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Christmas

From present ideas to party food, find all your Christmas inspiration here.

Does religion feature in your christmas?

224 replies

Mindtrope · 27/11/2016 08:25

I have some very religious members of my family.
I always think it odd that she sends me cards with pictures of camels and sand dunes at christmas time.The only thing we do is listen to Carols at Kings, sweet in a traditional way, but not for the religious aspect.
Is your house a jesus free zone?

OP posts:
merrygoround51 · 28/11/2016 12:13

Olivermums Although whether Jesus was the son of God is certainly a matter of faith, Jesus as a religious leader of sorts was a real historical figure so whether or not we believe he was real, historical fact would point to him being a man who preached the value to which many subscribe (and which have been endlessly tainted by churches over the centuries

Santa in the North Pool delivering toys was never real!

BroomstickOfLove · 28/11/2016 12:43

St Nicholas, the Bishop of Myra was real, though.

OK, it seems slightly ridiculous to believe that he actually lives with a load of elves and delivers presents at immense speed to some but not all children, but if you are an atheist it also seems pretty ridiculous to believe that one of many itinerant Jewish preachers at the time had magic powers, some of which he shared with his friends, rose from the dead, was simultaneously completely human and actually God, and is how based in heaven busy listening to prayers but only intervening very occasionally because he knows what's best, and sometime's what's best is genocide.

I am actually religious myself, and know that Christianity is more complicated than that, but from the outside, it can look as odd and unbelievable as the Father Christmas story.

steppemum · 28/11/2016 12:57

Mindtrope - try spending 25th December in a muslim/buddhist or hindu country and you will realise that it is somewhat central to the reason for celebrating.

Also, while many of the bits and bobs are non religious hang-ons (trees, food etc) it would not have persisted so strongly until now without the church making it the celebration of Jesus. Other festivals that weren't adopted/taken over by the church have gone by the wayside.

I am pretty puzzled as to why you would object to christmas cards showing something from the christmas story.

Obvioulsy everyone is perfectly free to celebrate it as they wish religious or not, and I have Jewish and Hindu friends who celebrate it too because they live in UK and it is a big thing here, but it is clebrated here primarily due to our Christian heritage.

JingleMum · 28/11/2016 13:20

The birth of Christ is very important in my house. We listen to hyms, attend Christmas Church services, give to those in need etc.. We also eat, drink, be merry and enjoy the commercialism to some extent.

bluelilies · 28/11/2016 13:28

steppemum - Muslim Buddhist countries are different in lots of ways - they don't have the same herritage us us. You could just as easily argue that the English language is inherently Christian because it's isn't (much) spoken in the Muslim world.

If it were the case that Jesus was central to Christmas having a meaning, then it would have largely fallen out of significance in the UK, along with church attendance, baptisms and all the other parts of Christianity that really are about being a Christian.

But it hasn't - and that's because it does have real meaning to people who are not Christians. It's our family celebration of life, family, being together, giving presents, sharing food, and closely tied up with new year and thinking about the year gone and the year ahead.

In contrast, say, Easter I think is largely a Christian fesitival. It means nothing to me really, other than being a couple of bank holidays. But don't try to tell non-religious people with a UK heritage that Christmas can't mean anything to them, when they're all of them describing what it does mean to them.

And yes, whilst Jesus is a historical figure, I don't think the historical evidence of him having been the same baby as was born in a manger in Bethlehem (maybe) is so strong. Still less the evidence of the three wise men standing over the crib bearing gifts - which even the bible says happened sometime later, but still forms part of every nativity scene - it's a lovely story about a baby born in poverty who went on to achieve great things - and that is a meaningful story to anyone in the world (unless you're from a different religion that expressly forbids you from taking part in anything Christian)

Heathen4Hire · 28/11/2016 13:37

Saturnalia was the Roman mid-winter feast. Christians used to celebrate Jesus' birth in the spring, but over time Saturnalia and Christmas merged and Christmas was celebrated in December as the Roman religion died out. There are pagan mid-winter festivals too, though I can't name them.

We are atheist. We put Marvel superheroes on the tree. More Saturnalia feasting that religious servitude to the birth of a prophet. My ten year old knows the basis of Christmas but it's a fairy story.

CuntyMcCuntyface · 28/11/2016 13:39

The birth of Christ is very important in my house. We listen to hyms, attend Christmas Church services, give to those in need etc

So are you suggesting that to give to those in need you need to be a christian?

slenderisthenight · 28/11/2016 13:44

Purchased two books on explaining evolution to toddlers so....no, no religious element here

Sorry to disappoint, but most Christians would not now have a problem with this.

steppemum · 28/11/2016 13:54

But don't try to tell non-religious people with a UK heritage that Christmas can't mean anything to them, when they're all of them describing what it does mean to them.

