TTC whilst extended bfing... Advice please...

[Elliemama]

I am struggling to conceive and think that maybe its because I am still breastfeeding DS - 20 months. Thing is he is not a big eater and relies heavily on milk.... I was hoping to follow his queues with food and just let him take his time. He does eat 3 meals a day plus snacks but he's very fussy and still wants lots of milk.
Anyone else had this prob? Shall I just accept that for now TTC is not an option and just give DS the time he seems to need to increase his food intake when he's ready?
We are proponents of attachment parenting so it is very important to me to allow DS to develop at his own rate and respond to his needs as he expresses them. He is a very happy, bright, physical child. He is also very independent when out and about but very clingy at home.

I'm not completely sure what I'd have done. My #4 child is now a similar age (he's 19m) and still feeding. I'm not TTC another though (DH won't let me!).

Looing at it rationally now I think I'd have kept going for a few more months. Like I said, 9m isn't that long to be ttc. However, I do remember that not getting pregnant got more and more upsetting for me (DH couldn't understand what all the fuss was about). It's hard to think rationally when you're in that position.

You've said that your ds is still feeding lots. I would be very wary taking that away in order to ttc as you've not got any guarantee that stopping will get you pg. If you're anything like me you'd then feel guilty for depriving him for no reason.

Have you thought about cutting feeds down rather than stopping? had you a plan on how long to feed for or were you planning to feed until he self-weaned?

Wow, this got nasty, didn't it . You OK Awen ? Hope OP not affected either.

FWIW it's not always bfeeding that affects fertility.. I'd still be feeding DS but I fell pg when he was 21 mths and consequently milk dried up . He still asks on occasion and am fully prepared that he may restart in a few weeks when DC2 is born.

OP have you tried things like tracking cycle / cervical mucus / ovulation charts / temping etc to give you an idea if you are actually ovulating ? Also isn't it mainly the nightime feeding that is responsible for the contraceptive element of bfing ?

just a practical suggestion - could you use ovulation indicators to find out if you are ovulating while BFing, and if you are not, you could then decide to reduce feeds if you feel that is the right thing to help your ovulation back. if you ARE ovulating, maybe you just need a bit more time and don't have to worry about BFing still.

ok, nope not really ok as I am now apparanlty a stalker bfeeding militant determined to make other people feel crap about their choices. Sorry OP for how this thread went.

ok, lets try and get it back on an even keel shall we

I have 5 dc's and we are ttc#6 I am also one ofthose people who have too many hormones and struggle to conceive whilst BF. Over the years I have conceived 3 times whilst BF, twice have miscarried.

So i cut down to once last Septmeber to reinstate periods to ttc, took a month and periods returned. Very early mc Dec. nothing since although getting pos opk's and regular periods although slightly shorter 26 days and not the old clockwork 28 days

Eventually gave in, I stopped feeding dd, (who was 2 in My btw)6 wks ago. Am now currently on 2ww for 2nd cycle. For us, when not BF, 2nd cycle is usually the one so am really really hoping this is it. Time is not on our side as I am 42 which is why we had to make the choice really.

Hope it works out for you em you make the choices you feel you have to at the time. Good luck

Awen, I didn't wade into the arguement earlier, but seeing your post from earlier this morning made me One poster might think that, but what you've said above seems perfectly reasonable to me. I don't think it sounded militant or negtaive, hope you're OK

Also OP, I think audreyraines suggestion of trying the ovulation kids and charting is a good plan. If you spend a few months trying to work that out you might find that either you get pg anyway or that the feeding tails off anyway so you don't need to make a decision! Whatever happens you'll have more info about what your cycle is doing, which can only help thinigs I think. Good luck

liaghen, fingers crossed for you too

Oh god, I was going to post that the secondcoming wasnt being unreasonable really until I read the comment about the 12 year old breastfeeding. Pathetic.

Thesecondcoming, it's not that straightforward, breastdfeeding a baby is such a strong bond and a complex relationship to end. It's not all black and white. I did eventually wean ds2 at 2 years in order to conceive and within 2 months I was pg. It was the right time for ds2 and for me. As for now DD is still only 18 months and I am only 28, she already has 2 brothers and I have time on my side. I can see how your perspective is different at 38 but the breastfeeding relationshiip is a complex one. It's not as easy as you might think to stop one relationship in the hope that a new baby may or may not happen. There is often a great deal of guilt associated with weaning a baby off the breast that is not ready to do so. I have known plenty of mothers who have successfully bf and conceived and gone on to tandem feed. We are all different.

