Lots of CM after ovulation - I am confused! Help!

[userpin11]

Hi all,

Been TTC #1 for 14 months and this week had the first appointment with the infertility clinic. Good news is all seems fine with both of us after a huge amount of worry - according to the specialist at least!

I have been charting for a year and through that thought I had identified a luteal phase (LP) defect (i.e. second half of the cycle 8-12 days only, when it should be 14).

The specialist said it would be highly abnormal to have a short LP, that charting is not a reliable way to establish ovulation, and that I should chuck the chart and thermometre in the bin and assume I have a 14 day LP!

If that's true it would mean I ovulate much earlier than I thought (i.e. day 10 or 11). I would be able to accept this (and in fact it would explain why we haven't had any success) but my cervical mucus is abundant and stretchy until at least day 16, so I had always assumed I ov'ed around then as everything I've read says it dries up as soon as ovulation has taken place.

I am now seriously confused about my most fertile time!! Any one else have a lot of CM days after ovulation, or been given the same advice?!

Thanks!!!!

Really?! How confusing??!! I always thought charting was the best way to confirm if and when you are ovulating. Also weird that he said it would be highly unlikely to have a LP less than 14 days

Don't know I'm afraid, did he have any tips then to pinpoint ovulation, if charting not reliable (i.e. are OPKs considered reliable?)

No! He said to stop charting, stop OPKing and just relax and have a lot of sex from about day 10 onwards as my cycles vary from about 25 - 30 days. Easier said than done when you've been trying for over a year (and nearly broken DH with the amount of nooky required to cover that amount of days in any given month) !

There seems a big debate as to whether there is such a thing as a LP defect and it seems that gynaes just shut down at the first mention of it, esp if you've established it through charting (which according to NICE is not reliable, I now know). I get quite a bit of spotting/bleeding throughout my cycle (apols if TMI) so was pretty certain there was a problem. He says not! I want to be reassured, but somehow it all sounds too 'textbook' to just assume a 14 day LP and get on with it, when my fertile signs say otherwise - indeed!

What tests have you had? What investigation have they done into the spotting/bleeding during your cycle? What about the variation in lengths of your cycles?

There is a lot of controversy over whether there is such a thing as a lpd but ovulation happens on day 14 in an average cycle. Of course people have different cycles fgs. My luteal phase is around 10 or 11 days and I have had no problems with conception. Anything shorter than 10 is on the shorter side but not necessarily a bar to conception for all women.

I'd be wanting some more questions answered tbh.

Hi showaddywaddy. First, thanks for reassurance regarding conception! Great to hear you have had no probs. How did you establish the length of your LP?

I have had the full range of hormone and blood tests (FSH, LH, Estrogen, Progesterone, Thyroid, etc.) and transvag scan for polyps/fybroids (several in fact) - all came back totally normal. Only thing left is an HSG to check my tubes are open.

This would be about the third opinion I've had on the bleeding (before TTC I saw a couple of gynaes as it's been a problem for more that ten years). All have said they don't know why it's happening but it's nothing to worry about! Apparently cycle length variation is normal - I was told it's the first half not the second that varies in length. Fertilty specialist said the bleeding is related to the changes in hormones throughout the month (?) but no detail as to what that means and why. I do get frustrated as I feel the answers are always so vague and dismissive...

Cycle length variation is normal. And yes generally the luteal phase is pretty much fixed. I don't know about how much variation is considered acceptable but my GP said a couple of days was normal. Maybe 5 days variation is normal for you. I'm no expert at all.

Some women do bleed mid cycle and for hormonal reasons throughout their cycle but I'd want all other reasons ruling out first. Transvaginal scans and hormone/blood test are useful but don't pick up everything. I think Attila is the poster you want. I have a friend whose fertility issues didn't show up until she had a laparoscopy for example.

I chart to prevent conception! I can feel ovulation too, plus I get a lot of other very clear signs.

The other thing to always bear in mind that it taking 1-2yrs is often perfectly normal. But I'd be chasing them to make sure everything is well anyway.

SR,

Has your man been tested to date?. If not he should be tested as well and asap to determine whether there are any male factor problems.

A "normal" cycle is a cycle length of between 21 and 35 days or with less than 4 days of variation from month to month.

Spotting between periods should always be investigated further to ascertain the cause. Its appalling actually that they haven't been able to tell you why you're spotting like this.

BTW they did not see the congenital polyp on any of my many internal ultrasound scans; it was only when they performed a HSG was that seen. It was removed surgically.

Thanks Showaddywaddy. Atila are you out there?!

Yes, I went in there ready to demand a laparoscopy but the specialist advised against it at this point as he felt it wasn't indicated and was too invasive to be justified.

Basically he said try for another six months and if I'm still not pregnant he'll take it further. He was very dismissive about the chances of a LP defect or the bleeding causing a fertility issue (he's the head of a major fertility clinic so I just have to hope he knows what he's talking about ) I have had two chemical pregnancies which he reckoned was a good sign. I was worrying the bleeding had caused them or indicated low progesterone (I had bleeding both times) but again, he said not.

Just keeping everything crossed that he's right and it'll just happen!!!!

Hi Atila! Yes, I've always thought it was appalling that no reason has ever been found for the bleeding and it has caused me massive upset over the years. After the third time of getting the same answer from a different gynae (don't know why, don't worry about it) I'm minded to listen and stop worrying about it...

With your experience I'm hoping the HSG (having that next month) might pick up something that's been missed before.

DH has been tested, count and motility really good, morphology looked a bit dodgy according the the WHO criteria but the fertility specialist reckoned his results were perfectly fine so told us to stop worrying.