Nanny v Au Pair?

[BulletProofMum]

I'm considering alternative childcare options for when I return to work in September. I have always relied on nurseries but the expense and complexity of trying to combine it with school runs is amking me think that an au pair may be better. I will have a 5 year old, a 3 yo and a 6m baby.

We would be able to offer accomodation in a semi-rural area of Surrey. The eldest would be at school; the middle one at nursery 2 days a week and the baby at home.

What are the pros and cons of nannies versus au pairs and how much would we expect to have to pay for each with approx a 40 hour week spread across 4 days (with flexibility)?

Any advice/experience would be appreciated!

40 hours is way too many for an au pair. You are looking at a nanny. I'm not very good at estimating costs - but hve a look on the main page of nannyjob. On the left hand side it has all sorts of info inc average wages and a link to nannytax which will tell you approx costs inc hidden costs.

For what it's worth - when are you looking for someone to start?

doh! evidently august/sept - as you said in your post! sorry.

Definitely a nanny you need. An au pair is generally a young person with limited childcare experience - so not at all suited to looking after a 6mo baby sole charge and probably not the 3yo either. Au pairs usually work around 25 hours a week.

Live in nanny or a daily nanny. An au pair can't do those hours and iirc they aren't meant to have sole charge of a baby.

Put an advert in The lady magazine.

you could also get a childminder; I think Surrey nannies start at £8ph gross for a fairly new nanny. There are a few Surrey based nannies on here so hopefully they will be here soon.

You can't leave Au Pairs with under 1s and they normally come here to learn the language and a 40 hour week would not allow them to do this.

Are you using 'au pair' to mean 'live-in nanny'? Live-in nannies are generally paid less than daily nannies (but have their food and bills paid with their accomodation). Their salary depends on the region you live in - you could try looking on nannyjob.co.uk to see if there are any jobs local to you and what rates are being paid.
Au pairs on the other hand tend to be young people with little or no experience of children and in the majority of cases can cope with the sole charge of children before/after school but not with toddlers or babies.

Are you wanting someone to live at your home, or someone who lives elsewhere?
Will you be around during the day, or will they have sole charge care of the children?
I'm in West Surrey... live-out nannies in this area start from £7 gross an hour... up to £12 gross an hour. Live-in would probably be around £300-£400 a week.

"40 hour week spread across 4 days (with flexibility)?" Could you explain further what you mean... 10 hours a day is fine. Why flexibility? What do you mean by flexibility? If you need more hours, why not just increase the working hours?

If you are inside M25 then likely to be higher cost, though by Rural Surrey I presume you are outside of the M25.

Thanks for the really helpful advice.

By flexbile I mean that it would be uesful to be able to sometimes work longer hours for time in lieu e.g. when I need to be out fo the country.

Would I have to pay anything on top of the gross salary?

I live just outside the M25 - near M3/M4/M25 area.

The other option would be have an au pair to do afterschool care for the eldest and light cleaning plus some babysitting???

You must be quite near me then, I live near M3 J3, nanny near M25 Chertsey exit, J11 I think.
Yes there are many other costs to add on to gross salary. Employers NI, cost of a payroll company if you are not doing that yourself, nannies travel costs whilst on duty, cost of activities/outings, nannies food whilst on duty such as lunch.

If nanny is live-in rather than live-out, then you have additional food costs plus everything associated with cost of their room.

I'm in Ottershaw.

Oh dear - it does start to add up. Live0in would work out cheaper for us - I'll look into how much NI etc costs.

Thanks for your help.

I'll poat you some links to help with calculating later. I work near Ottershaw.

poat - well I was on mobile!

Link to Example of costs of employing a live-out nanny @ £110 gross per day

A good calculator for seeing what the Employers NI is for various Gross Per Week amounts is
here. Just enter in the Gross per week figure, say £400 - that would be £10 gross per hour, 40 hours a week. Employers NI is a little under £2,000 a year.

To get a feel for what nannies are being offered salary wise, have a look at nanny job adverts. For example NannyJob.co.uk Live-In Nanny, Surrey Unfortunately many ads won't state a salary but you may find some that do.
Some jobs will say something like: £300 a week Net. To convert that to something meaningful to you, as the employer... use UK PAYE Calculator Net to Gross - enter in the Net Per Week figure in the Net Pay Per Week box and click Calculate.

Given that you want 40 hours a week, live-in vs Live-out may be quite similar in cost terms I feel. A live in will work out a bit cheaper Salary wise... but you will lose a lot of privacy. Worth reading through the Au-Pair message threads on this section of mumsnet for a clearer picture of what having someone living at your home may be like. There are advantages and disadvantages. Live-in may work out £50-£100 a week cheaper... but they could go through that in food, heating, lighting, hot water etc. Do as much research as you can so that you get a clearer understanding of what you really need.

I know a nanny who is looking for live-in work starting in the Summer. Once you have a better idea of what sort of salary you would be offering, I could see if they would be interested. Would you consider having a nanny start earlier, thus able to help through school holidays?

Thanks for all your help - using the examples in your link it's going to be too much. We can't let costs go too far above our nursery costs (approx 1800 pcm).

So unless your frined is happy to work at the lowest end of the scale then we can't afford it. I would be able to offer the position until I returned to work (and a full salary) in September.

I recommend reading the Good Nanny Guide. It will give you a clear understanding of what you can expect and what you can;t. As well as giving you tips on how to find the right nanny, it will also advise on how to avoid the pitfalls of being an employer so that your nanny will be happy in his/her working conditions and stay longer which is all round better for everyone.

Def do not get an au pair, you are descibing a nanny's job and as everyone else has said an au pair is usually a young girl from overseas who is looking to live with a British family and earn some pocket money whilst learning the language - no good for a full time, sole charge job which is what yours looks like it would be.

Good luck, nannynick is always full of good advice on this area!

Presumably I could ask an au pair to pick up my eldest from school each day and look after the 3 yo 2 days a week?

Bullet Proof Mum
Hi
We have an au pair and we road tested another. For me it's not just a question of the child's age. If they've got bad judgement, in my opinion, it's entirely possible they're going to be as dangerous with a three year old (the mythical 'cut off' age everyone talks about)or even older child as they are with a younger child although the nature of the risky situations might vary a bit.

Our current au pair,who is very good, could PROBABLY cope with looking after a three year old for two full days. The main thing I would be worried about is what could happen at the end of the day in terms of tiredness, especially if she is also doing a school pick up and looking after an older child too.

The main issue with trying to rely on an ap as a cornerstone of your childcare plans is that in my experience (although others will have more to say)recruiting is very hit and miss. I think it's at least 50% possible you could get someone who you have concerns about. So, if you attempt to experiment with this route, i would have a back up plan in place.

3 children under five i would not employ a 18 yr old that doesnt speak great english. I know childcare is expensive but surely worth every penny when it comes to your three adorable children.

Hi BPM

Are you really happy with the idea of a young girl (lets say 18 - 20ish) with littel childcare experience looking after your 3 year old all day for 2 days a week and collecting your 5 year old at the end of each day?

I don;t know about your children but Iknow that mine are crabby at the end of the day as they are tired.

I think you would be asking a lot. And what would you be doing with the baby?

I think the fact that you're asking answers the question. It is a bad idea all round. An au pair should not be in charge of children for any length of period. Too much could go wrong.