BBT up before ovulation?

[xtinak]

I'm not actually trying to conceive at the moment, just tracking my cycles using an Ava.

Like all things with women's health, there seems to be a bit of a dearth of proper research and data about how our bodies work. I have been unsuccessfully trying to find out if this is a normal variation on BBT patterns. Maybe the info is there and I'm just misunderstanding what I'm reading!

My BBT always appears to rise about 6 days before I ovulate, so as I enter the fertile window. This is a big rise of. 5 to 1 C roughly. After ovulation it then goes up further, but a smaller rise of more like 0.1C.

Sources such as this flo.health/getting-pregnant/trying-to-conceive/tracking-ovulation/basal-body-temperature suggest that there should only be a BBT rise after ovulation.

I do think I'm ovulating - the same thing happened in the cycle I conceived my DD - a rise before ovulation.

Can anyone help me understand what may be going on? Or is this actually normal?

Would just be really interested to know if anyone else ever seen similar in their chart, or not?

Are you sure you aren't ovulating 6 days before you think you are? Are you using Opks?

Your temp normally goes up after ovulation due to the release of progesterone xx

That is one possible explanation! Would mean I ovulate roughly cd9 in a 33 day cycle. I'm not using OPKs. I'm going completely by the Ava algorithm which is also using pulse, heart rate variability and breathing rate to make its calculation and it is consistently deciding to place ovulation 6 days after the first temperature rise. It could be wrong.

Ovulating on day 9 wouldn't be massively unusual x

Ovulating on day 9 isn't unusual but having a 33 day cycle and ovulating on day 9 is as that means you have a 24 day luteal phase which is uncommon!

Hm something doesn't add up. You can't ovulate on cd9 and then have a 24 day LP - the maximum is 17 days. But likewise a temp shift before ovulation isn't a thing either.

How long have you been using your ava for? From memory it can take up to three months before it gets the algorithm right for you?

Do you have any charts you could show us maybe?

I have attached my current chart. It has actually reduced my cycle length to 29 days this month, I think as a result of a very reduced cycle last month due to taking the MAP (which probably messed up the data somewhat - but my temp responded consistent with the MAP with a 2 day rise then a fall accompanied by AF).

You are right that I don't have a lot of data yet. After using it I got pregnant in month 2 and didn't get my cycle back until DD was about 18 months, so not had a chance yet. In that time they've brought out a new and improved version of the device!

However, the pattern with what looks like a temp shift before ovulation - unless I'm seeing things - has been consistent.

On the chart I attach, for context the lowest temp here is 34.71 since which time it has risen daily to today's peak of 35.89. It was 35.56 at the start of the estimated fertile window (green shaded area).

Also, going into this cycle the algorithm estimated that ovulation would be later, but it recalibrated following shifts in the data - following the temp shift - to bring it forward.

I really appreciate everyone's thoughts and taking the time to reply!

Could I be ovulating twice?

@xtinak no that's not really a thing. Tbh I'd be tempted to use an oral thermometer alongside your ava for a cycle just to double check the ava is actually doing this properly.

I may do that. Can't think what else to try. I tend to trust the readings though, because the pattern is the same. There is also clear drop when I get AF. When I got pregnant there was a clear shift towards and even higher temp in the third phase. The estimated ovulation that month checked out completely with scan dates assuming average implantation at 9DPO. Admittedly though this isn't really a high enough quantity of data to draw firm conclusions. But everything else seems to check out except this mystery rise!

Maybe you can do that to ease your mind or just go ahead with ava and just ignore that initial rise lol?

@xtinak mine went up before ovulation this month! Then back down before ovulation then up again! X

Thanks Juno. I will try to take my temp separately and see what happens.

Against the explicit advice of Ava, I'm sort of using it as one means to avoid pregnancy at the moment so it would be good to have confidence in the readings! I've had quite terrible experiences health wise with hormonal contraception and the copper coil so I feel my options are now limited. But also I don't want to think that it might be indicative of a fertility problem as I do likely plan to have another child when the time is right.

I also just wonder - it seems like some of the things we state as fact about women's fertility are actually based on a small number of studies. This seems to apply to things like variation in fertility rates by age and average implanation timescales and I'm sure more. So I wonder if rules about temperature could be amongst this. Carrying out better research into women's fertility is one of Ava's states aims after all. Who knows!

@AnxiousAnnie86 very interesting! Thanks for sharing. And like mine your pulse goes down while your breathing seems more constant during that window, and your HRV has a peak right before!

@xtinak yep!!! This is only my third month (2nd full) so it's hard to see a pattern, I had a slight dip today 7dpo.... not had that before x

Fingers crossed for you!!

Oh it's taking your skin temp of course, nasal body temp can't be taken via the skin, needs to be from inside the mouth as soon as you wake up so actually no idea what your skin temp does before ovulation x

Basal not nasal, skin temp is not a measure of your basal body temp as that's your core temp that you can only measure from working your body, the easiest is in the mouth x

@sarahc336 It's meant to be aproxy for bbt and it should follow the same pattern support.avawomen.com/en/support/solutions/articles/15000014405-what-is-the-difference-between-skin-temp-vs-oral-temp-vs-bbt-

Also, because it's taking an average across the night, I guess you could argue that Ava would be expected to produce better quality data since it's difficult to get the exact circumstances of each bbt measurement the same when you take it manually. This is actually why I got tje Ava originally - I was struggling with the oral temps because of different wake up times!