Christmas with PIL’s big dog

[Cariah]

Earlier this year PIL got a husky dog from a rescue centre. It has old injuries and obviously suffered past trauma. A few times it has dragged the lead out of FIL’s hand and run off after cats. It jumps up on visitors and tries to hump. They haven’t trained it at all. It hasn’t bitten anyone... yet.

It hasn’t been an issue because we haven’t visited due to Covid. DH has popped in by himself a few times but DC have never been. But we’re invited on Christmas Day. I’m concerned the dog may be a risk to my DC aged 3 and 5. A big dog needs to be impeccably trained otherwise it’s a risk. We already know it jumps up and chases small animals. I’m worried if DC are running around and squealing it might bite.

It’s harder because BIL has DC the same age and isn’t bothered at all, he’s been to visit with his DC already and I’ve seen photos of his DC climbing all over the dog. So how can we say we’re concerned when BIL clearly isn’t? We already know that PIL will be massively offended if we tell the truth that we don’t trust their dog.

What would you do? DH reckons we should just say DC are afraid of big dogs and ask if their dog can stay in the bedroom during our visit on Christmas Day. Our DC are little people with faces at dog height, the dog only has to bite once and DC is disfigured. We think BIL is nuts for letting his DC climb on it.

I’d have a talk with them as explain your concerns what does ur partner say? if you decide to go maybe take a stair gate with you so the dog can be separated from the family and thirdly tell your children that they are not allowed to jump on or around the dog as he can get scared easily.
All the noise/excitement children/untrained dog can be a terrible mix.

I have 2 malamutes and always put them in a kennels over Christmas.

They get lots of walks and treats but best of all they're not being made anxious in their own home by strange kids that they've never met or have no connection to climbing all over them or getting in their face.

I've been in the middle of dogs when they've started fighting because they're scared by something, and thankfully as an adult came away with minimal scratches but it was very scary and if I'd have been smaller it could have been perilous.

I would not be comfortable letting my child around someone else's dog, trained or untrained, in a close contact environment where every one is too busy to watch out for them.

why do you think it's vicious?
It’s untrained and has chased cats and jumped on people. And it’s an unknown quantity because they have no idea about its history.

I just wouldn’t go
I wish that was an option. Last year we couldn’t go because of Covid and MIL took a hissy fit and hadn’t spoken to me since. We’re trying to think of a way to keep DC away from the dog without blatantly saying that’s what we’re doing. Otherwise PIL will be offended and will go in the huff again.

@Cariah

Earlier this year PIL got a husky dog from a rescue centre. It has old injuries and obviously suffered past trauma. A few times it has dragged the lead out of FIL’s hand and run off after cats. It jumps up on visitors and tries to hump. They haven’t trained it at all. It hasn’t bitten anyone... yet.

It hasn’t been an issue because we haven’t visited due to Covid. DH has popped in by himself a few times but DC have never been. But we’re invited on Christmas Day. I’m concerned the dog may be a risk to my DC aged 3 and 5. A big dog needs to be impeccably trained otherwise it’s a risk. We already know it jumps up and chases small animals. I’m worried if DC are running around and squealing it might bite.

It’s harder because BIL has DC the same age and isn’t bothered at all, he’s been to visit with his DC already and I’ve seen photos of his DC climbing all over the dog. So how can we say we’re concerned when BIL clearly isn’t? We already know that PIL will be massively offended if we tell the truth that we don’t trust their dog.

What would you do? DH reckons we should just say DC are afraid of big dogs and ask if their dog can stay in the bedroom during our visit on Christmas Day. Our DC are little people with faces at dog height, the dog only has to bite once and DC is disfigured. We think BIL is nuts for letting his DC climb on it.

Would they move the dog to another part of the house?

Tbh if MIL hasn't spoke to you since I'd not be going anyway. Anyone who had hissy fits would not feature in my Christmas day.
Invite them over another day (minus the dog) if you want to see them

If she has tantrums because you couldn’t visit due to covid I wouldn’t go either.
‘We’re doing Christmas Day at our house this year, would you like to come round to ours after lunch?’

Your mil hasn't spoken to you all year because the PM told everyone not to mix at Christmas? No way I'd be going!

