help please childminders!

[vInTaGeVioLeT]

hi please can you advise me fellow C/M's - i'm a bit confused - i've been offered some adhoc work this week with mindees i've had previously - but i'm not 100% sure i can -
children will be ;
my own son 5yrs full time school {reception}
mindee 5yrs full time school {reception}
mindee 3yrs
mindee 2yrs

my registration certificate says i can have 5 children under 8
of these not more than two from early years age group - i know my own son doesn't count in my numbers but is the 5yr old still in early years?

thanks in advance

I think that if they are in full time education then they don't count in the numbers at all, but maybe I'm wrong, I'm sure someone will come along soon that knows!

I'm sure reception children count as over 5's irrespective of age

Your DS doesn't count at all does he

So you could have:
2 under 5 plus 3 over 5.......I think you need to move your DS's age group from under 5 to over 5 as you should be allowed 3 under 5 & 2 over 5 as he grew up & started school?

Katy - i do need to phone ofsted and change cert as he is now 5yrs and in proper school but i was talking to a new childminder the other day who has a child in same year as my son and a 18month baby and she had been told conflicting things - c/m support worker told her she could have two extra but inspector told her that her daughter whoose b.day is before my sons is still in early years group till end august when she'll be nearly 6yrs me and another c/m said no way she is five and in full time ed BUT EYFS goes upto end of reception doesn't it?

confused.com

OK email OFSTED asking about reception age children & where they come in the ratios/ages

Then use their reply (as it will be in writing it is valid)

Then sort our your DS (he is irrelevant anyway)

from what I can remember it's something like for EYFS purposes they are classed in the Early years until x date after their 5th birthday.

But for Ofsted numbers when they are in school full time they are classed as a rising 5 and therefore are not included in your under 5 numbers. But you still have to do EYFS for them.

Does this ring any bells with anyone else? I will have a google in a bit if I haven't fallen asleep!

Makes perfect sense & memory recall for me

ok Katy - i will do that!

navyeyelash - yes i think you're right but i think the new c/m's inspector was confused

thanks ladies

oh i could phone my insurers and ask them too.

You can take a 3rd under 5 as you are allowed to treat the 5 year olds as over 5s for the purposes of child ratios ONLY, the rest of EYFS continues to apply.

You can ask Ofsted to amend your certificate by adding the "rising fives clause" which makes the situation clear to parents (and your insurance provider in the event of any claim). Although Ofsted have said on the phone that its not necessary to change the certificate and some childminders are happy with that. I am not, as Ofsted say different things to different people on the phone and I have no way to prove what may or may not have been said to me verbally.

I explained that the existing wording clearly stated I would be be committing an offence if I cared for more than 3 children in the early years group. a) I can't expect parents to believe my word over the printed certificate b) public liability insurance requires compliance with the registration certificate so technically the insurance would be invalid. So they agreed to change my certificate and I am happy it now makes sense (in Ofstedspeak anyway lol).

As you can't get your certificate changed in time, you could ask Ofsted to confirm by email that you're not breaking any rules and then to amend the certificate in case you get any further enquiries before 31 Aug. You could then forward this email to your insurance provider and ask them to email confirmation that your insurance would not be invalidated during the period you are waiting for an amended certificate.

HTH

Some certificates have the following wording on them (source)
when caring for 4 or 5-year-old children who are in full time education, may increase the number in the early years age group by the number of children in full time education, providing the maximum number is not exceeded (Early Years Register)

well i missed out on the adhoc work this week as i didn't get the request till friday so didn't contact Ofsted till monday, and the Mum's employers called her Monday to see if she could work
anyway i emailed ofsted Monday and asked about the precise meaning on the certificate - still waiting for the answer.I'll report back soon as i know in case it helps anyone else

so i'll have to wait till Easter for the adhoc now but TBH with the whole family off work/school bar thurs for me it's been nice to just spend time together!
Off to Ikea tomorrow - whoop whoop - yes really i love ikea!