Some concerns about CM

[whatdodo]

My DC's (dear child) CM is very well qualified, committed and highly enthusiastic. And DC really seems to love CM and vice versa, which I've always seen as a good thing.

However, there are a few things about CM's behaviour that have irritated orupset me for a while (I know, I should have said something sooner) and a few things recently have made me extremely worried.

Here are the things that have upset me (there are more, but I'm worried that my CM might read and recognise!) -

CM overly (IMO) clingy/affectionate, always insisting on a kiss before leaving, and always doing it full on the lips
Continuing to hold onto DC even once I've arrived to pick up, and continuing to act like the one in charge , even though DC will put out arms to me
Talking out loud, in public, about DC putting hands down top and touching breasts
Telling me (more than once) about how DC puts head between breasts and bounces it around saying 'boobies' (I know this isn't an unusual thing to happen, but I'd rather not be told over and over again!)
Talking about how DC is good at xyz because of CM's actions, rather than mine
Blowing on bottom for a good while to help nappy rash
Hanging around for far too long after dropping off, albeit talking about DC and the day they've had

I was feeling slightly irritated or upset by some of these things but let it go because I didn't want to come across as being a clingy mother. But DC now more often than not comes back with very red lips and bum and has started getting upset in sleep/saying no no no ... Plus there's the talk of body parts.

They always say trust your instinct and my instinct is telling me something isn't quite right ... but maybe I'm allowing my upset about some of CMs actions to expand into something bigger in my mind, possibly due to recent media coverage and because, well, it's every parent's worst nightmare, isn't it?

Honest feedback really needed, and soon ...

I'm new to childminding so don't have as much experience as others here but thought I would answer your post.
** CM overly (IMO) clingy/affectionate, always insisting on a kiss before leaving, and always doing it full on the lips.

I don't know if you would find me too clingy (I hope not!) but I do say to all the children (or sometimes the parents say it)give me a kiss and a cuddle bye bye. Sometimes I get a kiss on the lips normally because the child put it there, but when I kiss them I kiss on the cheek or head - mainly due to germs!

**Continuing to hold onto DC even once I've arrived to pick up

That's a bit odd but could be innocent; I generally hold the children (if not walking) while I chat to the parents unless it's clear the child wants to go down/to parent. That's because as soon as you hand the child over they want all the attention on them as they haven't seen their parents all day and the handover doesn't get done properly.

** and continuing to act like the one in charge

In my house I am the one in charge when parents are here. I find this time can be tricky and is often when a child 'play up' as they want to see who is in charge. I like to think I work with parents through rather than coming across as commanding.

** Talking out loud, in public, about DC putting hands down top and touching breasts

That's a bit odd, but if it was anything weird wouldn't she be keeping it quiet? Some people just have no, I'm not sure what the word is, but social awareness of when to stop wittering on?

**Telling me (more than once) about how DC puts head between breasts and bounces it around saying 'boobies'

Again a bit odd, but maybe she is worried that the child is saying boobies a lot and doesn't want you to think she has been encouraging anything odd? Like, "it's all her doing this bobbies habit, not mine!" IYSWIM?

**Talking about how DC is good at xyz because of CM's actions, rather than mine

Obviously I'm not you, but if I put myself in your position with you worries about everything then I would start to feel defensive. What is she actually saying to make you think she feels like this?

**Blowing on bottom for a good while to help nappy rash

Personally I wouldn't do this, mainly because I don't want pee or poo in my eye! What does a good while mean?

**Hanging around for far too long after dropping off, albeit talking about DC and the day they've had

I chat to my parents for ages mainly because I don't want them to feel like I'm rushing them in and out. How is she with other parents?

The red lips cold be from nappy rash? And I don't know what you mean about the sleep/saying no no no.

To me it feels like something else has triggered these thoughts? But these little things have 'backed up' this bigger trigger / made you more sort of hyper aware of something.

If you're gut instinct is telling you something is off then you absolutely should withdraw your child and you should report it. If there is nothing going on then she has nothing to worry about. If someone reported me for this sort of thing I would like to think I wouldn't bat an eyelid, if people don't report then the system is useless isn't it and vulnerable children go unprotected.

