Disintegrating enamel -18 mo

[GluedToTheVideoMonitor]

Both eye teeth developed brown marks as soon as they appeared, and this morning I've noticed what looks like the enamel disintegrating on one of them.

I took dd to the dentist two weeks ago to get them checked out but she wouldn't let him near her. I had taken a photo for him to see, and all he could say was about giving too much sugar, and to come back in three months to try again.

She is PFB and I have been beyond anal about letting her have anything sugary (although recently I have relented about the odd biscuit or small bit of chocolate).

She doesn't appear to be in any pain, for now, but I'd like to know why this has happened and what is likely to happen to the rest of her teeth.

TIA

A friends daughter (now in her 20s) has this or possibly this, does that look similar?

Ds1 is the same, he also wouldn't let dentist see. dentist did say as long as not soft not too worry?! will watch with interest.

DGS had enamel hypoplasia caused by a poorly functioning placenta. Was your DD small for dates? His teeth came through perfectly but went brown and the enamel crumbled away! In the end they all had to be removed (sorry for the horror story) apart from 4 molars which were obviously healthy. His next teeth should be fine because they are being formed now instead of in the womb.

Not saying the case but worth considering if DD was small at birth. Stops guilt feelings re sugar!

Some drugs and antibiotics cause teeth browning, but are never given in pregnancy because of it.

Your dentist will discuss fissure sealing etc in future but for now ensure a calcium and vit D rich foods, and sunlight, no pure fruit juice drinks and brushing - all of which I am sure you already know!

Sneezecake - yes, she was small, just 6'9" at birth and what you describe is very similar. I'm sure that I didn't take anything like antibiotics when I was pregnant, but it's hugely reassuring to hear that her adult teeth should be ok.

I'm going to persevere with the dentist and keep her sugar intake low until I know more.

Dribbleface, I'd love to hear how you get on too.

ds hasnt got proper enamel on his first 2 adult molars that have come through (he is 5) - he was prescribed a toothpaste with 5000ppm fluoride and his 2 new teeth were painted with fluoride to try and protect them.

The dentist said illness as a child could have affected them as they were forming and google says those particular teeth would be forming at about 5/6 months of age at which point ds had chicken pox. Maybe it was related - who knows!

a lot of factors can affect enamel as explained above and flouride can help but 5000ppm is a very high dose prescribed to those over 16 years of age. for children under 6 the dose would be a smear of 1350-1500 ppm flouride which is the normal adult tooth paste.

Hi Glued- just a thought are you still breastfeeding or did for an extended period?

I had a similar problem with my DD and had breastfeed until she was 3 - used as a bit of a human dummy to be honest. She was only given water to drink, we were scrupulous about dental hygiene, but front upper teeth started to look a bit chipped at 18 months as though enamel was being eaten away. By 2 they were greyish and by 4 positively discoloured.

The dentist reminded my about how high in sugar breast milk is and as no other teeth were affected felt it was due to the positioning while breastfeeding.

Anyway the upshot was she ended up having these two teeth removed at 6 as they were dead but refused to fall out. Her adult teeth are great and at 11 she has had no other problems.

Vanfurgstan, ds was already using 1450ppm toothpaste and the dentist prescribed the higher fluoride toothpaste for him.

Yes, we are still breastfeeding. It hadn't occurred to me that there is sugar in my milk, and she is on there a lot!!

there is plenty of info to show that bfeeding doesnt affect teeth, lots of discussion on other threads, some people do just have weaker enamel than others, if its the same with her big teeth when older she can have them coated i think?

but often its related to pregnancy or just genetic. there was another similar thread not long ago, it may be worth having a look through with the search bit, i cant remember the inof posted but there was good advice as always.

i think the key thing is water to drink, be careful of foods like raisins as they arent always good for teeth and teeth brushing morning and night.

No Glued it didn't occur to me either, but then I suppose in order to be a high-energy food I guess it makes sense to contain natural sugars along with all the other essentials.

DD has had no other problems regarding enamel and looking back breast milk was the one form of nutrition that was consistent throughout that period when the enamel was deteriorating.

I think how she was feed was the culprit, not breast milk in itself.
She was extremely clingy and seemed to feed on and off all day until she was about 2 - not ideal - but naively I thought breast milk would be as benign as water as far as teeth were concerned. Like I said, when I now think of the constituents of breast milk, it makes sense.

Ask your dentist about it - good luck.

A link to the other thread would be helpful, I did search topics but results are difficult to decipher on this phone!