Offending MIL is much preferable to risking potentially serious injuries for DC. Unless you have a bullet proof guarantee the dog will be locked away at all times when your DC are there irrespective of BIL kid's wishes then I would resolutely decline the invite

my dog is as soft as butter. I made the mistake in the summer of taking him to a family party with lots of kids and noise.
One of the kids has a dog at home who tolerates being climbed on so she threw herself at my dog and gave him a bear hug.

In other circumstances my dog would probably have tolerated it, but in a that noisy unfamiliar environment with people he hadn't met for 18 months, he was really unerved. Fortunately I was standing right next to him, and myself between her and my dog, and lifte her off, just as my dog whisked round in a snapping motion. He didn't snap, because I was already there rescuing him and her.

That is what will happen, busy over excited kids, confused unerved dog, and someone will get hurt.

YANBU, it’s an accident waiting to happen, especially adding in the excitement of Christmas. Your children are far too small and you are quite right to be protective.

On another note given your MIL having a hissy fit and PIL’s poor judgment with the rescue Husky I simply wouldn’t go. Stay at home and have a lovely relaxing time.

This could be the nicest, sweetest, most wonderful dog in the world. Putting the dog in the middle of a gaggle of small children hyped up on sugar and Christmas magic is setting the dog up for failure. If the dog gets excited or overwhelmed, even if the children are not seriously injured, the dog could face real consequences.

Pil shouldn’t just be worried about protecting the grandchildren, they should be making sure to protect their dog. I would approach it from this perspective. They can all interact, but it should be controlled and supervised.

I’m a dog owner, a mother and a vet. I think a large untrained rescue dog with unknown history and 4 excitable young children at Christmas is an accident waiting to happen and definitely not worth the risk. You have to be assertive here and just refuse to go if the dog isn’t separated for it’s own and the children’s sake.

@JuneOsborne

Your mil hasn't spoken to you all year because the PM told everyone not to mix at Christmas? No way I'd be going!

Me neither. It's not your fault last Christmas panned out the way it did!

They sound very self centred and not at all bothered about considering your feelings.. so I would stop worrying about theirs

MIL hasn't spoken to you since last Christmas?!

Then this wouldn't even be a question for me. No, I wouldn't be running to do the bidding of someone who couldn't even have the fucking manners to talk to me, or who thought that they could punish me for making my own decisions.

They will go in a huff again - fine.

OP doesn't it reassure you that the dog is clearly OK with BIL's children and spends time around them?

I am not saying let the dog and your children run wild, but I would definitely feel more positive about the fact that this dog has been fine with BIL's children. You can tell your children not to approach the dog if you prefer, or to only stroke him gently on the back if he comes to them etc etc.

I'd still ask that PIL put the dog on a lead when you get there as it sounds like he would get overexcited and jump up, but apart from that I wouldn't be too worried when you and DH are going to be there too?

I'd have no issue clipping my parents dog onto his lead if he was getting excitable around children, your DH could do that?

@bigbluebus

I don't think Christmas day is the best time for your DC to be introduced to this dog as you don't know what reactions will be from either party and Christmas is a time of much excitement for small people and lots of new sounds and smells for dogs. I would not be allowing my small children anywhere near this dog on Christmas day - an earlier more controlled introduction would need to happen first where the attention of adults is solely on the introduction and interaction between them. Unless the dog is guaranteed to be placed in another room for the duration then you're not being unreasonable to not want to be there.

This. And really, Can you really trust them not to over ride your objections once you are there? PIL's who are already negligent about your BIL's children will they actually keep the dog away in another room all the time your children are there? Particularly since they don't agree with any of the concerns you've raised. I find their attitude so irresponsible. Their GC's safety ought to matter much more than their insistence that the dog has to be in the centre of things all day - and that's not very considerate to the dog either, having to cope with a host of strangers in his home. I wouldn't go until as @bigbluebus says the dog has been properly acclimatised Christmas Day is not a good time. Let them be offended. They don't care that you are offended by their lack of concern for your DCs safety. What does your DH say.

@Cariah

why do you think it's vicious? It’s untrained and has chased cats and jumped on people. And it’s an unknown quantity because they have no idea about its history.

