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Original poster

Will they let me continue with IVF if I own up?

32 replies

flipflop256 · 15/07/2021 19:33

Hi,
I'm 40 and my partner and I have been TTC for 13 months. We've just found out today that we've had a second miscarriage (the first happened at 7 weeks and this one at just 6 weeks). We are devastated and wondering what to do next. I would like to talk to my GP but we are part way through the NHS IVF wait list and a condition for treatment was never having been pregnant before. I want to have an honest discussion with the NHS about what our best options are now but I don't want to scupper our chances of getting IVF.

All our fertility tests have come back really positive (high egg count, good semen readings, no issues revealed on ultrasound etc) and we managed to get pregnant the second time just three months after the first time.

I wonder if anyone knows what the medical advice would be for us now. Would IVF weed out the poor eggs from the high quality ones and therefore be our best option anyway? Do they administer IVF differently if you've previously managed to get pregnant? (Eg I've read that the drugs they give you can be dangerous and maybe I don't need them if I don't have a problem impregnating ?) The fact that I had both miscarriages at a very similar time makes me think there could be another issue at play?

Thankyou so much for any advice

OP posts:
Badoukas · 15/07/2021 19:55

I think that when it comes to health you need to give all the information and be totally truthful. In return you will get safe and appropriate treatment. Good luck x

Lockdownbear · 15/07/2021 20:01

Truthfully I think I'd say nothing.
They may have a policy of making you wait 3 months before any fertility treatments after MC, for MH reasons.

The chances are your MC are due to poor quality eggs but one thing IVF will do is pick out the best embryos you produce.

Fingers crossed that you manage to hit it lucky and not need the IVF

MangoM · 15/07/2021 20:14

As PP said, it's best to be honest to help them make the right decisions for you.

I get where you're coming from though. You worry they'll say you longer need their help. But don't forget that a successful pregnancy isn't just about getting pregnant in the first place, it's about the pregnancy progressing through all the way.

Similar happened to me... started fertility investigations, then got pregnant naturally, miscarried at 6 weeks, and then pregnant again after 6 months and miscarried again at 8 weeks. I told them what had happened and they still scheduled us in for IVF despite the two previous pregnancies but in the meantime booked me in for additional scans to see if they could find any underlying cause for why it happened twice. I might be wrong but my understanding was that in a non ivf setting they wouldn't do the extra scans until you've had three, but in this scenario they want to get a much information as possible to ensure the best ivf.

Really hope it works out for you. Good luck x

DontBiteTheBoobThatFeedsYou · 15/07/2021 20:50

I guess the thing is, you don't have an issue getting pregnant. You may (or may not) have an issue staying pregnant.

If the latter is the case then IVF would be a waste of resources, in theory, if there was a cause for miscarriages.

Obviously I'm saying this in very broad terms and every individual is very different.

I knew someone who had 8 miscarriages, had IVF 3 times and miscarried those until they found out what was causing the miscarriages.

Once the diagnosis was clear, they did IVF, treated the mother, not totally sure how but I know regular blood transfusions were involved. And it resulted in term, well baby.

DontBiteTheBoobThatFeedsYou · 15/07/2021 20:52

However, I'm still not sure whether I would be honest about it. 🤔

elliejjtiny · 15/07/2021 21:03

You need to be honest to get the right treatment for you. Considering your age, getting pregnant twice in one year would indicate that your fertility is really good. I had a very similar experience, although I was a lot younger (22) and at the time it felt like we had been trying for so so long but it wasn't really. I appreciate it's a lot different when you are older and have less time to ttc.

theotherfossilsister · 15/07/2021 21:04

I'm Scotland (in Edinburgh anyway) they still do IVF after miscarriage. I had no idea this wasn't the same elsewhere. That said the miscarriage was about a year ago so maybe that is a factor.

I honestly think it is best to be honest however hard and however much you're hurting, and I know it's hell, I really do

Original poster
flipflop256 · 15/07/2021 21:07

Thankyou everyone - I really appreciate the replies which are so helpful

One of the things I've been struggling to even work out is whether you're eligible for ivf if you've previously been pregnant. Re-reading the policy again from my local ccg here I find it so frustratingly unclear

IVF treatment can be offered to women with unexplained infertility who have not conceived after 2 years (this can include up to 1 year before their fertility investigations) of regular unprotected sexual intercourse (or 12 months for women aged 36 and over).

