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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

WWYD - pregnant nanny

37 replies

NannyDilemma · 16/02/2010 09:51

Hi, I'm an occasional poster but have namechanged for this.

I am about to hire a nanny. Great interview, glowing references, have now verbally offered her the job and sent out an offer in writing to her last week. However, this morning she called me to say although she wants to accept the job, she wanted to let me know she's almost 4 months pregnant and hoped that was ok.

Now I'm not sure what to do or what I can do. The nanny did not disclose this information at interview, and when I asked her future plans she said she was looking for a long term position.

We're looking for quite odd, part time hours so the position wasn't easy to fill, but I'm obviously not keen to hire someone who will leave in 4 or 5 months.

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

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LynetteScavo · 16/02/2010 09:53

Does she intend on leaving, though?

EffiePerine · 16/02/2010 09:53

I thin it's very good of her to tell you in advance (she has no obligation to). What are her long term plans? When woul dshe start her ML? Is she planning to return to work afterwards?

Not sure of the legal implications of having made an offer in writing if you do decide to withdraw it.

Original poster

NannyDilemma · 16/02/2010 09:55

Well, any of the options will be quite disruptive and will involve finding a replacement whether she wants to come back or not.

OP posts:

HappyMummyOfOne · 16/02/2010 09:57

I dont think there is anything you can do if you have sent her a formal offer, you cant withdraw it as shes pg.

A little morally wrong of her knowing you were looking for long term childcare and she will only be with you for 4 months before going on maternity and leaving you to find a temp nanny to cover her.

Does she expect to return with her own child?

LynetteScavo · 16/02/2010 10:01

Maybe she only jun found out she is pg, in which case, I actually think it's good of her to tell you. She is giving you a get out clause really before she starts the job, which is nice of her.

Or mabey she's applied for lots of jobs, and is now telling numerous people she is pg,a dn taking them all to court.

Blondeshavemorefun · 16/02/2010 10:01

cheeky nanny

she should have disclosed this at the interview,unless she has just found out?

would you be happy for her to return with her own baby?

you say that the hours are odd,so if everything else is ok with the nanny (and assume it is or you wouldnt have offered the job) then i would seriously consider keeping her on, finding a temp for 3/4months

i dont think you would have to pay smp as hasnt been with you long enough (think it works out you need to be in a job for 2weeks before you can claim it) but flowerly is the one to ask

frakkinaround · 16/02/2010 10:09

I don't know when people have an obligation to disclose pregnancy but I know that they do at some point.

I think whether you will let her return with own child will be key to her making the decision. If you won't then I suspect she might not want to take the job. So maybe the answer for now is to call her back, say 'I've been thinking about this and I'm not sure I want a nanny bringing her own child along. What would your position be if I said you couldn't bring him/her back with you?'. That should at least give you more stalling time to investigate the legals and there's absolutely nothing questionable about what you're doing because she has no right to bring baby too.

kitkat1967 · 16/02/2010 14:10

Hi,
As you have offered the job I don't think you can do anything about it now.

I have had 2 nannies who got pregnant (over 9 year period though!!) and it can be a nightmare. The current one is still on maternity leave and had given me the impression she would return when SSMP ran out - now I find she does not want to come back yet (and can't be made to say when she will come back)- after 'managing' for 9 months I simply cannot cope any more as it is affecting my job. For the first time ever I have reached the point where I do not know how I can carry on with my job - and of course I cannot replace her.
I may be cynical but I suspect the first thing she wil do after 12 months off is to request to take all the accrued holiday.
So I would say it's a minefield and best avoided if at all possible.

mranchovy · 16/02/2010 14:48

You cannot legally withdraw the offer: this would be unlawful discrimination.

She will not be entitled to SMP (which is a shame because you get 104.5% of this back from the government), but will be entitled to normal maternity rights.

FabIsGoingToBeFabIn2010 · 16/02/2010 14:52

I think it is unfair of her to get herself a job, then announce it and the potential employer has to suck it up.

Hasn't the job offer now become redundant as you were offering it on the basis of staying long term and now there will have to be a break?

I think it is wrong.

FabIsGoingToBeFabIn2010 · 16/02/2010 14:53

And if she is saying she wants to accept the job and hopes it is okay, isn't she expecting a negative response?

starberries · 16/02/2010 15:22

I would bank on the fact this nanny has been deceitful. She probably has been telling employers up-front she's pregnant and finding that no one will hire her so she's done it underhand. I know there are cases where nearly 4-months-pregnant women 'just found out' but in this case I think it's unlikely.

