111 should be SHUT DOWN

[MrsMaisel]

Much as I hate to link the daily mail - here’s a horrifying look at the ‘training’ call handlers receive
never use 111

I've used them twice in the past few months and they've been great. The first time they sent an ambulance and the second time they got an out of hours doctor to issue a repeat prescription that I really needed and hadn't been able to get from the chemist in my village before they closed.

I work at 111 so I'm biased I know.

We aren't an emergency line, we're an assessment line so we have to ask questions. Also, depending on the symptoms, 999 use the same system.

My training was nothing like the one in the Daily Mail.

I've never had an issue with 111.

I called last night to asked advice because my DD was vomiting having started on strong antibiotics that day which have vomiting as a side effect and I didn't know whether I should continue with them. The initial assessor was actually fine, but was called back by someone who said they were a "clinician" - what does that mean? - who insisted on telling me it was definitely food poisoning because we'd eaten out in the past 48 hours. Insisted on trying to give me advice on what a tummy bug was. FFS. What even is a "clinician" anyway?

I like 111. Thank you everyone who does a good job for 111.

The call handlers aren't usually amazing, but putting you through to a gp or ambulance is very helpful.

Prior to 111 in my area you could phone out of hours GP centre directly and a GP would call you back after a very brief conversation with a call handler to take your contact details and triage if any huge urgency. Now you have to phone 111, answer a zillion questions, possibly have an ambulance dispatched unnecessarily, and the call handler's algorithm decides if you get put on the GP list.

And you can call 999 directly if you think an emergency requiring an ambulance.

My 8 month old rolled off the bed a couple of weeks ago (excellent watching by DH whilst I made his bottle) so I called 111 for advice

He was totally fine, cried for about 30 seconds and then back to normal but I just wanted to make sure I was correct with the things I was looking out for just in case he'd bumped his head

The handler insisted I took him into urgent care for an appointment (@ 4am...8 hours after the incident so apparently not that urgent) and when I said I didn't feel it was necessary and I'd rather not wake him and drag him across the city at 4am she said if I didn't then she'd report me to SS

I was livid but took him anyway. We were in with the doctor for less than 3 minutes and he said it was just a box ticking exercise but I was fuming about her attitude

Gave birth on a Wednesday. By Saturday I've started to feel crap, shivering, weak, temp etc and pulled out a huge piece of retained placenta on the loo.(like a ginormous steak)
Called 111 because I wasn't sure if there was more inside and should I get myself checked out...
Call handler asked if I could be pregnant.And again a few minutes later.... Not fucking likely given I had a baby 3 days before...

"the call handler's algorithm decides if you get put on the GP list" - yes, this. I needed to speak to a GP or a pharmacist as she was having an adverse reaction to medication. But undoubtedly we got put on the "minor vomiting bug" algorithm so was probably put through to a non-prescribing person who was only briefed or equipped to tell me about tummy bugs.

Aberforth it may be useless in your experience but to myself and thousands of others it’s a life saver. The Scottish service is fantastic and does such a hard job.

To the posters that complain of them asking lots of ‘irrelevant’ questions, are you medically trained? Do you know why they ask these questions?! It’s to rule out things that you may not even know exist!

My friend works for 111 now and the things she tells me are unbelievable.

"My friend works for 111 now and the things she tells me are unbelievable." - she shouldn't really be telling you about it should she? Not very professional.

I don't mind the irrelevant questions as I understand they are just following the computer system, but I do mind that the computer system isn't equipped to connect us with the correct services and that there is no way or circumventing this when common sense dictates the computer's solution is wrong.

"111 isn't for sever chest pain. In fact it even tells you on the recorded message at the start of you have it to hang up and call 999. Hardly the fault of 111 that your mum chose their path to follow."

@freshstartnewme I know. I'm well aware that you call 999 for chest pain, but my mum is elderly and was confused and scared and didn't know what to do (and 'didn't want to be a bother') . You'd hope that 111 would have more sense than to spend ages asking questions when the primary complaint is chest pain.
I've spoken to her and made her promise to call an ambulance if it happens again, or at least call me (so I can do it).

@AuchAyeTheNo it’s a fair point. And I know a lot of call centre workers are working to a script. I just think it’s frustrating that both times I’ve used it, despite actually answering their questions, they’ve fixated on one of them and repeatedly asked me. It seems to swing between extremes - dismissive or sending you straight to a&e but I appreciate as non medically trained professionals there is a limit to what they can do.
I actually think the way it is promoted is to blame. The Scottish service does sound a lot better - my experiences haven’t been good. Hopefully I won’t ever have to find out if 111 is good enough to save my or my loved ones lives - I don’t feel wholly reassured by my previous experiences.