OP posts:
Original poster
flipflop256 · 15/07/2021 21:12

Does this mean I'm eligible or not?

My concern is that if I tell the nhs now they will send me down the recurrent miscarriage route which will result in more tests, delays etc and potentially being sent to the back of the ivf queue. If I go private now, I could do the other tests quickly and still stick with the nhs ivf timeline. I've got no idea how much these tests would cost though.

OP posts:
plixy · 15/07/2021 21:20

How many rounds on ivf do you get on the nhs? I assume you can't just keep trying if it's not successful?
If you do have a reason for the miscarriages and it isn't resolved first you could be wasting the chances of IVF that you do get.

CovidCorvid · 15/07/2021 21:24

I’m not sure if it would mean you were eligible or not but after a third miscarriage you’d normally be sent down the recurrent miscarriage investigation route….a common reason is you having undiagnosed clotting issues. Could you pay privately for this to make sure that’s not the problem? Not tell your gp for now?

NoCauseRebel · 15/07/2021 21:27

If your fertility tests have come back positive and you’ve had 2 pregnancies already and only been TTC for 13 months, can I ask why you’re on the waiting list for IVF?

As you’ve not been TTC for 2 years yet and if the literature has this as a stipulation, then no you wouldn’t yet be eligible.

But you’ve conceived twice in less than a year, and although you have miscarried those pregnancies, this would point to you not having any reason for needing to have IVF?

IVF is a brutal process and there are no guarantees.

Assuming there isn’t a fertility problem I’ve missed here, I would ditch the idea of IVF for now and keep TTC and maybe look more into seeing if there’s a reason you’ve miscarried twice in quick succession.

There may actually not be a reason. But if there is then IVF isn’t going to minimise that chance.

NoCauseRebel · 15/07/2021 21:32

Also, I thought most CCG’s didn’t fund IVF on the NHS over 35 because the success rate is so low.

Either way, you will be limited to the number of cycles you’re entitled to (it ranges between 1 and 3 depending on where you live,) so if there is a reason why you’re miscarrying then you will be using IVF cycles and going through the stress, the drugs, the egg harvesting, with not only a limited success rate, but also the chance of MC if you are successful.

Honestly I would ditch IVF for now.

MrsFin · 15/07/2021 21:33

TBH, you've only been TTC for 13 months, and have had two pregnancies in that time.

Loads of people TTC for longer than that, and loads of people have more than one miscarriage.

I'm not sure you'd be high priority just yet at the fertility clinic, nor for miscarriage investigations.

Original poster
flipflop256 · 15/07/2021 21:41

Thanks again all! I think I will talk to someone privately about possible tests and costs. Depending on how much these are I may get them done privately. I absolutely think it makes sense to not do ivf now without doing other investigations first. I think I've probably misunderstood the guidelines and that I am eligible for ivf despite previously having got pregnant so I was probably getting my knickers in a twist over nothing on that one

Thankyou again all. This is my first post on Mumsnet and what a wonder it's been for useful insight and positivity Smile

OP posts:
elsaesmeralda · 15/07/2021 22:14

Firstly I'm Really sorry about your miscarriages.
I too would think you're not eligible going by that statement you posted, I would take it as you've been trying over two years without a hint of pregnancy. As others have pointed out you have managed to get pregnant twice, but sadly miscarried.
I myself would be speaking to the gp and possible asking if any investigations into this could be done ? You said yourself your tests all came back normal fertility wise so I agree it would seem a little pointless at the moment doing ivf if you could naturally conceive and hopefully carry to term.
I am going through ivf atm, have secondary infertility and been trying for 4 years. It is brutal on your mind and body and not to be taken lightly

MyriadeOfThings · 15/07/2021 22:31

I’m pretty sure that the rule is no CHILDREN, not no pregnancy.
Many women will have conceived naturally but miscarried early on.

At least that’s how it is at my local hospital. But you might want to double check with yours.

