British parliamentary report

[Chuchoter]

This is a very difficult read and I suggest only do so if you can bear to read about the savagery of Hamas & other Gazans.

A distressing element of this event is the denial and minimalisation: go to any forum discussing Oct 7 or subsequent events and the tropes come thick and fast: "Most of the Israeli dead were killed by their own","There's no evidence of any r@pes" etc. etc. It makes sense: if they consistently deny it, even to themselves, they feel more comfortable supporting the perpetrators.

This is the official British Parliamentary Report commissioned because British citizens were murdered and kidnapped on 7/10.

If anybody gives you the slightest bit of lip about Hamas/Palestinian "resistance", or if you are feeling a bit of denial yourself, pull this report out.

Please also share widely. ❤️🇮🇱❤️

https://www.7octparliamentarycommission.co.uk/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR2zq0hCtZ9DycFwIJ27JYkG1lLxS09LfxzBhTlz6G1AMCSgW9FXzdX9mIIaemyKNNt-jUC24LJpYMDAiO7A

tbf there is a disclaimer at the beginning that it is not officially published by parliament (before the usual nit-pickers and thread killers arrive), but it is a harrowing read, has cross-party support and has better sources than the usual twitter/tik tok/instagram offerings.

It's so awful. I hope it will be widely shared as I don't think that so many people who are so blindly " pro palestine" would be if they knew the full horrors that happened. It will give some understanding why Israel had to go to war.

I think many know and don’t care, or think it was justified ‘resistance’.

These kind of threads are tumbleweed compared to all the other ones, started by the same posters on here, sharing unverified Hamas propaganda to demonise Israel and propagate the lie that Israel is evil.

I am just sickened that Israel has been forced to ‘negotiate’ with these savages!

Must be the only country ever to have such global pressure to negotiate with terrorists on the world stage.

Western governments clearly state they don’t negotiate with terrorists don’t they?

I was already aware of most of the atrocities although reading about them in more detail still instills shock and horror, but my main takeaways are that :

1. the report states that the majority of the weapons used came through Egypt, the country that refused to open it’s border to allow the evacuation of Gazan civilians so dragging out the war and enabling more civilian casualties to be blamed on Israel,
2. weapons were stolen from IDF bases, which kind of sheds a different light on the ‘evidence’ that IDF snipers were responsible for deliberately targeting Palestinian children and shooting them in the head as they were shot with bullets used by the IDF.

The blatant lies by the Hamas leader that they didn’t intend to brutally murder and rape the majority of Israeli civilians, killed them because they felt under threat of being killed (by babies and children!) and didn’t intend to kidnap the majority civilians (again not able to distinguish between babies/children/95 year old holocaust survivors and IDF soldiers) makes you seriously question why ANYONE believes anything coming out about of any Hamas Ministry or their affiliates mouths BUT Israel apparently lies about everything!

I’ve seen the word Hasbara used for Israeli ‘propaganda’ on this board and I looked into it recently, and it translates as ‘explanation’ in Hebrew which I thought was interesting. Apparently most people who use the word don’t know that.

I have to say the description of the horrific sexual violence suffered by the Israelis on Oct 7th seems to significantly mirror current reported accusations by detained Palestinians against Israel. There’s a thread about it on this board. The report about Hamas linked to in the same report has not been mentioned iirc.

Israel have a long history of treating Palestinians, including terrorists in their hospitals, and we know how Sinwar repaid them after they saved his life, but we are now expected to blindly accept that the Israelis are deliberately targeting Palestinian children, and gang raping and sexually torturing children, women and men.

I actually find it quite terrifying that so many people in the so called enlightened West have accepted terrorist propaganda as truth when anyone with the slightest sense of logic can figure out it is classic DARVO on a grand scale!

I’m sure this post will be reported by someone lurking and waiting for someone to post something they are offended by on behalf of the Palestinians but I am entitled to my opinion, just as they are, and I see this as a fight of good against evil (not just in Gaza) on an almost biblical scale in our time (I’m not religious either) and I am grateful I have the conscience, intellect and morality to be on the right side.

People who ripped down and defaced posters of the Bibas babies (and other hostages?)
People who are openly antisemitic on the streets of the UK (and have been for some time).
People so intent on targeting Macdonalds for a tenuous connection to Israel that en masse they screamed at an autistic child who dared to enjoy a burger there.
People who mindlessly joined in a chant of 'from the river to the sea' in a crowded tube train carriage like some sort of intimidating football mob (though most would be hard pressed to name which river and which sea).
People who chanted 'houthis, houthis make us proud, turn another ship around.'

I'm not so sure they'll have any sort of Damascene conversion I'm afraid, I admire your optimism.

@SweetPotatoWedges thank you for your excellent post.

