris Johnson and reported on the BBC is

People in at-risk groups will be asked within days to stay home for 12 weeks

If that's not self isolating I don't know what is?!

The rest of us have been asked to do social distancing. The over 70s are isolating.

My gran has a friend who lives in a form of sheltered housing. In this case it is one where residents in a block of flats have a front desk "warden", a social lounge and so on and can live very independently through to reasonably heavily supported. The friend's cleaner comes around weekly I think and while there gran's friend goes and sees a friend or sits in the lounge to give her space. I think this is effectively social distancing.

The cleaner seems to be a bit of a chum and does a range of helpful things. It's just that the old lady wants to give her space in what I assume to be a small flat.

If your mum is a fit older person she might keep her distance, sit in the garden, go for a walk, or whatever.

If she is at serious risk for conditions apart from age then I would probably not want the cleaner in the house. Nor you. I might want the cleaner to try to bring essential supplies to the door.

This sort of issue is something that there needs to be advice on.

I've got CV at the moment. Day three is coming to an end. It really isn't bad in my case (touch wood). I am worried that afterwards I might still be a danger to older relatives and a young one with some serious immune system issues.

As this apocalyptic nightmare unfolds more issues crop up.

This sort of issue is something that there needs to be advice on

I couldn't agree more. The government advice is much too woolly.

I hope you get well soon LizzyButton

I agree government advice is woolly.
However until told not I think your mum should follow the advice upthread- stay in a room away from the cleaner, leave money out etc.

I think it should be fine for the cleaner to come given that she will be disinfecting all surfaces so actually making it less likely your mum catches it if anyone else at all visits. Ask the cleaner to wear gloves at all times and tell your mum to stay in another room while the cleaner cleans. You could ask the cleaner to wear a mask I suppose but I don't think there's much evidence to suggest that they're effective.

Masks are effective if the correct type is used and people know how to use them properly.

But our government are making no effort to distribute them or educate people on their use, so...

Thanks all, I'll share this thread with DM.

Care homes, for example have banned family visits.

Care homes will not have banned cleaners from coming to work. They will already have routines in place such as washing hands as soon as they arrive.

It's not easy, but I think the point made above that it was social distancing rather than strict isolation.

Arranging a bank transfer to pay, so that there is no need for cash to change hands would be another sensible precaution.