I think the problem with blowing on the bottom is having her face so near your childs private parts for a prolonged period makes you uncomfortable? It would me!

For nappy rash the best thing to do is dry the area with a tissue after wiping to remove moisture. Then put cream on. After I read this piece of advice my dd never had another reddened bottom.

Good post Navy, I agree with it all actually. The odd things could just be the way she expresses herself?

As for the blowing on bum, I just wanted to make it clear (in case people wondered) that my face is no closer 'down there' than when I'm not blowing, I don't get close and blow, I just blow from where I am gently and only for the time it takes to get the cream on. Doing it for ages shouldn't help any more than what I do as they're ok again once the cream is on.

Sorry, you can probably tell I'm now paranoid people think I have my face up their bottoms or something!!! lol

I must admit I'd like to hear more about the sleep and no,no,no comment as that was the thing that made me wonder about her tbh.

X'd post - I do dab with the fresh nappy to dry it but still find that when they are in that sort of discomfort (as I've said before, it's not happened many times at all), it's not until the cream is on that they feel better, the gentle blow is just to cool it down (as hot) whilst sorting the cream out.

Yes, looneytune, I assumed it was that. Just found it very odd.

I'm clearly odd then

I didn't say that.

You can find things odd without finding the person who does it odd.

I did mean DD's vaginal lips were sore.

Navy, I think you've hit the nail on the head. All the things can be explained satisfactorily. Including the crying in sleep (not been well recently).

In a nutshell and on reflection I don't think there is anything untoward happening. But I do feel the arrangement isn't working because I don't feel comfortable - with the over-familiarity with DD and the fact that the trust has gone (rightly or wrongly) - so I will give notice. If I really felt there was something awful happening, I wouldn't hesitate to report it.

Many thanks everyone for your thoughts and views.

Ok

I do the same on my own hands when they get sore. When hot and inflamed the only thing (other than soaking in cold water) that makes them better is a gentle blow on them to cool them down. I know if I had anyone looking after my ds2 and he had a sore and hot bottom, I'd want them to do this if it helped. But I appreciate that's because I know I do it and there is nothing odd about it. Having said that, it doesn't mean this other CM isn't doing something else if she's blowing for a long time - I don't see the need to do it for ages. Yes, I used to have a very little mindee who would spend maybe 20 mins on a changing mat to air her bottom and for a good kick about with bare bum but that was on the mums request and tbh, quite a normal thing for that sort of age. But that was before she started rolling etc!

Anyway, back to the OP......these things could be innocent or something more but regardless, if you feel comfortable then you need to leave. As for whether or not to report....I'd need more info on the upset when sleeping/no,no,no thing before I know whether or not it needs reporting. It's so hard when you don't know the person. You know this person much better and if your instinct is saying that something isn't right then you can't just ignore that for the sake of others.

Not sure if confused emoticon was in response to my post but just in case it was ...

After thinking some more, and considering all advice, I really think that it's just the case that the CMs way isn't how I would like things to be done. Not in every respect, but in some. So I will give notice period, keep it amicable and take no action.

Thanks all.

Do you feel able to call NSPCC for some advice like I suggested whattodo? If these things are really making you that uncomfortable that you've needed to post about it here (unless you have reason to think you are being totally paranoid) then you really shouldn't just brush it under the carpet, as there are I assume other children in her care?

and LT you aren't odd, I used to do that on my own children, to cool the area. Not sure if I would on a mindee as never had one with that really hot red raw rash before - not something I would think about if the occasion arose I suppose, just automatically do, so please don't think you are odd!

Thankyou That's just it, never thought anything of it. Only happened a few times when teething and they've had one of those sorts of nappies that react straight away (or they did during naptime). Pleased I'm not odd, just the natural instinct thing wants to make them better.

I wrote a long reply and then saw the update... so I'll just repeat what AvadaKedavra has said - do please call the NSPCC helpline and have a chat with them. They can help determine if the things you have noticed are significantly concerning to warrant further investigation.

