worried about 3.9 yo DS

[Kveta]

We are starting to get concerned about DS's health. He is constantly exhausted, fragile to the point of howling and tears at the slighted provocation, he is looking gaunt and has huge shadows under his eyes. He is sleeping 12+ hours most nights though, so not lacking in sleep at all.

Also, he seems to be drinking quite a lot, and peeing a lot - not sure how he compares to other kids his age, but it seems a lot to us. He hasn't grown this year - clothes all still fit, his feet have gone up a size since last july, and we have a height chart which shows he has grown 4 cm since last June - but only 1cm of that since january, so I'm not sure it's a growth spurt. Also, he keeps complaining that his tummy hurts (but that is often when we ask him to do something he doesn't want to do, so not sure it really hurts, IYSWIM).

Now, I have family history which means I am adding 2+2 and maybe getting 5, but have made a GP appt for mid july (first one available) to get some tests run on him. In the meantime, I am worrying and worrying about my baby boy. Fingers crossed it's all nothing.

Has he been checked for diabetes?

that is what we are thinking it might be. DSis is type 1. should I get some urine test strips maybe?

How long has he been drinking and peeing excessively for? I think he needs to be seen far sooner than mid July! I would suggest either asking for an urgent appointment and if that doesn't work, then I'd take him to a walk in centre. If he does have diabetes then it's highly likely to be Type 1 in which case could make him very poorly very quickly. Even if it's not diabetes, he's clearly not right and needs to be seen by a doctor. Best of luck and I hope he's ok. It's horrid when they're sick

PS how old is he?

D'oh! Just seen it in the title part of your thread. I'll shut up now

Why not give the GP surgery a call and ask if you can drop a urine sample there from him as you are concerned about diabetes. At least from doing that they may know whether or not to see him more urgently.

Thanks all.

DH and I have decided I will take DS and urine sample to a pharmacist tomorrow for an initial check, as getting a gp appointment is virtually impossible round here. I reckon that should help, and if he proves to have sugar in his pee, I will go and annoy the gp receptionist until they agree to see us. Or should I try the health visitors rather than pharmacist, as they have a clinic tomorrow?

I'd try the HV first and if no joy then the pharmacist. I think it's poor that you're having to wait so long for a GP appointment. Have you tried smelling his breath? If it smells sweet or like pear drops then this can be indicative of high sugar levels. Is your sister not local to you? She must have urine dipsticks

Sister nowhere near us, and I haven't smelled his breath, but will do so tomorrow after he brushes his teeth!!

Thanks again :)

You can buy blood test meters over the counter for about £15ish, they come with a few strips to test with. If you can't get a sensible response out of anyone tomorrow then maybe buy one and check it yourself.

Breath smelling of pear drops is indicative of ketones which are dangerous - I would go to A&E immediately if you (think you) detect them.

If he continues to drink and pee lots though, I'd go to A&E anyway - untreated it will become an emergency alarmingly quickly.

Kveta I agree with Rue. Can you not have a smell of his breath now? If he does smell like pear drops / nail polish remover then you should go to A&E tonight. You are absolutely not wasting their time! If his breath smells normal to you then you should still make sure he's looked at / has a urine dipstick or blood sugar level taken tomorrow. Please let us know how you get on!

I would phone NHS direct/111 tonight - I think tomorrow is too late for these symptoms, especially the abdominal pain - if it is diabetes, that is a sign of keto-acidosis, which is extremely serious & can deteriorate quickly. Please don't delay. Better safe than sorry.

Also ask about coeliac disease, tummy pains, lethargy and failure to thrive are all symptoms of that.
Do you still have his red book? Plot his height and weight on the growth charts in that, if he has dropped a centile band since he was younger show it to the doctors, they are more inclined to take seriously any concerns about poor growth.
Good luck, and I agree with others about not waiting tills July.

the growth thing wouldn't worry me too much, my DS2 aged 3.4 hasn't gone up any clothing sizes recently and still wears 2-3 yo stuff. But the drinking and the tummy thing would worry me. I too would push for an earlier appointment

oh and I also thought coeliac. A friend of DS1's was diagnosed at 4 with this and the symptoms were very similar. He was also being sick quite a lot. The poor boy was a shadow of himself before being put on a gluten free diet

Any news, Kveta?

His breath smells totally unsweet, so will go with calling HV when they are in, and see what they suggest.

Thanks again all :)

Glad to hear he sounds ok this morning. Please get him seen today.my son was dx'd aged seven and he had Alll the symptoms you describe. Sorry, I don't want to worry you, but its important for those reading to know that diabetes symptoms may be more than peeing. He had lost a load of weight, shadows under. the eyes, sleeping loads, very grumpy, weepy, peeling loads, drinking loads, eating affected. My ds had also fallen off his line on the red book, hadn't grown. My friend's child had a growth spurt at diagnosis as the body sometimes does this, apparently, and many newly diagnosed diabetic children are taller than expected. Others are like my son; the body was maintaining essential systems rather than growing. He's great now, and we' on top of it.

I really hope its not, but please please get him seen today - it can be exceptionally dangerous not to. I don't want to worry you, I know too much I'm afraid.

On the happy outcome that it is not diabetes, could you get an appointment with the gp and ask about coeliac? It's genetically linked to t1 (my dh has coeliac) and could cause the symptoms you are seeing too. (Also causes fatty, foul smelling poo - sorry!).

. All the best, let us know how you get on.

OP, as a healthcare professional working in diabetes care, it is really important that he is assessed by a Dr today. Phone the surgery, tell the receptionist he has symptoms of new presentation type 1 diabetes & needs seen today. Insist on an emergency appointment or speaking to the on-call GP for the surgery or a call-back at the very least.

How did you get on, kveta?

we didn't see any HV in the end, but got some urine test strips, and the one he did came back negative. Will try again tomorrow, but I think a negative to glucose in the urine is a good thing, yes?

I still think that with those symptoms your DS needs to be seen by a doctor ASAP.

In rare cases you can get a clear urine sample and still have type 1 - that's what happened to me as a kid! But I was drinking SO much all the sugar was getting flushed out quickly.

No smell of ketones is a good sign, but if he starts being sick please take him straight to A&E as it could be DKA (also happened to me cos our GP at the time told my mum to take me home and give me calpol!)

Do you know of anyone who has a blood machine to do a finger prick test?

thanks paddy - will obviously be keeping a close eye on him for the next week or two, until we see the GP. and will know to get him checked out if anything further develops.

My HV actually called us last night (I had left her a message in the morning) and after running through the symptoms with her, she said it does all sound like diabetes - until I got to the urine test! She has suggested he could be mildly anaemic as it's quite common at this age apparently, and also that all the signs of diabetes can be explained by simply 'being 3' too, so she doesn't feel worried, but reckons we are doing the right thing for now, and to call her if we need to at any time.

sounds like my dd before her coeliac diagnosis. push for coeliac test.good luck I hope he feels better soon.