I wouldn't offer her the job on the basis she was untruthful in the beginning, and also that you stated (presumably) you are looking for long-term care and this won't suit. I'd be very if this were me.

frakkinaround · 16/02/2010 15:53

Another thing to consider - why is she looking for a new job at 4 months PG?

stealthsquiggle · 16/02/2010 16:05

It's too late not to offer her the job - and as others have said, it would amount to discrimination if you withdraw the offer. She doesn't have to tell you yet (quite - I am trying to remember the deadline and can't)

You're a bit stuck, I think. Is she well plugged in to the nanny network - might she be able to help find her own maternity cover?

mranchovy · 16/02/2010 16:24

Let me reprase that: it would be unlawful to withdraw the offer for a reason related to her pregnancy. It would not be unlawful to withdraw it if the job is no longer available, because for example you have found a nursery or childminder place for your child.

Strix · 16/02/2010 16:27

There is a simple solution here. AS you have made a formal offer, you must honor it. But.... (and someone is going to shoot me for saying this but it is perfectly legal) if your offer does not explicitly say you have offered her a permanent position, write the contract for a fixed term position and make the term end when she wants to bugger off on maternity leave... say 2 weeks before due date? Then, you are under no obligation to save the job for her until her return from "matenity leave".

You will have to accommofdate her pregnancy with things like H&S asseessment, ante natal appointments, etc.

And, to be honest, I think she had to tell you if she is 4 months pregnant... can't remember though when you are requred to tell your employer and hand over that MATB whatever it's called form. But, I think it's around 4 months.

Anyway, just write a fixed term contract and you are largely off the hoook.

juneybean · 16/02/2010 16:33

Off top of my head think they have to tell you 15 weeks before the EWC which would then be 25 weeks pregnant, assuming she's about 16 weeks then no she had no obligation to tell you.

She won't be entitled to SMP as blondes already said you have to have worked 2 weeks before falling pregnant, something like 42 weeks before the EWC.

Strix · 16/02/2010 16:36

And to be perfectly honest, if I was pregnant and I needed a job, I would tell you because of course I wouldn't get the job. So, I wouldn't hold that against her. And, if she told you and was not required to, then I would appreciate her honesty.

Strix · 16/02/2010 16:37

sorry, CORRECTION:

And to be perfectly honest, if I was pregnant and I needed a job, I wouldn't tell you because of course I wouldn't get the job.

WildSeahorses · 16/02/2010 17:03

Why now write a trial period into her contract? Then you can see what she's like - if you/your DC don't like her, you can get rid on that basis. But if you think she's good, you could keep her on.

littlestarschildminding · 16/02/2010 17:50

What strix said...great solution. That way she gets her job while she is pregnant but you are not obliged to keep her through her maternity etc
Not strictly legal or morally correct Im sure. But would work for me!!

mranchovy · 16/02/2010 18:43

Good grief Strix, it is hard to think of anything more discriminatory than what you suggest!

However, I am going to have to wave a big flag here and say that I am wrong. I completely forgot about the domestic employees exception in the Sex Discrimination Act.

So you can tell her she can't have the job after all.

Interesting isn't it that a class of employers that are nearly all working mothers themselves is one of the few groups that are entitled to discriminate against working mothers? That doesn't make it good practice though.

StillSquiffy · 16/02/2010 19:20

The exemption from the sex discrimination act only applies to the right to advertise only for one sex or the other, not to dismiss someone for reasons relating to pregnancy. I think it was all redefined a few years ago.

Do please say hi to the missus, by the way, MrA

If you advertised for this position with an agency or on the net and did not specify a fixed term then you would probably be slaughtered in a tribunal if you tried to write a fixed term contract.

TBH this is something you will just have to deal with. I would advise trying to make the best of the situation and think positively - if you are looking for odd, part-time hours, this might fit in perfectly with her own plans once she has the baby (which of course you do not need to allow her to bring with her). Odd quirky hours are difficult to fill and it could suit you both long term.

mranchovy · 16/02/2010 19:50

Is that right Squiffy? I agree it doesn't apply to dismissing for pregnancy, this and other maternity rights are conferred by the Employment Rights Act 1996 etc.

But AFAIK all the other relevant acts refer to the rights of employees, and until you actually start work you are not an employee of that employer - and this is the situation the OP is in.

I have asked for a confirmation on the employment law forums, but I am not holding my breath as that is always a bit of a desert.

mranchovy · 16/02/2010 20:06

Ah, checked back and you are right of course Squiffy, the exception I was looking at was repealed in 1986. Not the first time I have looked at 'original' instead of 'revised' statute - I must get a manual.

So, as you were, the offer must stand (if the job still exists), and don't even think of changing or adding to the terms of the offer because this would by definition be direct discrimination.

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