111 were very over cautious with DH, I phoned to check out slurred speech and drooling that I thought could be linked to medication but wasn't sure, and they sent an ambulance and saved his life - he had sepsis and although he really didn't want to go to a&e, they saw through his pretence of being ok. A lot depends on the opposite I think. I've also had a bad experience with them myself where I felt they weren't listening to me when I had kidney stones.

Operator. Not opposite obviously

worried perhaps not but it has certainly made me realise how precious our nhs is and how much it is being destroyed by the tories. You read about it all the time but it’s the small things you have no clue about because it goes unreported.

aberforth it’s very frustrating because they have to work to an algorithm that was made by clinical staff but doesn’t give the staff room to use common sense. Unfortunately they have to act of the side of caution and sadly now a&e is the only suitable place for lots of things because of Nhs cuts and staff shortages. It’s a shame that the experience is so different for people in England.

@AuchAyeTheNo it really is :( I have a lot of respect for anyone who works for the NHS in any way - it’s a shame this particular centre in the news has let the side down so badly. I think generally the NHS service in hospitals varies depending on where you are - I guess it’s the same for the 111 service too.

What was the service before 111? Still 'medical advice by phone', but not 111?

They were, universally, BRILLIANT IME. Living 7 miles from the nearest medical care with 2 small children, they were my 'go to' number for 'is this OK, or do I set off for the (closer) GP, the (futher away) smaller hospital or the (absolutely beeping miles and a huge traffic jam away) serious hospital?'

Sensible, calm advice, mostly from (AFAIR) nurse practitioners. DS in particular was a great one for turning blue in the small hours (croup, mainly) and they were always wholly reassuring and accurate in their advice.

NHS Direct 08454647. That's what it used to be - early 2000s was when we used it most.

I live in Scotland and ive had to use them rarely for work purposes and twice for personal circumstance and they were brilliant!

I am in Scotland and have used it a few times. I have never had an issue with the service I have had but experience now puts me off calling - not because I don’t trust them but because I know what things they are trying to discount or identify and I can tell what direction it is heading.

There is a little bit about people accepting that the advice won’t always be to your liking. For example, your child has fallen and banged his head and you have already assessed him to be largely well, it begs the question why call? Why be livid when you are sent for assessment? What do people expect to happen? That is not a criticism as I have found myself in the same position. But we do the “call for advice” then get annoyed when the advice puts us out a bit. Or there isn’t a magical solution to the problem.

My main issue has been the attitude of the doctors we have been sent to by 111. They don’t seem to always understand the stages before you rock up at them. For example I once had 12 hours of repeated “call back in three hours in there is no improvement” ongoing with my baby. I was sent to see an OOH GP who literally eye rolled but then gathered himself and said that he did probably think that if she was still so poorly by the afternoon call 111 again and expect her to be admitted to hospital. Went through a further few calls where the nurses were openly aghast that she had not been admitted by the GP and told to pack a wee bag, get another appointment and expect to stay.

The GP we saw then was shockingly bad. Outright accused me of just attention seeking. Said he would prescribe antibiotics “because that’s what you seem to want - even though it will make her worse”

I accept she wasn’t desperately poorly but I had spent hours and hours being prepared for the fact that she was quite unwell and likely to need to go to hospital. I wasn’t being ridiculous I was being a parent.

DH rang them for a suspected DVT. Call handler asked their standard questions and then decided a ‘clinician’ would call him back.
We waited over 2.5 hours for that call back and the nurse just asked exactly the same questions as the call handler.

Whilst waiting DH had rang a friend who is a surgeon who had already told him he needed to go to A&E.

He ended up having a massive row with the nurse who seemed completely clueless and told him he was having an anxiety attack and there was nothing wrong. Eventually agreed to send an ambulance (just had an operation and was fairly immobile so I couldn’t take him) and he did have a DVT...

I would never use them. My SIL had a ruptured appendix after taking their advice.

I've always had a great response from them. I think it's a great service.

I'm in Scotland. A few years ago I had an excruciating headache, couldnt stand light and couldnt move without vomiting.
My parents phoned 999 who said they couldn't blue light me because it didnt sound serious enough so they were to call NHS24. NHS24 said i needed blue lighted and they couldnt action it so they should call 999. They got passed back and forward several times until I was eventually blue lighted to a and e.

I had meningitis.