Also, if the nappy rash does not clear up quickly... do go and see your daughters GP. Talk to them about the circumstances, see if they feel it's just bad nappy rash, or if there is something more.

That's a good idea about GP actually Nick. One of my mindees was getting bad nappy rash and turned out it was tomatoes not agreeing with them. Once they stopped eating cherry toms, they were much better!

Again, I never said you were odd looneytune.

I know, I gave you a smile back although you may not have noticed as think there was a post after yours. All is fine. I was just feeling paronoid as so many people reacted as if it was strange

NSPCC number 0808 800 5000

Quick blow on nappy rash from a distance before popping a new nappy on - not a problem.

Kissing on the lips - I don't even kiss my own DD on the lips (but that's a whole other debate).

Other stuff - sounds a bit odd. You are there, so use your gut instinct to tell you if it needs a simple meeting with the CM, or reporting to the NSPCC.

Whatdodo DH and I took my dc to the GP after another mindee at the childminder's lifted up her skirt and said "touch me" to dc. I felt like I was being completely paronoid and OTT but GP reassured me that I had done the right thing as, in her words, you only get one chance. There were no signs of abuse and it really put my mind at rest.

You should take her to your GP. They are trained to spot the physical signs of abuse.

I think all the boob business is completely inappropriate, I would be livid if a cm encouraged that sort of thing, in fact it is her job to teach and encourage the right sort of behaviour.

As for blowing on bottoms, I wouldn't even blow on my own dcs bottoms! But I do fan with a nappy...

It's so difficult to trust anyone with very small dcs as they can't talk and tell you if something is wrong. Whatsmore they have absolutely no idea of right and wrong.

I would chat to her about your concerns.

WRT the blowing on the bottom. I used to do this to my own children to ease their nappy rash. Nappy rash is very hot and burns, blowing helps cool it down before you have to touch it again with the cream. If it's cooler the cream also isn't such a shock when it touches. I've never blown on a mindees bottom but I never had a mindee with terrible nappy rash either. To be honest I possibly would have done it instinctively just to soothe the little one before reading this thread. Now I doubt I would, but before it wouldn't have occurred to me that people would link me soothing a sore bottom to anything untoward... (face well away from sore 'under-bits' too!)

WRT kissing on the lips. I used to insist all mindees kissed me on the cheek if they wanted to kiss me and I'd kiss their cheeks or the top of their heads. Their parents all thought I was mad and when I explained it was for child protection they said 'but I'm standing right here, I can see you're not doing anything wrong don't be so daft!!'. Nowadays I think nothing of giving them a quick peck on the lips as they leave if THEY want a kiss on the lips, otherwise it's on the cheek. If they try 'smooching' I blow a quick raspberry and then wriggle out of their hold laughing and saying 'oh no you don't smoochy kisses are just for mummies'.

I always think parent should go with their gut instinct and if your instinct is telling you something is wrong then go with it. Take your DC to the docs about her sore areas and see what doc says perhaps? At best doc could prescribe some cream and at worst it would detect any possibly abuse...

have you decided to remove your child op? i do hope so. i hope you don't mind me jumping in this conversation but i have been lurking and feel i must post. there are a lot of alarm bells ringing for me and i would definately take my dd to see the gp if i were in your position. does the cm care for other children?

ok am i confused here - i don't believe the OP - i think this is a TROLL - i mean come on does no-one else think this? really?

if my child was going to childminder and i had even the slightest feeling something "wrong" was happening i wouldn't be asking advice about it on mumsnet especially if i thought my CM posted on this board.

if i'm wrong i'm sorry but i'm trusting my gut feelings.

echo sentiments already expressed . regardless of whether anythings dubious it all sounds very unprofessional. any self respecting childcare person keeps a healthy distance. hugs are one thing .Kisses are another. Find another carer and fast. you dont have to say exactly why you are not happy. I would ring up your local authority and ask to speak to your local CM Co-ordinator. They link to the CMs and try to standardise policy into practice. They really should know about your concerns and will be able to help you find another CM. BTW I wouldnt let her look after my DC. Good luck. keep us posted