I just wouldn’t go
I wish that was an option. Last year we couldn’t go because of Covid and MIL took a hissy fit and hadn’t spoken to me since. We’re trying to think of a way to keep DC away from the dog without blatantly saying that’s what we’re doing. Otherwise PIL will be offended and will go in the huff again.

Frankly they sound pretty stupid & unplesant, I wouldn't be too worried about them having another hussy out & not talking to me for another year (silver lining).

I wouldn't go , regardless of how your Bil feels, that's nothing to do with it .
At best, you'll be on tenterhooks all day worrying about the kids - Christmas is supposed to be enjoyable.
Your inlaws sound irresponsible

Sorry op but you need to grow a backbone . My dads rescue dog ( huge thing , unsure of its parentage ) attacked ds when he was 4 - luckily I managed to scare it off , and only scratches in the end. We left immediately ( by plane !) And have not visited since . My dad refuses to train the dog and blamed my son for not being used to animals .

Last year we couldn’t go because of Covid and MIL took a hissy fit and hadn’t spoken to me since.

This along would make me say NO!. Why on earth would you spend Christmas with someone who has chosen not to speak to you all year because a virus prevented you from going to them last Christmas!

And where is your DH in all of this... is he forcing you to still engage with someone who doesn't speak to you - or is he sticking up for you??

Don't go. You cant expect the dog to be locked up all day for your kids. Maybe invite PIL to yours but ask if he can get a dog sitter.

@madisonbridges

If you've not actually met the dog, but your bil and his children have and haven't found it to be a problem, why do you think it's vicious? Surely if they've had hands on experience with it, they'd know its temperament better than you. Just because a dog jumps up, doesn't mean it's nasty.

It's not reasonable to have it shut in the bedroom all day. It'll whine and bark when it hears the rest of you. So if you're worried about a dog you've never met, you'd be best not to go. You'll just make the whole day stressful for everyone.

Putting it in kennels for the day is ridiculous.

She didn’t say she thinks the dogs is vicious.

She identified a potential risk of a rescue with an uncertain history and a lack of training. A risk which many other dog owners in this thread have agreed they would not be happy with.

Why belittle people’s well founded concerns?

Our neighbours large dog - extremely well trained, walked frequently and apparently lovely temperament - got out of the garden last week and savaged a sheep (which had to destroyed). Beautiful, friendly, well cared for animal - always placid and didn’t leap up on people. You just can’t tell - go with your instincts and put your childrens safety first at all times.

I work in an animal rescue centre so I can maybe shed some light on a few things.

The behaviours you listed for the dog, all completely normal huskie behaviour. Huskies are a working breed. They have high energy levels. They need a job to do. They have a high prey drive and will always be tempted by small furry animals like cats. My rescue would never have rehomed a huskie to your PIL in the first place. It just isn’t the right type of home for that specific breed. That being said, none of those behaviours mean the dog is any more likely to be vicious than any other dog. It’s a huskie being a huskie.

Huskies are also very boisterous and mouthy players with each other & have a high pact mentality. Oddly this does mean they tolerate a lot of rough housing from children BUT they shouldn’t have too!

People who have suggested a baby gate…no chance. That’s not keeping a huskie anywhere. They can easily jump an 8ft fence if they want to.

As for solutions to your problem. A quiet visit with the kids to meet the dog before Christmas Day would be helpful. Inviting the PIL to visit at your house over Xmas (sans dog) as a compromise. Perhaps getting the message across but in a way that shows concern for the dog e.g. “we think it might be a lot of stress on the new dog to have so many new faces, especially hyper active kids on Christmas Day, in his home”. “Our kids haven’t spent much time around dogs so we’re worried they won’t know how to properly behave with the dog & it might stress him out & cause an accident”.

If you do end up taking the kids over for Christmas read up on signs of stress in dogs. A lot of people say a dog “bit out of nowhere” but they never do. There are always warning signs a dog is getting stressed and might resort to a bite of the warning signs aren’t heeded. Growling is an obvious one but also look out for panting, “whale eyes”, head snapping, body going stiff, crouching etc.