MyriadeOfThings · 15/07/2021 22:35

And btw, there are many reasons why one couple might need IVF. It’s not. JUST about never managing to get pregnant.

Eg some eggs might be of poorer quality leading to miscarriage. IVF can help select the best ones..

It would be better if the clinic knows because they will adjust treatmenst accordingly.
Eg higher levels of progesterone after transfer.

goddessofmischief · 15/07/2021 22:35

I'm so sorry for your losses Thanks
I was just starting to be investigated for not conceiving when I fell pregnant. I was 21. I had being trying for two years. Yes, I know that's very young. However it's the only successful pregnancy I've ever had. Miscarriages ever since and I've given up (many years later, single parent to the one I have and running out of time fertility wise and no partner). Weigh up your options and go for what's best for you. I always wanted more children but it didn't work out, DD has been the absolute light of my life.

MyriadeOfThings · 15/07/2021 22:36

Also the tests you could do will be done by the ivf clinic.
Because it’s a fertility clinic rather than just ivf iyswim

Lockdownbear · 15/07/2021 22:50

Actually I'd stick with the NHS for the time being. 13months is no time really and their is probably a good chance you'll fall naturally while on the waiting list.

But beware the waiting list can be a long time.

fairypangolin · 15/07/2021 23:10

I am very sorry to hear of your miscarriages. But like others have said, to have fallen pregnant twice within 13 months of TTC is great given that you are 40. My understanding is also that the condition is no previous children, not no previous pregnancies.

I had IVF for my second at age 39 because we had been TTC for 18 months with not a sign of a pregnancy, even though all our test results were very good. We were lucky and had a healthy baby the first time. But it is a very tough thing to put your body and mind through, especially given that the success rates are not hugely better than conceiving naturally. As you say, it may be that you have difficulty keeping a pregnancy, in which case IVF may not really be much help. Although they do select the 'best quality' embryos, the criteria are quite rudimentary (eg are the cells dividing symmetrically and at a reasonable interval) and I doubt they can select for 'staying power'. One thing that may be helpful for you though is that post-embryo transfer you are given progesterone supplements which reduce the risk of miscarriage. You may be able to get those without going through IVF though if you have a history of recurring miscarriage.

IVF is quite hard on your body and there is a risk of your ovaries being overstimulated, which can be deadly in rare cases. The NHS clinics are very careful to avoid that happening though. Mentally I found it torture (although not conceiving when TTC is always hard) and the day we went to the clinic to find out if it had worked was hands down the most stressful day of my life.

In terms of tests I would just be a bit cautious about advice from a private clinic. there are a lot of tests out there that don't actually tell very much and cost a lot. Be sure to do your research online before agreeing to any tests or treatment.

Also since you're new to MN I highly recommend joining a TTC or IVF group on this site. I joined one at the start of my IVF cycle and we are STILL friends many years later. It was an absolute godsend to me to message with other women going through the same thing at the same time as these can otherwise be very lonely experiences and no one else in your life is as obsessed with the process as you will be.

Good luck! :-)

TheDaydreamBelievers · 15/07/2021 23:45

Like others, I'm a wee bit confused about how you got on the ivf waitlist in the 1st place! In my healthboard it's 2 years without conceiving. You have conceived twice in 13mo without ivf. You do need to be honest with them so they can investigate the reasons for mc. At 40, it could just be bad luck and the next one will be fine. However, depending on the criteria for being on the list, you might risk them dropping you off it and putting you on the miscarriage investigations lists instead.

Lockdownbear · 15/07/2021 23:52

The advice is to seek help after 6mths if your over 35 so my guess is the GP has rightly referred her to the fertility unit.

Wombatstew · 16/07/2021 06:00

Hello
Sorry for your losses Flowers
At 40 I wouldn’t waste any more time waiting for NHS IVF (but keep on the waiting list) and start investing if there are any reasons for your miscarriages privately through a clinic. Some clinics have a good reputation for success with harder to treat cases, I am not suggesting that yours is but If I was paying I would want to go through one with the most experience in this area just in case it turned out that way. I also suggest joining Fertility Friends forum there is a wealth of info on the site which helped me greatly when I was ttc. Best of luck.