Good luck to all ttc bf or not.xxxxxxxxx

If you are ovulating, and your luteal phase is long enough - then whether or not you breastfeed has bugger all to do with it.

It seems some people are rather over-eager to ascribe apparent infertility to breastfeeding - despite this being a position of ignorance.

I wonder if they suffer from a rather desperate desire to contrive a justification for stopping breastfeeding after whatever arbitrary point they start to feel it is (yawn) icky/ unnecessary / for the mother's benefit, blah blah blah...

You might as well stop erm, eating liver as it makes me feel queasy, and really why wouldn't you stop if you were fully committed to TTC. It's not that necessary, you know...

VLC do you have direct experience of ttc whilst BF?

As someone who was devastated at having to stop bf my dd i think your comment about people needing an excuse to stop very offensive. I have been trying almost a year now and never have this problem whilst not bf.

I am soo not ready to stop bf and even hoping that If i were to get pregnant quickly then I might be able to get it going again. I know my dd still misses it as she asks every day and it breaks my heart.

Oh crikey liahgen, I'm so sorry to have offended you. I think you've misunderstood me though. My post was aimed at people like thesecondcoming who want to persuade you to stop unneccesarily when breastfeeding is not actually the reason causing the infertility. By all means stop bf if you have reason to believe that it is somehow preventing you from conceiving - and as I stated in my earlier post bf can suppress ovulation, and it can shorten your luteal phase to the point where implantation will not happen properly. But I am open to learning facts about any further ways that bf affects fertility. I just haven't read any compelling medical reasons about how this might be the case.

I DO have personal experience of bf and TTC. BF suppressed my periods for nearly 18 months, then I had one m/c, and am now 4 months pregnant and still bf my two year old. I'm 38 and have totally unrelated fertility issues so I really felt the pressure to consider weaning before my dd was ready. But once I knew I was ovulating and my LP was fine, I didn't think ceasing bf would achieve anything other than the distress you describe in your post.

I'm sorry you felt you had to stop bf before you and your daughter were ready. Had you already established for sure that bf was the problem, or were you advised to do so by someone who perhaps doesn't understand the actual physiological impacts of bf on fertility? If the latter is the case it may not be too late to reassess the situation.

To clarify again - I certainly did NOT mean that you were needing an excuse to stop. I meant that other, unsupportive or well-meaning people, often healthcare professionals even, need very little excuse to blame all sorts of problems on breastfeeding that really don't belong there.

There was a support thread in the bf topic specifically for breastfeeding mothers who were trying to conceive. Many of us went on to successfully conceive and there was a lot of good advice there. If you feel this is still an option for you then let me know and I'll post a link. You deserve support whatever your choices.

Thanks carrot you've made me cry now, I'm nowhere near ready to stop and desperate to get pregnant as am very aware of advancing years. I'm sorry you had problems and i didn't mean to get huffy, just it's very emotional for me right now.

Doc told me to give up, and given my history thought there must be something in it. Should have listened to my OPK's a bit more maybe.

about your mc, it's horrible isn't it? Lovely that you have got throught it though.

Do you think as I'm on the 2ww it won't make a jot of difference if I just go back to feeding then?

oh liahgen, I wish I knew the answer to your question. Do you feel that the doctor who advised you is really knowledgeable on bf and fertility? Can he/she explain why he feels bf is affecting your fertility, and which part of the conception / implantation process is being affected and by what mechanism? Or do you feel it is a more general assumption that "bf affects fertility, but don't know how"

How long is it since you stopped bf? And are you aware of your luteal phase length? (I didn't even know what that was until another poster pointed it out to me.) I charted, and used opks so I knew I was ovulating and my lp was fine. But if I had been trying for a year, even if I knew that bf probably wasn't the the cause, I still might have made the same decision as you. It's that nagging 'just in case' doubt. (I'm not suggesting this was the case for you, BTW!)

