Is my Nanny/mothers help being unreasonable to expect more discipline, money etc?

[ladyofla]

I am a SAHM and am lucky enough to have a Nanny/mothers help 2 days a week who started with us almost 3 months ago. She has a few years experience of looking after kids, is 26, has no kids of her own and no training as such but is doing a good job. I have one DD and am 9 months pg with a second. I explained to her when I employed her that the job involved looking after DD (playing, going to the park, feeding, putting down for naps etc) and some menial housework (putting on a wash, hanging it out, a little grocery shopping etc) basically the same stuff that I do. I have a cleaner a few hours a week.

Yesterday she told me that she has been finding it very hard with DD. DD has been acting up with her a bit but not excessively and TBH she is a very easy child and I'm constantly being told that by others. The nanny seems to have issues with me being around and DD running to me etc. and then not doing what the nanny wants. I've explained to the nanny that this is bound to happen a little but I have always made clear to DD that she must do what the nanny says and for the most part she does. The nanny talks a lot about discipline as if I should follow up on anything the nanny does. I teach my DD as much as I can the difference between right and wrong and she is very well behaved but she's 19 months old! The nanny thinks I am too 'nice'. The nanny has also said she thinks she should get more money because she does a bit of everything and it is harder than her other job (2 days a week, sole charge of a little girl, no menial tasks).

I can offer her more money which will hopefully keep her happy on that level but am also planning on telling her I don't want to change my parenting ways for her (I strongly believe that DD is being 'disciplined' (big word for dealing with a 19 months old) enough and I can't promise that my DD will behave better for her particularly as I think DD is pretty well behaved but with the new baby coming it is quite likely she is going through a bumpy phase.

I am hoping this is the right approach and am wondering if at the same tine if it will fix the situation. Has anyone else been in this situation or does anyone have advice?

What do you mean by Froggie valley? I'm in London - just need french speaking nanny/mothers help, au pair would be ok if they had a bit of experience with kids but it's live-out.

Obviously (as the others have pointed out & as you yourself know) you need to be on the same wavelength & consistent in your discipline techniques etc in front of DD or that creates confusion. But, even more obviously, it's you who will make the decisions about how to behave etc, as you're the mother & she's the mother's help. If you discuss your thoughts clearly & honestly & she doesn't agree then this is not the right job for her.

TBH I think it's indeed hard- this relationship between mother at home & mother's help. I have been working from home since DS was 5 months old & have had a part-time nanny & it's been very hard at times because when DS saw me (especially after he got to be 1 year old) he would get terribly upset. Not good for me, not good for DS, and certainly not good for the nanny who then had to deal with it. In your case though, given that you've employed a mother's help (this is what she is given her role / duties, not a nanny)it's very very important to find a balance, as much as you can, given that you will be at home & that's inevitable with a newborn. This situation will only get worse when the newborn is here, just because your DD may (very understandably) play up a bit, feel jealous etc, so you really need to talk it all through in detail with your mother's help. And if it doesn't feel right perhaps keep her for a few months to get you through the rough bit of late pregnancy / early newborn phase & then interview for someone new. Or if you're up to it find someone new asap. I know that's hard in your situation, I also know there's obviously many good things about her which is why you hired her, so it's not as simple as 'get rid'.

Oh god, do French people not know it's called Froggie Valley? South Ken, where the Alliance Francaise etc etc is, is often called Froggie Valley. French resources there, and French people, are much more plentiful.

I would place an advert on gumtree, or advertise on your local NCT email list, or whatever, to find someone else. She doesn't sound like that good a fit. People who speak French here aren't that rare - there are French people, Algerians, West Africans, etc etc.

If you want French speaking help Ici Londres is FULL of them - native French speakers msotly, plenty of them with either the DPAP or experience.

She should be following your lead, not telling you how to parent your DD. Sometimes as a nanny I've had to implement discipline techniques which I don't feel are that effective but they're the parent's choice and the parents are my employers. Sometimes children do act up with shared charge so maybe your MH needs some help in identifying ways that she can deal with issues in a similar way to you, as 2 different expectations can be confusing for a child. As long as it's no big deal e.g. standing up to apply cream then she should do things your way.

The easiest way, tbh, with a MH is to say that you are at home so you will do the disciplining etc and her role is to entertain DD, keep her safe and do some housework. Get into the habit of asking your DD "what did X say?" if she comes running to you and always back the MH up. If you have an issue then inform your MH later how you want it done next time.

Oh and don't raise her salary. It's what she agreed to so tough. If she leaves then you know what you need to look for next time. I'm currently maintaining a 3yo's French for a 8/12 hours a week and not getting that much more but it's PT, LO and temp so justifiably a little more.

Yes about the salary, it seems to me that after 3 months there's no real reason for her to change her mind about what money she wants. You agreed, I presume, on a salary 3 months ago & gave her duties & responsibilities (which haven't changed significantly). So why should her salary be changed? Plus it seems a perfectly reasonable salary for a MH.

TBH she is two days a week right?
It's inevitable that any child will act up with somebody else taking care of them if they normally have mummy and you are a SAHM.
I have always worked for SAHM's both sole and shared charge, often a combination of the two. You have to be flexible and there is a considerable amount of give and take - more giving on the nannies part. If she is part time then she should definitely be following your routines and 'disciplinary' techniques. She is well paid and she knew the salary you were offering in advance so cannot complain now. Obviously not a good time to find somebody else with your baby due so soon but if it's bad now I imagine it will get worse with a new baby as dd probably will have a rocky phase and you need somebody who supports you - which doesn't sound like this nanny/mothers help/stroppy madame.
There are irritations in every job on both sides. You do just have to get on with it as a nanny and accept you might not do it that way but when you have your own kids you can do it your way then. Good luck with your new baby

Oh, I live pretty near froggy land but it still doesn't seem that easy to find native french speakers. My MH is actually from eastern Europe but speaks French athough it's not as good as my own. She is however more comfortable in French than English. I'm not french but speak it fluently - not to DD though as don't want to confuse her. It's advised to stick to one language and I would rather speak to my DD is English the whole time rather than French, hence having the MH speak French.

