Do you know what self isolate means?

[tobee]

Wasn't sure if I should put this in general chat or not. Wanted wide spread opinions rather than people on here who are likely to be more knowledgeable 🤷🏻‍♀️

Anyway, what is your understanding of this much bandied about term?

I've only just realised I got it completely wrong. Not currently needing to do so btw.

When the virus was mostly just in China they had some tv footage of people apparently being forcibly dragged from their apartments to be quarantined. Can't imagine that happening here?

The system is flawed and there is no policing of it yet. It relies on enough people trying their best to slow down the spread. Some won’t know, or won’t try, or won’t care, or won’t be able to.

What about people who were on the flight with me? If I get a cough two weeks after coming home, will the airline trace everyone who was on the flight with me?

Yes they will, if you test positive. This is exactly what contact tracing does and they are doing loads of that. They will trace everyone who was sat close to you on the flight (usually within a few rows) and any staff who dealt with you and get them tested or ask them to self isolate

They don't trace everyone on the whole plane because, contrary to what most people think, air in planes is refiltered a lot so most people won't be infected unless they are quite close to the ill person

What do you think contact tracing is?

However, I don't think that all family member have to isolate themselves unless the person being tested has a positive result, so until then I think family members can go out (at least that seems to be what is happening). Once a test comes back positive, that changes things, I think.

I wouldn't be able to self isolate. Lone parent with a violent younger child.
Add to that I'd probably go insane in a house for more than a few days. I struggle at weekends. Maybe I could run at 6am when the dc's sleep, I'm not likely to see another person on the footpath.

To me, its staying in your home, away from other people. Unfortunately, the person I am most bothered about infecting (immuno compromised) lives in the same household.

I'm fortunate that I can afford accommodation but will need to visit supermarkets etc. to ensure that this person is adequately fed, watered and medicated.

The idea of an early morning run in an attempt to get around the difficulties of isolation and people on here explaining that they can't isolate because their kids can't miss school or because someone else might have it anyway so why should they suffer is exactly why isolation won't work in the west where people are a lot more individualistic and a lot less concerned about the greater good. I have bought enough stuff to be able to isolate my family in our very small flat for a couple of weeks but I really cannot get over the people in my building who think that we can use such a situation to get to know each other better or the friends who think that they will be hanging at mine because I'm a bit better prepared than them - I can assure you that we won't be getting to know each other better and I won't be hanging out and partying with my friends! However, I'm really doubtful that people will follow any instructions properly as they have in countries like China, Singapore and Vietnam where the governments aren't interested in popularity so simply harshly enforce the rules. An elected politician is unlikely to take such a risk and I have seen enough on here to realise that a really sizeable portion of the population of the western countries will not be prepared to undertake the discomfort of quarantine and will cheat.

I think you’re absolutely right @AGoodPodcastAndANiceCupOfTea. People in the west have no real experience of wide scale disruption/hardship/illness and IMO it makes us very complacent. So many simply cannot wrap their heads around the idea that their personal freedom might be severely curtailed, that the everyday conveniences we’re used to may not be available or operate in the way we’re used to as more people get ill or are required to self isolate. It’s why you see posters declaring they’ll just watch Netflix and order in .

Only my oldestt dd 11 would be pretty good at self isolating. Would be a nightmare here, 4 dc, it just wouldn't happen. I'd fucking love to self isolate

Realistically for plenty of people it’s not going to happen is it, people living paycheque to paycheque with little room for money lost from lost wages, the gov have already said no sick pay for self isolation and even if people test positive some are bound to ignore for fear of losing money/their job etc
whole businesses could be brought to their knees if people stay off in isolation and there are multiple employees doing so at the same time.

People who are imagining we'll all just order in and watch Netflix, who's going to be able to deliver all that demand for food? Are the internet providers that stream Netflix, your online news, your online social media etc able to run automatically and cope with the demand? What about if utilities go down? Even if just in small areas? It's very much the unknown and untested in this country in 2020.

I didn't think about it being one room, either. But I also don't think that's really possible if you are a parent with small children, which a lot of people on MN are. If you're a household of students or young people it makes sense - I read an account of this from Germany the other day actually! The poster's housemate was diagnosed. He was told by authorities he could either leave (which they advised) or self isolate with his flatmate. He decided to stay because the only person he could have stayed with was his mother and he worried about passing it on if he'd already been exposed. He and his flatmate seemed to use the flat as normal but disinfected the bathroom after use, etc.

Yes if there was a much larger scale quarantine, deliveries etc would be less likely but I'm talking about the current advice! What's the point in speculating about what might happen if isolation/quarantine is required on a larger scale? If that happens I'll listen to what authorities tell me to do.

