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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

What do you reckon is the minimum qualification a nanny should have?

19 replies

HeadFairy · 05/05/2010 20:40

I'm just starting out looking for a nanny... been browsing the cvs on nannyjob.co.uk but I'm a bit clueless about the qualifications. What would the minimum qualification you would expect to look after a 10 month old and a three year old?

OP posts:
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Blondeshavemorefun · 05/05/2010 20:43

thing is there are so many

im from the old school of nneb and namcw - but these dont exsist anymore so if you have a nneb nanny you know they are 1) old ish 2) experienced

then think was changed to btec and nvq

but sure frakk will explain the quals

CoupleofKooks · 05/05/2010 20:46

i would look for experience and good references rather than a qualification, personally

azazello · 05/05/2010 20:48

I'd want someone who has done the first aid course as a minimum but otherwise experience and references would be better.

HeadFairy · 05/05/2010 21:29

yeah, I guess that makes sense, they can be qualified up to the eyeballs and only have actually worked five mins. First aid course is a good one, thanks for that azazello.

OP posts:
HeadFairy · 05/05/2010 21:51

I've been perusing some of the ads on nannyjob to get an idea of what to put, and forgive me if I'm being dim, but when people quote net prices ie £8 ph net, does that mean the nanny gets £8 ph and the employer has to pay the tax and NI on top of that?

OP posts:
Missus84 · 05/05/2010 22:00

I don't think a qualification is a necessity to be a good nanny (beyond paediatric first aid which is essential imo!) - if you need a nanny to be Ofsted registered then look for NNEB/NVQ3/BTEC though.

If you are looking at a 19 year old with a year's nursery or au pair experience, then I would want a qualification. A 25 year old with 5 years sole charge nanny experience, then the qualification wouldn't be so important imo.

Some parents find it important to have a degree educated nanny, regardless of the subject - some want someone warm and sensible and don't care if she has two GCSEs to rub together. It's quite a personal decision!

nbee84 · 05/05/2010 22:01

Yes. And there's also employers ni to be paid too.

nannynick · 05/05/2010 22:17

I'm being dim, but when people quote net prices ie £8 ph net, does that mean the nanny gets £8 ph and the employer has to pay the tax and NI on top of that?

Yes. So don't put salary as NET if you can help it... many nannies do know what Gross salaries are and there are PAYE Calculators around which will do the maths to convert between Gross and NET - this one also gives you Employers NI.

When employing a nanny (or anyone) you can't be certain what their taxcode will be, so if you agree a Net wage you don't know what it will actually cost you until you have their taxcode (taxcodes can change part-way through an employment and can change during the year typically as a result of The Budget).

The cost of employing a nanny is made up of several elements:
Gross Pay
Employees Tax
Employees NI
Employers NI

You DEDUCT Employees Tax and Employees NI from their Gross salary on HMRCs Behalf and send it to HMRC along with the Employers NI.

If you agree a NET wage then you are agreeing Gross Pay - (Employees Tax + Employees NI)
Think that's the right way to express it mathematically. Employees Tax and Employees NI will vary, even if the Gross remains the same, due to changes made by Government in The Budget.

nannynick · 05/05/2010 22:28

If you need a nanny to be Registered - so for example in England, registration with Ofsted would enable the nanny to accept Childcare Vouchers, then the nanny will need to meet the qualifications required by the scheme.

Qualifications List - Note: This site wasn't working when I just tried it. With luck when it does work it should list all recognised childcare qualifications.

I feel that ideally you want someone to have some knowledge of child development, healthy eating, and basic first aid. What you also need, which can't really be taught by a college course, is Common Sense. You will want a nanny who can think on their feet, not get too flustered when things go wrong, who will see your children as being the no.1 priority (so if things go wrong, the nannies instinct is to protect the children, do what they feel is best for the children at that time).

HeadFairy · 05/05/2010 22:55

thanks nannynick, that's really helpful. I hadn't thought about childcare vouchers, but of course that would be a better way of paying part of it, so I guess I need to find someone ofsted registered then.

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nannynick · 05/05/2010 23:11

Given you are starting out on the hunt for a nanny, put in the advert that they Must Already Be Ofsted Registered.
If you don't get very many applicants and it's getting close to time you need someone to start then remove that criteria. Ofsted registration can take several months - thus why I feel it's better asking for someone already registered as then you can quickly start using vouchers.

FrakkinTheReturningOfficer · 06/05/2010 06:55

You're optimistic, blondes! It was nearly midnight for me when you said that and I was sleeping!

Nicks linked to the list but there are a few main quals with their pros and cons.

NNEB (old style) - good blend of theory and practical placements but nannies with this will probably have a shedload of experience anyway

DCE (replaced the NNEB) - same structure pretty much but less acapdemically rigorous and some useful skills got dropped in favour of legislation aspects. Still an excellent qualification.

BTEC diploma (NB first certificate and certificate are a lower level) - very similar to the DCE but more academically focused. Still a lot of practical work but accepted as equivalent to 3 Alevels by unis for childhood related degrees.