I didn't.
I said it was odd to be surprised at getting a christmas card with elements of the Christmas story on it, and that everyone is perfectly free to celebrate it as they wish religious or not, but that it does come from the Christian heritage that we have, so why be surprised that there are christian elements in it?

Eolian · 28/11/2016 15:03

I send cards with pictures of the three wise men or whatever sometimes even though I am an atheist, the same way as I might send an Easter card with the Easter bunny on it even though I obviously don't believe in the Easter bunny. To me it is a story. A story which is part of my cultural heritage and which is bound up with family traditions, memories of childhood etc.

I find it quite odd that people find this kind of apparently hypocritical treatment of religion-based culture surprising tbh. I presume that every religion in the world which ever died out or waned in popularity left behind many rituals and traditions which people continued to observe because they enjoyed them. It's a totally normal human thing to do. Religions come and go, but humans like to have traditions and celebrations.

CozumelFox · 28/11/2016 17:14

No, we're atheists. Both children know of the nativity story, know the popular carols and are aware of the Christian cultural celebrations other people do, but we also talk about the pre-Christian roots and other country's/culture's customs as well. Basically, everyone's celebrating, here's all the different ways in which people do it.

HattiesBackpack · 28/11/2016 17:58

I came on this thread to discuss the interesting mixes of different celebrations that Christmas tends to be -for example in my house we celebrate both the birth of Jesus, and Yule, I would classify myself as a Christian and a Pagan, DH is Christian.
Anyway, after actually reading I don't get the point of why you started this thread OP because it does seem that you are just using it to sneer at anyone with different beliefs to you-which I think is a bit narrow minded of you.

Also I notice that Pagan religious traditions don't get condemned in the way that Christian traditions are, do all those non religious people dislike religion or is it just Christianity ?

JingleMum · 28/11/2016 18:55

Cunty Of course not, not at all. I should have elaborated. I do a volunteer project to do with our Church around Christmas time, helping those that need it. My point was more along the lines of that I attend Church more frequently in the lead up to Christmas, I prioritise it more. That'll teach me to Mumsnet whilst i'm supposed to be working so am rushing.

slenderisthenight · 28/11/2016 19:06

I agree hattie. A more honest thread title for the OP would have been

'Any twats out there who still think God has anything to do with Christmas?'.

EmGee · 29/11/2016 17:21

Slender Grin

EmGee · 29/11/2016 17:24

Hatties I thought that too. But then again I notice that when people go on about how bad religion is but seem to consider say, Buddhism ok.

Wheredidallthejaffacakesgo · 29/11/2016 17:31

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Eolian · 29/11/2016 17:51

EmGee - Buddhism is very different imo, on account of it having no god. In that sensr it's hardly even a religion in the normal sense of the word.

slenderisthenight · 29/11/2016 22:42

So the less like a religion, the more acceptable it is eolian. Interesting.

elQuintoConyo · 29/11/2016 23:07

Mostly Papa Noel here and a log that shits gifts.

But we also have a 'knitivity' and DS plays with the sheep and hides baby Jesus Grin

We include the story of Jesus' birth as part of other stories, not as truth. We're in a Catholic country and he gets religion at school (although it is a state school, so not nearly as much as the private schools - DS' cousin was told she was going to hell because she didn't have the right shoes for the nativity play - she was 4yo at the time!).

We also celebrate Kings' Day, Jan 6th, by watching the Kings parade on the night of the 5th, just for the pomp and the free sweets they throw into the crowd Grin DS will then get one or two final gifts of the season (FC brings big presents), for many locals that is when their dc get all their gifts.

This is the shitting log (caga tio): he arrived last Saturday, ds found him in the woods while we were walking the dog DH hid him in a backpack and he poos presents on Christmas eve.

Does religion feature in your christmas?
slenderisthenight · 30/11/2016 12:14

Cool log :)

Eolian · 30/11/2016 12:32

slenderisthenight - well, for people who aren't religious, probably yes. Buddhism is more of an approach to life than a religion. People who think gods do not exist or who dislike organised religion for a variety of very common reasons are not likely to have the same problem with Buddhism, even if they don't believe in what Buddhism says. I'm not a Buddhist btw.

HotelNine · 30/11/2016 21:16

I want a present shitting log.

HotelNine · 30/11/2016 21:19

Where can I get a present shitting log? It would look lovely next to the Nativity.

Pluto30 · 30/11/2016 21:20

I also want a present shitting log...

Envy