I feel the same about the salary - that she is changing her mind about what we agreed on because she is finding DD tough and me being around etc. but I discussed all of this with her before she started. She might be a bit proud too. I couldn't be nicer to her but then maybe that's why she feels she might be say all this. I'm going to put my foot down about roles etc and what the job entails but maybe will give her a bit more money necause it is harder than she envisaged but she needs to understand her role. It probably won;t last long but could tide me over for the next few months.

When I have nannied with parents at home/around some of the time I have always found it very difficult and TBH I try to stay away from those type of jobs now. I think some nannies can prob deal with it and some cant. Maybe she's one of the ones who can't......

As for the other duties, then if these were made clear when she took the job on I think she's asking a bit much wanting more money. I have always liked having extra stuff to do - breaks the day up a bit & makes it go faster.

Maybe she's not the best match for your family???

londres

The froggy mag!

Or even ici londres.

But yes, if you go there it takes you to French speakers looking for work.

Didab: Think you're probably right. It's great to her other nannies opinions.

Frankin: Thanks for the link. Could need it very soon....

i was going to ask where she's is from. as it looks so typically czech/slovak/polish/hungarian etc to me hw she behaves. hw long has she been in the uk? and how long has she ben looking after children?
i have to say that looking after children in a british way is different and takes some time to get used to it. and lots of us go through a phase /either just silently in our heads or alound as your mh does/ 'the british cant do it properly we need to show them'.
to me it seems that some people are more able to get over the initial cultural shock and accept that thing are done completely in a different way /rather than a worse way/ than others. over the years i realised that our /ie what you call eastern europian/ parents often like to set rules which are completely useless just to show power or something - the cream situation beeing a clear exaple of this/.it might help to try to explain this to your nanny together with others have suggested. she needs to know that you are the boss and they are your children so you choose how they are treated.

also sheprobably doesnt know/understand the british system with qualified/unqualified nannies and mothrs helps which might make her feel she is entitled to more money.

I am a nanny working for a mum that works from home (sometimes dad does too). 2 boys, age 4 and 1. I agree with the others who say the nanny should be following your lead, not the other way about. As for asking for a pay rise, a definite NO, esp after 3 months! I get paid less (also work 2 days per week and have lots of sole charge/menial tasks when parents are away on business.

Although it can be very difficult as a nanny/mothers help when the parent(s) are home, imo you are paying them to look after your child(ren) just as you would and also to do those menial tasks as you would. I am a mum and my parenting is very different to my nannying and the reason for that is I respect the mums wishes and accept we have differing views on parenting/raising children.

In saying that, I honestly thought it would never work out with mum being at home most of the time, in the early days when the youngest was only 8 months old any crying or upset mum heard she was out of the office, probably trying to help but not helping if you know what I mean.

Communication is the key! Sit down with your nanny and tell her you need her onside, not the other way about

Interesting about different ways of parenting (depending on different cultures). I agree that's probably the case. I have lived in the UK for years but am originally from southern Europe & everytime we go there on holiday there's all sorts of things that people find weird in the way we parent. Amongst them- the bedtime (we put DS to bed around 7.30, 8.00 at the latest, which is unheard of back home...there it's always much later). There's also small things e.g. back home they give pureed food to children for much much longer than we do here. My son at 16 months is already eating absolutely what we eat, & feeding himself with fork/spoon. Unheard of at home! Also (following from the cream example) my mum back home always criticizes me for not shampooing my DS's hair every single evening & for not applying nappy cream every time I change him (I only use it once in a while, when his bottom is a bit red).

Anyway, I say all this because it's true that in different cultures the way things are done here in Britain (not that they're done in one way only) may seem a bit liberal, so it may just be that you've got your wires crossed & things will become clear soon. Although it may also be that she's not the right MH for you

And I also agree with Caterpillar- the distinction between MH / nanny / babysitter / qualified-unqualified etc is non-existent I think in other countries, its very much a British thing.

She is indeed Polish. I had a very frank conversation with her. I also spoke to the other Mum beforehand to check that everything was going ok for her which it was. She also mentioned that she had told her that she may give her a rise before the end of the year so that may be where that was coming from. Anyway, I explained to her once again what the job involved (bit of everything), that in terms of discipline I decide what should happen but that at 19 months discipline isn't really much of an issue and she should relax. The most important thing is to show DD what is safe and dangerous (e.g. not to touch hot things etc) and to be nice and say please and thank you etc. DD does all this quite well for her age. I also explained that DD is essentially a good kid and I didn't want to mess with that. I gave her the rise because this nanny/mothers help is actually doing a very good job and for peace of mind with the arrival of baby No.2. She was very pleasant through the conversation and accepted everything and I realise the main problem is that she was feeling stressed when DD was acting up and I was around because she thought maybe DH and I thought she was doing something wrong. She was insecure about that but I reassured her that we understand the nature of a 19 month old and we didn't think she was mistreating DD or anything like that (she is actually quite gentle).

Anyway, I had that conversation the day before I went into labour - DD2 was born on Wednesday, happy and healthy! and whether it was right or wrong to give her the raise I'm glad not to have to look for other help right now

Congratulations on the birth of DD2.

Congratulations!