Or a married couple, family with older children, I mean. Those groups could also safely self isolate. I'd say the majority could do it if pushed.

Fair enough @BertieBotts !

I’m immunocomprimised and avoiding people because of cross contamination is the norm. We use an assortment of masks or makeshift cloths as masks.
It’s not always possible for those Ill to clean up after themselves. So we also have gloves that can be used, and a bucket of bleach or disinfectant for the clothes used to clean.
We’ve always had our own towels.

With kids we’ve had alsorts over the years. Cross contamination has been very low.

And of course if you have to stay at home, so do others in your household. Think of it as a cold - family member gets it and a few days later someone else gets it.

That’s shocking that the airline would only contact those closest. The infected passenger could have quiet easily been near the front and gone to the toilet on the plane.
Never mind airport cross contamination.
It would make sense to to mention days and airports publicly.

Yeah my Dh is immunosuppressed too!

I'm in the USA. In the State I live in our first person with the virus was told to self-quarantine while waiting for the results of the test. They decided going to a party was a better idea. The SECOND person in my State to test positive caught it from the first person at that party. Whether it means stay in one room, or the whole house, none of it will mean anything when there are selfish assholes out there who just dont care who they may infect. Oh and that first person...they work in the medical field.

Oh dear!

That’s shocking that the airline would only contact those closest.

If it was two weeks until the person showed symptoms, he or she probably wasn’t that contagious at the time of the flight. If someone symptomatic flew, hopefully they’d be more thorough.

Like everything else though, it depends what country you’re in. Apparently China now have genuinely robust tracing in place and the capacity to test huge numbers. The figures there are coming down, which suggests that given the will, this illness could potentially still be contained.

Wasn’t he a medic too, Yes? Really, really should have known better.

given the will - the operative words. I don’t think the U.K. has the will to enforce the measures that China has enforced. South Korea is tracking and fining those who break quarantine. Would the UK do this?

If you live in close proximity to your family, surely you would have already exposed them by the time you show symptoms so no point locking yourself in one room - ie if you have already touched/ breathed on them is it too late or is it possible that they won't have caught it yet despite exposure to you, so it is worth staying away from them once infected?

I don’t think this country will enforce anything. They already seem very slow to do anything.
Local school trip during half term to Italy. It wasn’t until Tuesday/Wednesday that self isolate was adviced. It’s over a week later and still waiting for around half the results back.

You only need to isolate though if you’ve been to certain towns in Italy or are showing symptoms. That continues to be the advice

In my case I did know it meant locating yourself in one room as has been said. If I was ill I would definitely do this aLthough how likely it would be to stop infecting DD & DH I don’t know. If it was a precautionary isolation with no sign of illness I think realistically the three of us would use the house fairly normally with extra cleaning and washing of towels etc. Other than that I would use the garden for fresh air since it’s pretty big but I wouldn’t be on the street for anything - certainly not running.
The government could easily introduce legislation to ensure that people required to isolate ( say there was an infection at a workplace or school) was recorded and an order imposed. Breaching it could be a criminal offence.... no idea how it would be enforced but the military would be empowered to be used I dare say ( as they are in times or public disorder). It’s all pretty dramatic “ zombie apocalypse” stuff which hopefully we won’t have to experience.

If you’re a single parent with one young child, you can’t self isolate away from them, but you’d both isolate in your house.

If you have more than one child, you’d still all have to stay in your house, but you’d try and isolate sick child from well child. If it’s you who has got it, you’d have to just try and have minimum contact with your children. But probably assume they will catch it from you.

If there are two parents, I think one of you would have to sacrifice yourself to stay in the room with infected child. Obviously if parent is infected the other parent looks after the children.

I doubt you’d get anyone to look after your children if you were infected as your children are likely to be too and you’d be spreading the infection to the babysitters.

With dogs though, maybe someone else would be willing to look after your dog for you? Although there might be a chance that dogs can carry the virus (not sure if the dog as a virus carrier has been debunked or not?). I think if you didn’t have a garden, you’d just have to “exercise” your dog by throwing balls or whatever in the house/flat.

As for going stir crazy- you’d just need to put up with it. Nobody thinks self isolation is fun, it’s just something you have to get through.

Although, if I got to spend two weeks in my room away from the children with plenty of food, tv, books and some craft or jigsaws... hmmm it does sound fairly pleasant rest!!

The government couldn’t enforce it though, even with a law. If you were suspected of breaking self isolation, you would have to be put on trial and the numbers of people selfishly going for runs or whatever would make this impossible. Not to mention you’d have to wait for the self isolating person to be fully recovered before any trial...!