Advice on nanny looking after infectious DC

[GCM]

We have a live out nanny for our 5 yr old, who has got chicken pox. DS is rather poorly today and is wanting mum all the time, so I've decided to take tomorrow off so I can be at home with him.

His nanny tells me she's never had chicken pox, so I told her she may as well stay away. (I will obviously pay her as usual).

On Wed my diary is pretty light, so I'm intending to work from home. Hopefully DS will be a bit better by then.

Thurs is my last work day of the week, but I have stuff I really need to go in for. I hope by then DS will be getting over it a bit, but I assume he will still be infectious.

Is it fair to expect my nanny to look after him on Thurs, even though she might catch it? (Both DH and I had it when we were kids).

Does anyone have any idea how infectious it is? The web sites say very... nightmare scenario would be nanny is off sick next week with chicken pox - though obviously don't want her to get it either!

Should I hire a agency nanny whose already had chicken pox for Thursday? On the other hand, am relunctant to leave DS with a new nanny when he is off colour...

Help! Advice appreciated!

I think it is always safer to double check your own immunity to things. You can get a blood test to check. I always believed I had had chicken pox as my mother was adamant that I had had it. But a pre-pregnancy health check which included a blood test revealed that I hadn't had chicken pox (not usually a part of standard blood tests so needs to be specifically requested).

Immunisation requires two injections spaced out so not of much use to you at the moment, OP, but quite foolish of a nanny IMO not to think of checking whether they had had the standard childhood diseases. As others have said, your nanny has already been in contact with your child while infectious anyway, so you need to be prepared for her getting sick. I would definitely go the SSP as chicken pox is really an expected illness for a child to contract at some point.

Alot of people who think they have never had it are immune to it-they either have had it as a small child and cant remember or they had such a mild case it went unnoticed.
Part of a nannies job imo is to look after ill children.In fact alot of parents will pick a nanny over any other childcare setting for that very reason.
If she really hasnt had chicken pox then imo she has been stupid in not getting vaccinated against it.As its contagious before spots breaking out etc and its such a widespread childhood illness then it goes without saying that she will be in contact with it.Either by her charges or her charges friends.
If she still claims she has never had it then I prob wouldnt have her come in.If she got it and then was seriously ill ou would prob feel guilty.But I would say you need someone for thurs and if she cant do it then you'll need to get someone else.if she cant come in then I would point out the inconvenience and advise that she looks into vaccination for the future

Strix wrote:

I think that normal childhood illnesses are fair game.

I agree.

But, if I took the kids off on an exotic holiday and they picked up something contageous, then I would not expect nanny to work.

I also agree there.

I'm just amazed that someone who works as a nanny has not prepared herself for exposure to chicken pox, which is certainly a forseeable circumstance -- especially in a country where children are not routinely immunised for CP.

I agree with you there as well. In this particular nannies case, she has not have CP and thus should be taking some precautions against getting it as an adult. However she may not know what precautions can be taken - according to the NHS site, the vaccine is for health care workers and those caring for a child with a weakened immune system. It doesn't say anyone can request it... so if someone did want it, would they have to get it privately?

I am not sure why the OP is offering their nanny the choice to work or not work. If an employer offers a choice, then they must expect that their employee may choose not to work. If the employer Expects the employee to work, then no choice is being given and it is up to the employee to decide if they really need to take a days leave (be that paid as annual leave, or unpaid) and taking such a day off would be at the discretion of the employer.

Out of curiosity Nick, what if you caught the flu in the course of your nanny duties, but not actually from the child you look after?

Lost me there... what's flu got to do with things? People can catch flu repeatedly, whereas CP is typically a one-time event (though some people may get it more than once).

If a nanny gets the flu to the extent that they are too unwell to go to work, then they take the day off sick, or as annual leave (depending on what their employer agrees).

When i last employed a nanny,admittedly 10 years ago I asked them at interview specifically about this point ,i.e.what childhood illnesses had they had ,what experience had they had of looking after a child with the normal childhood illnesses etc.I did exclude one candidate because she looked so horified at the idea of having to clear up vomit,I stress this was for a sole care position,so goodness knows what she would have done.Called me home to clear up presumably.I also gave them a scenario of a sick child and asked them to talk me through how they would approach the situation eg temperature, fluids, call me etc.For me this was a huge part of the selection process this person would have responsibility for my child and I wanted to be sure they could cope in good and bad situations .This came home to me when my 2 year old fell in the park and cut his head when with my nanny....she was fantastic by the way probably better than I would have been!!

I prefer to look after my children myself when ill but if you work that is not always possible ,for me being able to know that the child was snuggled up safe at home with a trusted carer was a big reason for choosing a nanny over other childcare options.I did have a clause re caring for a sick child in the contract,cannot remember the exact phrasing though.

I'd cancel Thrusday and let her come back next week by which time he won't be contagious. Surely better a day or two's inconvenience than to risk her catching it and being off longer.

can't you ask her to go and get the Jab and you'll see her on Thursday?

I would have suggested what you said LIZS.