@quantumbutterfly thank you for your honest post. I'm sickened by the mentality that have automatically leaped to being 'pro Palestinian' with little to no understanding.

Not so much pro-palestinian as they are anti-Israel. Most of those killed on 7/10 were peaceniks.
One of the Israeli posters on here shared a xitter feed from someone called 'palestinian girl.' Posts about wishing to be able to live in peace, and about her sympathy and admiration for Yarden Bibas who only talks of his profound grief and not of revenge or hatred.

I occasionally reflect on the nature of Abraham as a patriarch whose influence has had such an effect on so much of the world. I wonder what he would have made of the battles between his descendants trying to kill each other.
Was his life a personal journey alongside his God or a battle for regional supremacy with weaponised religion?

Rather a lot of posters who decry Israel (or those who won't unconditionally denounce her), carelessly expose views of racism, nationalism and a 'send them all back where they came from' attitude that one generally associates with dark corners of the internet and right wing rallies.

This.

I think the hatred for Israel is entrenched in some. Its shown on mn.

All of this.

Yes, here is the disclaimer in full
”This is not an official publication of the House of Commons or the House of Lords. It has not been approved by either House or its committees. All-Party Parliamentary Groups are informal groups of Members of both Houses with a common interest in particular issues. The views expressed in this report are those of the group. This report was researched by the staff of the APPG UK-Israel.”
“The work of the 7 October Parliamentary Commission is ongoing. This report is the first publication aimed at preserving an accurate record of the events. Research and writing took place from January 2024 to January 2025. As official inquiries uncover new information, the Commission will continue to verify and update its work.”

Western governments clearly state they don’t negotiate with terrorists don’t they?

Most Western governments do negotiate with terrorists and have done since the 1980s despite saying they won’t negotiate with terrorists publicly.

In 2014, the US negotiated with the Taliban to release one POW in return for 5 Taliban held in Guantanamo Bay. The US also after pulling out from Afghanistan has sent weapons to the Taliban to fight ISIL, so not only negotiating with but also collaborating with terrorists.

During the Afghanistan war, by 2013 over $125m had been paid to Al-Qaeda in ransoms to free kidnapped European civilians/soldiers.

The UK negotiated with the IRA and Sinn Fein during the Troubles in the 1960s-1990s, leading to the GFA and legitimisation of the IRA from terrorists to political party.

Israel & the US negotiated with the PLO in the 1980s-1990s via mediators in Norway which resulted in the Oslo Accords.

Spain negotiated with the terror group ETA in the 1980s even after they’d bombed a shopping centre.

Must be the only country ever to have such global pressure to negotiate with terrorists on the world stage.

There was also massive global pressure on South Africa to negotiate with the ANC, leading to the end of Apartheid and the legitimisation of the ANC as a political party. It’s most similar in my opinion because both have multiple UN resolutions calling for the country suffering the insurgency to right injustices and negotiate with the terrorist leaders.

It could be either SA were under more global pressure than Israel because they caved into it, or SA were more susceptible to global pressure than Israel.

Or maybe it matters WHO is doing the pressuring and how powerful they are? In the case of Israel, I feel like the support of the US is outweighing pressure from the rest of the world, and conversely, the pressure from the US to continue the assault on the OPTs is currently outweighing the pressure from the rest of the world to stop. Interestingly, SA also didn’t cave into pressure until after the US withdrew its support for apartheid after MLK and the US civil rights movement.

Perhaps, the lens is not who has been under the most pressure, but which country seems to always be calling the shots.
https://www.carnegiecouncil.org/media/series/39/20101207-negotiating-with-evil-when-to-talk-to-terrorists

https://www.cfr.org/interview/case-talking-terrorists

This is a very difficult read and I suggest only do so if you can bear to read about the savagery of Hamas & other Gazans.

Thank you for posting the report OP. It is a very sobering read and some of the savagery is so appalling that I will need to read it in stages. I’m already crying after only 20pages.

There are people that should read this, but won't. The ones who say 'resistance', and, 'if you suppress people what do you expect', and other similar things. I've seen numerous comments in that vein on MN since this conflict started.. Terrorist apologists. They won't read it and won't comment. Their hatred of Israel drives them. Nothing to do with the conflict since it was there before. The ones in the marches wearing the parachute costumes, the hamas headbands, the ones ripping the hostage posters down, chanting in support of The Houthis to stop ships. Those should read it.

They've already dehumanised Israelis and often by extension Jewish people worldwide, it might not have the effect you'd hope.
On 7/10 Palestinians killed more people who would be their friends than their enemies led by the people who rule over them who are more their enemies than their friends.
A tragedy for peace craving Palestinians and Israelis alike.

Sadly true