"Israel accused of possible war crime over killing of West Bank boy"

[anotherlevel]

"In the early afternoon of 29 November last year, several Palestinian boys descended on to their street in the occupied West Bank, where they often played together.
Minutes later, two of them lay dead from gunshots fired by Israeli soldiers - Basil, 15, and eight-year-old Adam.
As part of an investigation into the conduct of Israel's security forces in the West Bank, which has been under military occupation for more than half a century, the BBC has pieced together what happened on the day the two boys were killed.
Mobile phone and CCTV footage, information about the movements of Israel's military, witness testimony and detailed investigation of the scene, including taking measurements, combine to reveal evidence suggesting serious human rights violations."

www.bbc.com/news/articles/cw07wgrwzywo

So Basil was holding an explosive device and Adam got caught in the crossfire?

I met a guy (let's call him "Tom") who was a sniper in Afghanistan. One day, he saw a boy of about 10 approaching with his hands behind his back. He kept calling out to say "Show us your hands" but the boy refused and continued to approach. So Tom shot him.

It turned out the boy had been holding an explosive device. Tom is still traumatised by this incident years later, but says he would have shot him anyway, because the alternative was risking his own life and that of all the soldiers around him.

War is really shit, beyond our worst nightmares.

The evidence we found has prompted Ben Saul, UN special rapporteur on human rights and counter-terrorism, to say the death of Adam appears to be a "war crime".
Another legal expert, Dr Lawrence Hill-Cawthorne, described the use of lethal force as “indiscriminate”.

From the article. War crimes should never be part of war and we shouldn't try to excuse them.

War crimes are unfortunately a part of daily life in the Israeli occupied West Bank, and Gaza, will the IDF be held accountable? No

War is really shit, beyond our worst nightmares.
Except the West Bank is not at war with Israel.
Adam got caught in the crossfire?
I suggest you look up the meaning of crossfire.
Personally, I find defending the murder of children appalling. I am glad that it is investigated as a war crime.
What happened to your friend has no relevance to this.

@ChickyBricky the situation your friend found himself in is a horrible one. I know several people who have similar stories, with a range of outcomes.

In this case, experts are concerned that this particular child's death may in fact be a war crime. The decisions your acquaintances and my acquaintances took in different cases don't impact upon that.

How did I know that even though this thread has so few posts, there’d already be people minimising and excusing Israeli brutalities?

Day in, day out…

Is there a war in the West Bank?
Stop minimising the atrocities and hold Israel accountable for their actions.

And the first comment at that 🙄

Yes, I've been a wanker calling it a war zone when in fact it's a conflict zone and there was no crossfire, only defensive fire (if you believe the IDF's side of the story, but they did take photographs to back up their claims).

I was only commenting because the thread title is so misleading. Basil was shot because he was holding an explosive device, and his friend Adam was shot in the head as he ran away? so it's Adam's death that is being examined as a possible war crime rather than accidental, is that right or have I misread it?

If you read my post it is in the piece I quote from the article. Quoting again because you seem to have missed it.

The evidence we found has prompted Ben Saul, UN special rapporteur on human rights and counter-terrorism, to say the death of Adam appears to be a "war crime".
Another legal expert, Dr Lawrence Hill-Cawthorne, described the use of lethal force as “indiscriminate”.

None of their death were accidental.
Read the article and it will answer your question.

@ChickyBricky The thread title is taken from the BBC headline.

I read the article and watched the video.

Honestly, from the title I expected the article to be about the IDF taking pot shots at a boy playing in the street.

The reason I queried it is that in these days of short attention spans and instant newsfeeds, people don't seem to bother actually reading things. So the headline is really, really important.

Shortly after 7 October, when quite a few threads on here were eagerly piling on to say how shit Israel and the IDF are, and how 7 October had been a long time coming, I remember a poster sharing a report about IDF soldiers raping a child at their base, with the clear implication that this was a Palestinian child. They didn't even bother reading the story themselves: it was about a teenage girl, the daughter of an IDF officer, who lived on a military base and had had sex with lots of the soldiers.

Just as that wasn't quite the story the headlines conveyed, so I think there is more to this one. Nine boys playing in the street, one (Basil) holding what seems to have been an explosive device, and (looking at the video) apparently getting ready to do something with it, while his friend across the street films it on his phone. Soldier opens fire, Basil is killed, soldier gets out and photographs the scene to capture evidence of what he was holding. Basil's friend Adam is also killed in the shooting. It is Adam's death that is being investigated as a possible war crime.

It's desperately sad, but it isn't quite the story suggested by the headline, and I don't think it is helpful to just share this sort of thing without any comment or analysis whatsoever.

I saw a reconstruction of the event about 2 weeks ago, and this absolutely needs to be looked at.

@ChickyBricky are you seriously minimising the rape of a teenage girl by bringing her past alleged actions into it? It shouldn't matter if someone wanted to have sex in the past or not, if they didn't on that occasion.

And that doesn't at all change that there are grounds to believe the killing of this child may constitute a war crime.

I'm not minimising anything, please read the article. She initiated the sex herself, telling the soldiers she was 16/17 years old, but in fact was underage, so that was statutory rape. But the person who posted it on here shared the headline "Israeli soldiers accused of raping 11-year-old" as though this was a Palestinian child. And when their error was pointed out, did not withdraw the post.

And yes, the killing of Adam might be a war crime. Where did I say it wasn't? I'm just saying that the headline is misleading.

From the article: She began to have sex with soldiers and workers at the base from the age of 11 until the age of 14.

I’m sorry but it doesn’t matter if she agreed or initiated. An adult sleeping with an 11 year old is more than “just” statutory rape.

Where did I say "just"?

That's rape. And I very much doubt anyone thought an 11 year old was of legal age to consent.

Just to clarify, I only mentioned her initiating the sex because Scirocco accused me of minimising the rape of a girl in the absence of consent, on the basis that she had an active sex life in the past. As though I'd think along those lines 🤦🏻‍♀️

It's clear what a moron you think I am, so I'll leave you to it.

Errrrrmmm, you don't need to explain that to me. But thank you

The rape of a child should always be investigated and condemned.

The killing of a child should also be investigated and condemned when wrongdoing is identified.

Where have I said it shouldn't? Or that she was at fault? Or that the IDF were not guilty?

I was making a point about headlines being misleading. If you can't see the point I was making, OK. I was trying to be as clear as possible, but perhaps it's just too difficult.

The article headline in this case - Adam's killing - is pretty clear. The article has a picture of him right below the headline too. Adam, eight, was shot in the head as he ran away from Israeli armoured vehicles.

Can I ask why you think the headline Israel accused of possible war crime over killing of West Bank boy" is misleading in the first place? They killed Adam, an 8 year old boy in the West Bank. Evidence, lawyers, specialists think it is a war crime and are accusing Israel of such? What is misleading about that? I think it is pretty clear.