CM Club: how can i tactfully suggest to a mum that her DS may have a problem?

[Numberfour]

I have minded a nearly 5 yr old boy for about 6 months now. I am sure that i have posted on here before about his lack of cooperation and how he just does NOT listen to me. The teachers at school are also aware of this and have the boy on some listening "training" programme.

He has had a hearing test and there are no problems. He also has had a session with a SALT who oddly enough said that she is not able to help him at the moment because he is not listening properly yet. She said to the parents that they must speak slower to the child and also suggested that the reason for the child's speech defect (bad diction) could be because he speaks too quickly. I think that that is nonsense (but I am not a SALT so I may be talking nonsense myself.....)

however, I have done a little reading and I think that the boy may have Auditory Processing Disorder.

So, my question is how do I raise this with the parents? The boy's daily diary I do for him is littered with reports of not listening, not cooperating, struggling to follow instructions, running off and not stopping, etc etc etc.

How should I handle this?

IME looking into Auditory Processing Disorder may not get you very far with the NHS in this country, it's still not that well known. Could there be a more fundamental problem with this child's receptive language? I was convinced that my language delayed child had APD - he seemed to display all the symptoms apart from pronunciation problems, but as his receptive language improved a lot of the APD symptoms went away. Are the parents aware that you have limited the activities around this boy's behaviour, as this sort of info is important to pass on to the professionals.

Carry on plugging away with simple sentences, backing up instructions with visual cues etc, and hope things improve, if there are underlying issues there may be no quick fix.

Thanks, Total, I don't actually think that I have made the parents aware that I have had to curtail certain activities because their DS is with me. Good point to let them know.

And I appreciate your advice - I must admit that I have not heard of receptive language so will have a read up about that.

receptive language is just the technical term for understanding of language.

okay, thanks. of course: the receiving of the communication.

Hello. I'm not a childminder, and my DS is at nursery, but just wanted to say that I am very surprised and concerned that the parents weren't interested in an idea which could tie together all the issues their DC has. After all, what parents want to think their child is naughty or useless, unless they have just given up?! I hope to God the latter is not the case.

On the other hand, it could be an example of what Ben Goldacre is talking about in his book Bad Science: because of the way science is presented (no discussion, just leading by "experts" who may be celebrities, or leading by celebrities themselves), science and medicine starts to become a matter of convictions, rather than evidence. I understand that many people feel diempowered by the way medical matters are discussed, way above the heads of "the likes of us", sometimes not even explained, but it's crazy when people start to use their own ignorance as evidence that their feelings are "genuine", while the "experts" are just trying to lord it over someone with less education.

Could this be the dynamic affecting the parents you are talking about, Numberfour?

BTW, we have a spare copy of Bad Science, if anyone's interested.

Wingedvictory, I am not sure what you mean by Bad Science? Do you mean that perhaps the parents are convincing themselves that all is well, but not taking note of the situation that faces them? Apologies for missing your meaning.

Please don't get me wrong about the parents - they are good, loving, kind people who involve their DS in lots of great activities. But they seem to miss the point when it comes to his behaviour. He has been in trouble at school a number of times, but the parents say that the school is at fault in one way or another. Very odd.

That's sad about the parents blaming school.

In answer to your question, I was talking about the book Bad Science, by Ben Goldacre. In his introduction, he says: "Today, scientist and doctors find themselves outnumbered and outgunned by vast armies of individuals who feel entitles to pass judgment on matters of evidence [...] without troubling themselves to obtain a basic understanding of the issues." He goes on to say that people end up deciding "which expert to believe" based on conviction, because so often science issues are just presented in media as slanging matches, with the two sides attacking one another, rather than attacking one another's evidence, which would be more helpful. In such situations, he points out, ordinary people feel totally left out, and some end up rebelling against the snooty "experts" who just say "that is that." It's a brilliant book, and quite funny in places, too!

makes sense, yes - see what you mean.

i don't think that this is the case with these parents. i think it is simply a case of them not wanting to acknowledge that their child may have some type of additional need.

i have had no feedback at all from the parents about the info i gave them. all i can do is wait and see if there is any progress and if not, I will have to make a decision about whether i am able to continue to childmind a little boy who does not listen to me, who has no regard for my authority and whose attendance means I have to choose not to go on certain outings because of the possibility that he may endanger himself or my other mindees by not paying attention to my instructions.

what does your behaviour policy say, No4?

Does it cover this?

my behaviour policy (which, like all my policies is in dire need of an overhaul) makes no mention of the consequences of repeat offenders!

if i knew that he was just a brat (is a childminder allowed to use language like that??? ) and if he was devious or just good old fashioned naughty, he would have been out the door months ago. it is because i do believe that there is something not quite right, that I am for the time being persevering. he is not an unlikeable boy, just very, very hard to manage.

ah

You could make a mental timetable, and say to yourself if things have not improved by x (easter??) then give notice

You have to balance the needs of all the children in your care, and at the moment the balance is tilted against the other children

good luck

thanks for the advice, BALD. i think i will follow up the info leaflet with a letter setting out my difficulties, how i hope that in working together things can improve and then will terminate at the end of the term if things do not improve.

Sorry I had the wrong end of the stick. It was worth a suggestion!

Good luck with your plan to make things right.

thanks, WingedVictory. i really appreciate everyone's input and advice.

thanks!

There is a boy with very similar issues in ds' class. He is getting better but it's been a tough first 18m at school. His language is improving, (speech is mechanical and simple) but he still will wilfully disobey instruction and provoke others by being too physical.

Dh told me that I should not help his mum when she occasionally needs to get to work early by taking her ds to school as I cannot guarantee his safety - last time he ran off down the road - and I was using my best stern voice! Think I told him off x4 in the space of 15 minutes! But how on earth to say that to his mother?

And fwiw, although the family mostly rely on family to care for him in the holidays, our cm has said she has refused to have him as he would cause too much conflict with her other mindees and her own children.

Not at all!

the child is driving me round the bend.

i asked, begged, said, raised my voice at LEAST 8 times during the short walk from school door to car to walk, not run, hop, skip. Just walk.

AAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH

not a word from mum and dad re the literature i gave them. i think it is time for a letter.

I am really impressed that you've stuck it this long but he's making you miserable - is it really worth it? We are supposed to enjoy work just like anyone else but you aren't, I would suggest terminating the contract, it's not giving up on him it is just getting your own enjoyment back.

terminate the contract on grounds of safety.. if the child is at serious risk when you are out and about, because he is uncontrollable, then I would contact the parents and accept no further responsibility for their child.. you are only the cm.., they are the parents and they have to fezz up and parent..

As lollipop says work shouldnt be like this.. working with children should be fun!

thanks for the advice, lollipop and thebody. last night i said to mum at pick up time that he again did not walk properly with me etc etc etc. and that he landed up having time out for snatching (i think i was harsh there...)

don't want to go into detail otherwise the situation could be recognisable. but it seems the family is under the impression that all is well except when he is with me. clearly the school is giving inadequate feedback, and the SALT's opinion has been completely ignored.

the letter will be emailed today, i think

Oh God, definitely terminate then, I couldn't be dealing with that at all - if you weren't enjoying it before I bet you are gutted now