Our dd has chicken pox too and obivously she's off nursery. I would in no way expect all of their workers to have had chicken pox.

How ever.

Thanks to your posters becasue DH hasn;t had the pox and we hadn;t realised there were blood tests or anything... so we are ringing the GP.

Poor sod has been like he's on death row and waiting to get ill....

My DP never had chicken pox as a child - he caught it as an adult and it developed into shingles. He ended up very ill and was signed off work for a month.

mumblecrumble - a bit late now for your DP if your child has CP right now I think! From memory my two shots were about a month apart.

Missus84 - Interestingly, I have read that adults get an immunity 'boost' from coming into contact with children with CP and so are less likely to get shingles. In the US the incidence of shingles has gone up because children are immunised against CP rather than catching it naturally and so adults are not getting their 'boost'.

I have a clause in my contract about sick children which refers to natural or acquired immunity and specifies full pay if I catch illness from the children. Will look it out (aka boot up computer) and post it. I give permission for people to include it in contracts if they wish

"The nanny will care for the children whilst they are sick if required to do so by the employer, providing she has natural or acquired immunity to any infectious disease (a full list can be provided upon request) excluding the common cold, gastroenteritis, and influenza. If the nanny does not have natural or acquired immunity to the infectious disease she shall be within her rights to refuse to care for the child for the duration of the disease at full pay."

"SSP shall apply for all periods of sickness excepting where the nanny contracts an illness as a result of caring for the employer?s children. Then she shall receive full pay until recovered and the time off will not be taken out of her paid holiday."

I have had most childhood diseases and been vaccinated against lots of random tropical diseases so if they come down with something I haven't had/been vaccinated against it's probably going to be rare enough that they're in hospital or serious enough that I won't risk my health.

I will care for children with flu, a cold or a gastro but if I come down with it as a result then I want to be paid!

Myself and my hubby both hadn't had chicken pox as a child and we assumed we were immune as everyone else seems to think about adults that say they haven't had it. We both caught it when our children had it and we were so ill. It was an awful time. If you disbelieve things your nanny says then you shouldn't trust her with your children.

My mother was certain that I had CP as a child, seems not as I caught it as an adult and was very ill for a month and bear dreadful scars from it.
If your nanny genuinely hasn't had it, I can understand her reluctance to be exposed to it . That said in her job with lots of child contact I would have thought that she would have been immunised as a priority.
Still if she catches it from your child, I think you are morally obliged to pay her in full.

A few years ago i loooked after a boy with chicken pox i've had it and it didn't bother me at all, we were all staying with family in the counrty and my boss sent me and her son back to London and o looked after him on my own. I ended up getting a bad virus and had to have some time off but these things just happen. When you are a nanny it just goes with the job i reckon.

care assistants have to care for people who are sick and usually don't get paid for time off when they inevitably catch it.

Nannies are spoilt.

No coldtits - nannies have a different job. With different contracts, which very wildly even among the profession.

DOH! VARY not very. Spotted that mistake too late

People here are very quick to assume that she must have had it. I 'assumed' the same thing and had a ruined Christmas 2 years ago.

If she says she hasn't had it, then I'd be inclined to believe her.

Having a different job with a different contract does not mean that the terms of a nanny's job don't lead to spoilt expectations from the nanny.

Full pay because you caught a cold from a sick child that you're contract bound to care for?

Bloody hell, try that in ANY other job. It's a MASSIVE privilege and should be treated as such, not a basic right to be conferred upon the attainment of an NNEB. Anyone believing this should be standard practice is spoilt!

Most nannies go into work unless they really, really can't. Firstly we know that we're difficult to replace and secondly it's simple for us to take it easy at work. Personally I'd never take time off for a cold, I've had to keep working through a horrible gastro bug because both parents were out the country and the only time I have had off sick was with swine flu when I was forbidden from working for a week otherwise I'd have been back after 10 days. Plus the family were down with it too so for at least 3 days it wasn't like my bosses were working. IME the majority of nannies work unless signed off and some do so even then.

You do get skivers like any job and you probably read about a majority of those on MN. There are plenty more good nannies out there.

If you have genuinely caught something as a result of nannying - and I'm not talking about colds here - then why shouldn't you be paid? I've never had an employer negotiate that with me, I don't get paid for my own unrelated sickness and a lot of the time I've been live in so I'm at work, sick or not, and unless I'm delirious or so contagious the door has to stay shut they may as well leave the children with me.

i went to work with flu a few years ago, it came on mon night, i worked tue and wed and literally wed strugled in and mb came home at 4pm after her meeting, i then died in bed for 4 days as only work mon-wed

thinking back i did look after my dc last year who had an infectious illness that i hadnt ever had - scarlet fever - she was off school 2 weeks

nannies arent asking for sick pay for a cold but if look after a child with severe S&D then come down with it a day later, is it fair that we dont get paid?

my friend caught S&D 2 days later after looking after a child with S&D, had 3 days in bed, lost a stone and her mb paid her ssp which was about £20 a day - she was seriously out of pocket