NVQ - vocational based training, often done in a nursery. If you have someone who's done this as a nanny then you know they've been assessed and observed as a nanny, not as a nursery nurse or childminder - the assessment is different depending on the position.

Those are the most common level 3 qualifications which is generally accepted as desirable for a nanny.

You may also get CVs with a BTEC certificate, CCE or NVQ2. These are roughly equivalent to the first year of a level 3 and are billed as suitable for someone working under supervision. That said anyone with that and some experience would be fine as a sole charge nanny.

The minimum I would expect is the ICP or MNTs core skills course for OFSTED registration.

Going the other way you can get nannies with a level 4 cert in early years, a level 5 diploma or a full degree in early years or childhood. These nannies will be more clued up about theories of child development and national frameworks but it's not necessary IMO in a nanny! They often charge more too - so if I were getting a degree qualified nanny I'd get one with a degree in a different subject that had value added (like music [biased emoticon]) on the assumption that someone with a degree wanting to be a nanny has done some research into children and has experience! Degree educated nannies tend to value education quite highly which can be a good option for older school aged children however with a little one, unless they had short courses or significant experience with under 1s, you're probably better off with a level 3 qualified nanny who has a good broad base with plenty of supervised practical experience.

Less common are qualifications in preschool practice or playwork or Montessori method. Again no reason why they shouldn't make a perfectly good nanny but not as thorough as the traditional level 3s. You may also get people with bolt-ons like the MNT maternity practitioner award. Not a nanny qualification but does demonstrate commitment to childcare and continuing development. Also at level 3 but not broad spectrum - it's focused on newborns.

One to watch out for is the diploma in home based childcare. It's a real qualification, built on the ICP, but it's aimed at childminders with nannies bolted on so very heavy legislation-wise and goes into detail on observations and the national frameworks for EY education. No actual practical work with children is needed, there's no vocational assessment element and I would thoroughly grill anyone with that because I think it's a fundamentally flawed course.

I would also be wary of anything done via distance learning, even if it's edexcel or another exam board. The qualification may have expired but still be offered by a distance learning college. the NDAQ is your friend here

Far more important are the qualities nick mentioned - especially common sense - and experience. I wouldn't screen CVs based on a qualification unless they had less than 5 years experience as a nanny or had only worked with 1 age range. The biggest benefit of a qualification is they will have covered at least in theory, but probably also on placement, children of all ages and developmental stages. A nanny with 5 years exp may have had 5 1 year positions with 2-3 year olds, or 1 5 year position with a 3 yo and a newborn at the start. If neither had a qualification I'd be a lot more confident leaving children with the second as the first may never have dealt with a child outside that narrow age range.

sorry for the essay.

Blondeshavemorefun · 06/05/2010 07:33

see,knew you would be in the know, just as nick was/is

agree common sense/first aid/crb is a must and yes you get rubbish qual nannies as well as fab unqual nannies - also check to see if they have nanny insurance - to me a professinal nanny would always have this

FrakkinTheReturningOfficer · 06/05/2010 08:01

Well I've looked over so many CVs now I don't think there's a qualification I haven't seen! If I don't know something I feel compelled so find it out. Rather like a 2 year old who always wants to know 'whyyyy?'

But I totally understand the OPs dilemma. There are loads out there...

nannynick · 06/05/2010 13:57

In the past we established that many of the nannies who post on mumsnet have qualifications in subjects which are not childcare. For example a music degree, HND computing.
Perhaps we are the odd ones but I feel that it's the whole educational background that you should look at, rather than just childcare qualification. Children are with a nanny for a large amount of time, so you want your nanny to know about various different things. Surprising what questions a 4 year old can ask - how many lifts are there in the tallest building in the world and where is it? That's a recent question I've been asked. Hmm, def not childcare related.

Blondeshavemorefun · 06/05/2010 15:21

nick - Burj Khalifa and 54 - google is fab

wrinklyraisin · 06/05/2010 15:45

I have a Law degree and nigh on 12 years experience as a Nanny... I think it's horses for courses. Parents are all looking for different things and all have differing budgets. I cost a lot, someone qualified but only limited experience would cost less. Neither of us is the "better" nanny, we are just suitable for different family's needs IYSWIM.

HeadFairy · 06/05/2010 20:36

Frak - that's awesome, thanks so much. It's all so baffling and you've really helped! You've all been so helpful, if anyone knows of a nanny in Surrey who's looking for work starting in October do feel free to let me know

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sunshinenanny · 08/05/2010 12:08

When hiring a nanny, it is wise to go with your instincts. Regardless of qualifications
it is important that you have similar ideas on childcare and that the nanny and mother are compatible.

let the applicants spend a little time with your children and see how the child/children react towards her. Also talk to former employers and take as much notice of references as qualifications.

I've met many nannies during my working life and have seen wonderful nannies who are not formerly qualified and highly qualified nannies who have made me cringe and the opposite I might add!

HeadFairy, Where in Surrey are you based? don't need to give address, just general area.

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