I know my dd and I would have been devastated to curtail bf. Everything I've read on the subject suggests that, once pg, unless you are at high risk of m/c and have been advised to avoid sex, then there is no evidence that bf during pg will have any adverse effect at all.

So, if it was me, I might resume bf after a bfp. I have no medical expertise though, that's just what I might do in your position. Bear in mind I sometimes carry a 'lucky baby sock' to keep my pregnancy safe - despite having a full understanding that this is an illogical, nonsensical thing to do, and not actually believing that sockie has any magical powers. It's possible to know the facts and yet still employ hopeful comfort measures at the same time! In fact, I'll dig out the 'lucky' thread that 'helped' several of us conceive!

If this cycle isn't the lucky one for you, (and I really hope it is!) I imagine you will continue to question your decision and whether to resume bf again.

Why not start a new thread in bf topic as there are ladies with more knowledge and experience than me who can contribute.

I really wish you the very best of luck.

here's the magic thread

Do a quick post on it. Fingers crossed.

thank you carrot have posted on there.

No I don't think the doctor knew what he was talking about particularly, all he said was bf will affect fertility, having periods doesn't mean that you are fertile. He also said we had to be trying a year without bf for them to look further, even given my age. Surely that can't be right?

I know that sometimes I'm ovulating but don't check every month. Did this month and got smiley faces on days 11 and 12. Day 11 was first day I checked so may have been earlier. Had ov pains on day 12 too so that fits.

Tha gives me quite a reasonable luteal phase for this month doesn't it? 14 days to day 26.
Only prob is, i was away til day 11 so only had sex day 6, then day 11 onwards. Fingers crossed Iguess.

Thanks you've been very helpful.

What your doctor said isn't correct - you do not have to be trying for a year without bf for them to look into it; that's rubbish. I'm sure I've read that at our, er, advanced age they can look into it much sooner, after all, time is of the essence.

Your LP length sounds fine. I'm not clear whether you are using LH sticks to identify ovulation- it sounds like you are using a monitor, I'm not sure how these work, but I assume they identify the LH spike? My understanding is that LH spikes 24 to 48 hours before ovulation, however it is possible to have a LH surge but no ovulation, so taking basal body temps as well is the best way to confirm that ovulation definitely happened too - a thermal shift will be seen if ovulation truly happened. (sorry if you know all this)

However ov pains are also helpful - I used to get these before my first pg but didn't always feel them whilst bf.

cervical fluid also a good indicator tho' bf can muck around with this too! But EWCM always a good sign to get busy...

Assuming you ovulated a day or so after your LH surge on day 11/12, I'd say your timing was good!

Have you been to the fertilityfriend website? I found this hugely useful. You can look at the charts of women who conceived whilst bf and whilst not too.

Thank you for all this advice, some I don't know.

Yes the CB monitor uses the same technique, ie identifies the surge 24-48 hrs before it says so hopefully we'll be ok.

I didn't know you can get a surge and no ov, that's interesting. Looks like i'm gonna have to do the temp thing then. Do I need a special thermometer?

Have been on FF but can't make head nor tail of it tbh.

I do get the mucous so really all the signs are quite good on the whole.

When is your baby due? Which number will it be?

I know that TSC but doctors don't have to specialise in all subjects do they? He was my GP not a fertility referral or anything.

I dunno, just feel so sad about it all. Took me 9 yrs to get my dc1, and haven't got that time this time around.

Thanks for your input though.

thanks, and good luck to you too.

thesecondcoming, I don't know what you said or why it was deleted, but you have persisted in assuming that breastfeeding always affects fertility negatively and therefore one MUST reduce or cease bf in order to conceive. This is a position of ignorance, and it is important to correct this. Hopefully you can now understand that actually, in many situations ceasing breastfeeding can actually be completely sad and distressing and have no impact on conception at all. It's really ill-advised to suggest a blanket 'one size fits all' approach if you aren't aware of the specific problem or solution.

It does suggest a bit of an agenda in scapegoating breastfeeding as the problem.

It's maybe a little like the problem of doctors overprescribing antibiotics. Just because that is the right solution for specific circumstances, does not mean that they will be helpful for everybody. In fact prescribing them where they are unneccessary does much more harm than good.