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Conception

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Original poster

Disgusted with IVF Charging.

184 replies

POP2005 · 07/01/2004 11:07

My wife and I have been trying for a baby for around 3 years, at the moment she is taking Clomid to assist with Ovulation.

We are hopeful that the Clomid will be a sucsess, but we have been exploring all avenues. I stumbled across the HFEA website that lists all assisted conception units in the UK and I was shocked to see the NHS charging first time patients for IVF treatments.

Searching for some kind of campaign on the net was fruitless but through search engines I found many discussions on the matter and I was shocked to see the amount of hatred people have been spouting on various discussion boards about the cost of providing free IVF on the NHS for childless couples, they estimate the cost at £400m.

£1,500 seems to be the average cost (not including drugs) and for a childless couple, intially, this is a small price to pay as we are desperate to be parents but where does it stop?

I have even seen adverts from loan shaks offering IVF loans to desperate couples.

We could end up in extreme debt and still have no baby at the end of it.

Yet if I was to drink myself into oblivion and screw up my liver the treatment and operation would be free, hell, if I decided to have my gender "reassigned" I could even get a free sex-swap op on the NHS, smokers are offered free cessation assistance on the NHS and we all know that cancer treatments for smokers are also free.

Infertility in most cases is not self inflicted yet couples are forced into debt to pay for treatments - people who have made themselves ill through stupidity are treated free.

The estimated £400m cost is a small price for the goverment as IVF children grow up to be taxpayers.

Its time to End the postcode lottery now.

OP posts:
Dadslib · 07/01/2004 12:46

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FairyMum · 07/01/2004 12:47

BTW, smokers also inflict their disgusting habits on others and causes illnesses, asthma (you name it) from secondary smokers. Just had to say that in reply to some of the smokers here.
I am ex-smoker myself, but one of the reason I stopped was because would have felt so damn stupid turning up wanting treatment for self-inflicted illness!

Twinkie · 07/01/2004 12:51

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FairyMum · 07/01/2004 12:54

Twinkie, you can't really compare driving a car to smoking for God sake! At least I had the sense to realise I was stupid when I smoked.......

Twinkie · 07/01/2004 12:55

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Dadslib · 07/01/2004 12:58

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Gomez · 07/01/2004 12:58

Fairymum - I said it was harsh in my original post and so can't disagree with you. It is how I feel I am afraid. I would agree that society as a whole can afford to contribute more money but I would rather this was used to actually get the NHS (and I will limit it to the NHS never mind education etc.) into a better position.

The original aims of the NHS have been so expanded over the years and we all have such high expectations of what it should deliver that something needs to give.

As to infertility leading to depression, I am not sure how to comment on this. Without a doubt this can happen - does that then mean that IVF should then be viewed as a preventative treatment? I am unsure how this alters my basic opinion. There is not enough money to go around -choices need to be made. The consequences of insufficient funds to treat other illness/injury may be fatal. Sorry being harsh again.

And finally - the original poster stated that he and his partner wanted a baby, not a child. There is a difference and childlessness can be solved without IVF.

FairyMum · 07/01/2004 12:59

Twinkie, I can't take your comments seriously. Let's not hijack POP2005's thread and leave it at that. I really think you should stop smoking though ,)

Tissy · 07/01/2004 13:02

I doubt if car-driving has been shown to be the sole cause of asthma in children, but smoking has been shown to be the major cause of lung cancer. There are a very small number of "atypical" lung cancers that crop up in non-smokers, but the vast majority are in smokers and caused by smoking.And that is not to mention the heart attacks, strokes, peripheral vascular disease, blindness, dementia....

The point is that smoking has absolutely no advantages to the smoker whatsoever. It is purely harmful. The sensation of relaxation is only because of the addiction. I could take my dd to nursery in a horse and trap, then drive it the 15 miles to work, but it wouldn't be practical! There is nothing "practical" about smoking.

Northerner · 07/01/2004 13:05

I happen to agree with Gomez. It does sound harsh, and as a parent I can only imagine the heartache caused by infertility, but there are other treatments that have to take priority IMO. It would be barbaric to deny somone treatmant for a 'self inflicted' ilness. Where would we draw the line at what was self inflicted and what wasn't?

Infertility is tragic, and in ideal world treatment should be free. But then in an ideal world no one would be infertile.

Twinkie · 07/01/2004 13:05

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CountessDracula · 07/01/2004 13:06

Yes yes yes but you don't get addicted to a car do you? The whole point of tabs is that you get hooked when you are young and stupid and then it can be very hard to give up.

Do you all think that alcoholics should not be treated either. Addiction is an illness too you know?

Not that I advocate smoking or drinking heavily.

Twinkie · 07/01/2004 13:09

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CountessDracula · 07/01/2004 13:10

AND they don't pay tax on food!!

Twinkie · 07/01/2004 13:13

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CountessDracula · 07/01/2004 13:14

What about people in car accidents? It's their choice to go shooting about in dangerous vehicles, let them bleed on the side of the road.

This whole thing is ridiculous. It's obvious that if you are ill you should get treatment, regardless of how it is caused.

Re the IVF, the problem here and with lots of other things is that the NHS was not designed to deal with many of the sophisticated and expensive drugs and treatments available today. It was put in place to provide basic healthcare for all. If we want it to fund everything the we all have to pay for it. They should raise NI or create a better private healthcare system. I know, 2 tier, unfair, etc but what else can you do? There is not unlimited money.

Alternatively smash drug company cartels and make drugs cheaper. Then no money will go into research (so drug companies say) so no new cures will arrive and problem will resolve as the NHS will then not have to fork out for these new expensive drugs and therapies.

CountessDracula · 07/01/2004 13:15

Twinkie that's what I was saying durrrrrr! I mean that you have a choice with a car, to use or not to use (if you live somewhere with access to good public transport). Not so easy with cigarettes and alcohol

Northerner · 07/01/2004 13:16

So should formula 1 drivers who have an accident whilst competing (and anyone else who partakes in dangerous sports)be denied treatment, a woman needing intervention in child birth (pregnancy is self inflicted afterall) These are stupid argumemnts I know, but so is the 'IVF is more important than treating these people who harm themselves deliberatley'

flamingo · 07/01/2004 13:22

Having a child is a hugely expensive business, both in money and commitment, however it's been conceived. I know this won't be a popular thing to say, but £1500 is a bit of a drop in the ocean really. If you want a kid, you should be prepared to pay.

It's definitely not fair that some people have to pay and some don't though - I agree it should be consistent.

FairyMum · 07/01/2004 13:30

Just to clarify that I haven't said we shouldn't treat lung-cancer. I think we can afford it all. I think a lot more money should go into the NHS, but managed better! I would gladly pay more tax if that's what's needed. Both to treat lung cancer and to help childless couples conceive.
As a mother I would do anything for others to experience the same joy as myself!

Twinkie · 07/01/2004 13:33

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Dadslib · 07/01/2004 13:39

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CountessDracula · 07/01/2004 13:39

Maybe just kill anyone who is a bit unhappy. If they don't appreciate their lives then give them to someone else.

Man with bolt gun will be at my door shortly I fear.

CountessDracula · 07/01/2004 13:40

Which bit DL?

Glad to hear you and your DW agree on some things!!

Twinkie · 07/01/2004 13:42

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