If you have an UNDER THREE please read this

[studentmummy]

When the vaccine is available it will not even be OFFERED to UNDER THREE's even though 0-4 year olds are the projected heaviest affected group for MORTALITY. As the mother of a two year old (among other siblings)I resent not having the CHOICE to have my child protected especially if death rates INCREASE. Even the very elderly will take priority over toddlers and babies as they have been allocated vaccine at the very end of the queue.
The government advice is that UNDER THREE'S STAY AT HOME for their own protection instead which is not a realistic option for working or stay at home mothers who will bceome PRISONERS IN THEIR OWN HOMES.
For clarification please read the following :Prof David Salisbury letter to primary care trusts dated 26 June 2009 and goveernment projections for swine flu under NHS choices website. I suggest if you feel as strongly as I do a letter to your MP that under three's are NOT EXPENDABLE but are human beings with full rights as our their mothers!

The infection is mainly in the under 17 year old group. The skew is over 60% to these youngsters. The ones who are most at risk out of these are under four years old since they have lower levels of immune system development and more likely to suffer complications.

Older people over 65 are also more likely to have complications but the infection levels are very low.

Priority is being given to the 4-17 group because it is expected that they will pick up the virus more readily through social contact (school / college). Where this leaves parents with nursery age children...

Studentmummy your latest post makes me think that all our comments and opinions will end up in some semi-ficticious newspaper 'article' next week. Your whole post just now sounds like something that should be in 'non member media requests'.

And no, I haven't been researching and surfing - I have been out and about working or with my children. Are you a prisoner in your own home with just internet access or something?

Oh, really, you lot are like the Witches of Eastwick!

Leave poor studentmummy alone, she's only trying to help.

well the infection is mainl in the under 17's for now.

Lets see how it is after the summer holidays once children are out of school, families visiting each other (so a mix of ages). Bet it changes.

PMSL at Slarty!

Anyone see that dreadful epidemic drama on BBC last autumn? Spooky...

wmmc down here in Hants we've been told that a vaccine is on it's way, not yet fully developed and will be rolled out to targeted groups but as yet we don't know what they are. HCPs will be priority but apart from that we can't say for sure who will be offered the vaccine.

That was the info given to us earlier this week, whether it's changed or not who knows, it seems to change every few days!

not sure what to make of this. On the one hand, I don't like the thought of an untried vaccine being used on my precious ikkleys. On the other hand, i don't like them being exposed to something they have no immunity to.

On balance, I don't think I'd have the vaccine anyway, even if it was on offer. Not enough evidence either way - so far, and there's always the thought that we are most likely to be exposed whilst in the Doctors surgery waiting for the jab.

Yes I'm interested.

Yes I've heard discussions on the radio saying 'older' people have a degree of immunity to swine flu because previous versions of flu have been similar enough to swine flu for antibodies developed in response to be effective(ish) against swine flu. So under 18's are the most vulnerable age group.

Sadly I think a lot of my fellow mumsnetters couldn't see past your emotive language/typos/slightly excessive use of capitals to work out if what you were saying was relevant/significant.

I think you're right about parents generally prefering to have choice about vaccines rather than seeing NHS determining that under 3's are not at risk.

Maybe they'll learn from this approach and decide to ban MMR for under 3's and see us all beating a path to their door.

Take your point FAQ. Thoughts are that over 65s picked up immunity in previous epidemics. Reason to vaccinate is to eliminate cross infection between vulnerable groups.

Seasonal flu kills about 6000 per year (mainly older people) but this is hitting the youngsters

That drama was crap.

eh bosch how does that work then?

Largest numbers of deaths due to normal flu are general among the elderly, and they - along with other key groups - are offered a flu vaccine yearly.....

Thanks Bosch

Sorry I seemed to get a bit over excited there but what I read really upset me.
I am just trying to get the message accross to other mums so that we can get the choice.
I can't stand the thought of my other children being protected and losing my youngest through doing nothing.

I think some of the reccs have come from WHO - there are guidelines re the vaccines on their website. Pregnant women to be targeted first I think.

Hang on I'll look for the link if anyones interested...

here

Probably not the right thread to ask...but I'm interested why some people are saying they wouldn't have the vaccine if it was offered to them?

Would that be to build up their own immunity or cos it's not tested or because being altruistic and letting others have it instead? (News does say they'll be enough when they start vaccinating so don't think supply is going to be a problem.) Just curious.

(we'll not be having it though - not without being tested for antibodies first)

You probably missed my last note FAQ.

Studentmummy has a good point on this. It's one thing to have an informed choice on vaccination; be it MMR or any other. It is an entirely different emotional situation to have no choice in the protection of your loved ones other than to keep them at home and hope that they don't get infected on a trip to Sainsburys.

All this aside, I suggest you buy some spiri-gel or similar (stuff they use on hospital wards) and use it regularly since primary infection route is through hand to mouth.

Off to bed now I'll keep you posted on stuff I pick up tomorrow.

no I saw it despite the x posts - and I still have the same query

Why are over 65's routinely given a flu jab each year, and why do so many die from it, if they have picked up immunity from previous epidemics?

Surely that invalidates the whole "over 65" flu jab thing?

I wouldn't have it

I'm a healthy adult, not underlying health conditions (that I know of ), the chances are I'll just end up with a horrible dose of flu and recover.

Can I ask those who are shocked about under 3's not initially being included (apparently).

Do you get your under 3's vaccinated each year against seasonal flu? If not why not?

I read an American article only yesterday about Swine flu. It suggested that the elderly are not more vulnerable to swine flu (as opposed to seasonal flu). It actually said that one-third of the over 64's have some antibodies against the virus.

It also said that the most vulnerable are the under 5's and pg women (I'm assuming because their immune system is compromised??)

Will try to find a link ...

I guess people don't seek routine vaccinations for children each year because seasonal flu hasn't (in recent years) targeted the young the way Swine Flu seems to.

David Salisbury's letter doesn't say that under-3s won't be offered the vaccine at all. It says that there will be further work to be done on establishing a priority order in which to vaccinate people, but that the current working assumption on priority order is

1. Individuals aged between six months and 65 years in the current seasonal flu clinical risk groups.

1. Pregnant women in their second and third trimester

1. Health and social care workers directly involved in patient care.

1. Other health and social care workers

1. Children aged from 3 years to 16 years of age.

1. People aged 65 years and over

1. Poultry workers

1. All others not in the above groups [i.e. including under-3s and the vast majority of adults]

i.e. 3 to 16 year olds will get priority over pensioners and poultry workers, but 0 to 2 year olds won't and will have the same priority as the rest of us.

FAQ - it is the fact that 'this' H1N1 strain of flu was around in the 1950's (I think) - which is why they have slightly high resistance to this one.

Seasonal flu isn't usually H1N1 - hence the reason for vaccination.

So now here's the mumsnet bent of questioning - you knew this was coming didn't ya? I'm breastfeeding my ineligible children - if I get vaxed do they get it by proxy eh?

yup...probably. But not in a way that they develop their own immunity. They will be reliant on your Abs, and given how powerful this virus appears to be it probbaly won't prevent but will certainly help them.

Also if you are vacinated then there is lowed chance of them catching - as you prob won't get it and incubate it in continuous contact environment of your home IYSWIM.