Sorry fed

Glued, I have a nearly 3 yo DS (also bf to past 18 months) and he has a cavity in a molar which was first noticed at the dentist when he was 2y2m but we were given a very casual "wait and see" and then it actually caused him pain from 2y 6m. So, not the same problem as you have but I have some experience to offer about the next steps. Your own dentist will not be able to do any treatment on a toddler so you will likely be about to experience the referral rigmarole...

If I was back in the room on the visit when it was first picked up (October) I would now straight away demand a referral to a special-care dental service where they can do treatment under sedation. No idea why our dentist even let us infer that a cavity a third of the side of a molar was going to somehow repair itself.

The referral which was kicked off in January went around the houses (three different services were tried) and then the one which would take my DS had a six week waiting list. As it happens we have been so anal about brushing (3 times a day now!) that the utterly lovely NHS dentist at the specialist place we finally got to last week said that the active decay in the dentine layer seemed to have stopped, so she could put on a filling under G&A on next visit without having to drill away any decaying material.

Please feel free to PM me if you want the more specific story (and especially if you're anywhere near Herts!). good luck

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/childrens_health/1480634-Advice-needed-DD-needs-5-teeth-extracted-dentist-says-breastfeeding-to-blame - maybe this is the link mentioned earlier?!

i will have a look and see if i can find it, basically the way a bfed baby latches means the milk isnt on the teeth like it is bottle fed babies and actually some studies show bmilk actually strengthens teeth. its all to do with the kind of sugars as well, and the fact that bmilk doesnt pool in the mouth and sit there like it can do with a bottlefed baby.

and with regards to sugar, obviously fruit and fruit juices can be just as bad for teeth, so a 'healthy' diet isnt going to stop this problem, in some its just genetics at play but cleaning teeth regularly and not snacking and drinking water etc will all help.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/childrens_health/1480634-Advice-needed-DD-needs-5-teeth-extracted-dentist-says-breastfeeding-to-blame here you go this is the recent thread and there are links on it etc to show bfeeding is fine with regards to teeth.

oh someone just linked it!

Just to say, one of dd1's teeth was like this, she was premature and weighed only 4lbs 2 oz. Sadly that tooth had to be extracted, under general anaesthetic poor honey, but all the others are fine, and she's amazingly virtuous about tooth cleaning as she never wants to go through that again.

Stuff about breastfeeding is rubbish, as pp have said.

I would be happy to be proved wrong regarding the decay of DD's teeth - I have always felt guilty over the excessive feeding/feeding to sleep when it went beyond nutritional need and this would make me feel better.

However in terms of DD just being genetically predisposed to have weak enamel I'm just surprised she has had no other problems in the last five years with any of her adult teeth and it was just the two baby teeth where the nipple rested and milk pooled that were affected.

She refused anything to drink but water until she was 4, and we used a floride toothpaste as soon as her first teeth erupted. Three other DCs had a combination of breast and bottle, but none had the same longterm feeding pattern as DD and she was the only one with enamel problems. Coincidental - possibly. It all seemed a bit strange to be completely unrelated - but not impossible.

I wonder if dentists are still giving this advice?

DD has very weak and disintegrating enamel on her first teeth. She's 10y now and several of her milk teeth are/were affected. They are brown and some of the teeth are disintegrating or coming apart. The dentist has seen DD's over the years and it isn't from her diet or not looking after her teeth. Infact if anything we are more careful - esp with cleaning her teeth, as a result. DD has had to have one tooth removed as it just fell apart and was no longer stable.

One possibility I've been told is that the teeth may have been affected during pregnancy - illness in the mother can affect it as certain times in the pregnancy. I had pretty bad sickness for the first few months and this could be a cause apparently.

The positive news for us so far seems to be that the second/adult teeth she is now getting do not appear to be affected.

Although breastmilk is high in sugar it also contains compounds which kill bacteria, and can actually also help remineralise teeth. It's a common misconception amongst dentists but there is actually no good evidence to support the view.

Anyway, the nipple is at the back of the mouth when they feed (it stretches out when they latch), so milk doesn't wash around the teeth like you might expect.

Can't help on the explanation for your enamel issue though OP sorry.

The bacteria in the mouth that cause decay (largely strep mutans) treat a tiny bit of chocolate or a small biscuit in the same way as they would a glass of lucozade. If they are going to cause decay, they will do it with the smallest amounth of fermentable carbohydrate. Tea with one sugar is the same as tea with five sugars when it comes to causing decay.