Does anyone know standard ratios for 2 fully registered childminders working together?

[childmindermk]

Hi everyone, i am a childminder and i work with another fully registered childminder in my home.
We are currently registered to care for 6 children under 8 years of which 6 can be under 5 years and of those 3 can be under 1 year.

We currently have a vacancy for 1 child of any age and have had an enquiry from someone who is trying to find a childminder for their twins.

I have come across articles recently that say that 2 childminders working together MAY be able to have more than 6 children. Some cases where 2 work together can have 8 children.

Does anyone know if there are any standard ratios for 2 childminders working together?

Space isnt a problem as at pre registration inspection (5 1/2 years ago) we were told that space is ok for up to 10 children.

We both feel that we would be able to care for the twins alongside the others as there wouldnt be that much time when we would actually have more than 6 as one mindee is afternoons only and anothers parents work shifts so her hours change from week to week.

We have contacted OFSTED for information but they just replied with 'put it in writing'!
Not helpful really as was just looking for advice at this stage!

What does everybody think?

If you both have your own registrations shouldn't you both be able to have the standard 6 under 8, 3 under 5, 1 under 1 unless there are space issues? I did think that having 6 max with more than usual in the younger age group was more usual for working with an assistant, not another childminder. You each have your own conditions of registration so can't you both just have the standard numbers?

You would have to apply for a variation to numbers, often because it is to keep siblings together they will let you but only on the days that you specifically have them.

ie the variation would only cover the twins when you have them not an overall blanket increase to spaces IYSWIM

Hi sqirrel

we were both registered together at the same time and our conditions of registration are the same for both of us:
'When working with another childminder may care for no more than 6 children under 8 years, of which no more than 6 can be under 5 years and no more than 3 under 1 year.'
Everybody we speak to at toddler groups and other activities we attend all assume we can have 6 children each too!

This is why we thought about checking with OFSTED when the enquiry about the twins came up. unfortunately they wont tell us anything and i keep googling childminder ratios and finding snippets of info about CM's working together being able to have more children, but nothing that goes into detail!

thanks tho.

hi cargirl,

this is interesting and was pretty much what i thought we would have to do but then got confused by other CM's working together being able to have up to 8 children!

why cant OFSTED have a set guideline for this...surely it can't be that uncommon now for 2 CM's to work together!

An individual CM can apply for a variation to have 4 children usually again to cover having a sibling of a current child, or to have 2 under ones because they are twins, it's nothing to do with have 2 CMs working together in one premises IYSWIM

I work with another childminder (my husband). We were initially registered for up to 6, of whom all 6 could be under 5 and 2 could be under 2. That, I think, is the standard, basic ratio.

The problem with having more isn't necessarily to do with the OFSTED, although they'll be looking at the space you have available. It's the Council. They start to jittery about nursery-type provision once you get over that magical number 6 and it's mostly because they're worried about the disruption to the neighbours: extra cars, noisy kids in garden etc.

We checked with our council and they said we didn't need planning permission, they were happy if we took on more children, so that's what we told OFSTED when asking for extra numbers. Plus, we were asking for siblings, so no extra cars dropping off children.

We're now registered for 8, 6 of whom can be under 5. At one point all 8 were under 5 and we had to have an extension for continuity of care, but that's no longer necessary. I know of another husband and wife team who are allowed 10 between them (6 under 5).

tanith...so OFSTED will register 2 CM's to have more than 6 under 5 but only for a short time for continuity of care. thats fine for us in the immediate future but we also liked the idea of being able to have the extra 1 under 5 for those possible, although infrequent 'overlap' times as we have mindees who do just afternoons or whose parents work shifts so arnt here all day everyday.
we were hoping at we could be registered for that extra 1 but its sounding more like it can only be done for a specific child for a specified amount of time.

thanks for your reply.

We are allowed 12 under 8 when there are 2 of us of which 6 are under 5 & 3 under 1

When there are 3 we can still only have 12 but 9 can be under 5 and 3 under 1

But now they are saying I can only have 1 under 1 when I'm by myself - which won't work

hi katymac...so it seems that OFSTED dont appear to like registering 2 CM's for more than 6 under 5, although if there are 3 CM's then will consider more.

could you ask them to amend your registration conditions so that you can have 2 under 1 when by yourself?

How does your setting work?

Do you all work the same hours each day or do you all do different rotas?

We both work the same hours each day so we are both here at all times...although sometimes school runs make a difference but dont have them at mo.

We are all over the place atm

I have had 2 under one for 5.5 yrs - who knows what has changed

I had 7 staff all working different rotas but the credit crunch hit last summer now there are 3 of us & blow me we have started growing again and will need more staff soon

KatyMac, that is great news - so pleased you are growing again!

Always the way isnt it!
Are you the main CM then and the others just assisstants?

sorry if i appear nosey, but it interests me the way other CM's who work together manage things!

we dont know of any other CM's in our area to ask!

We have pretty much always been full until end Feb 09 when our after schooler left so all under 5 now (in fact all between 13 months and 2 1/2 years)!

We always seem to get enquiries when we are full and now we have a place only get enquiries that we cant do eg twins and only 1 place to fill!

Thanks

I have someone who wants to come back - but she can't afford to unless I can offer F/T so I am a bit stuck atm

No

I have trained & registered 5 childminders & all starting as assistants and moving on

They now have 2 NVQ3 & an early years degree, one is still with me & one set up on her own

I think training is so important

The lass with the degree wants to come back

I (& my DH) have health problems & I tend to recruit people with health issues as I know how hard it is to be employed with a bad record

OFSTED have asked the council to support me growing so my type of care can be more widespread at my OFSTED on MOnday

that sounds amazing...what an opportunity for those people. sounds like you really enjoy what you are doing...keep up the good work and thanks for the info.

i think i will write to OFSTED about increasing numbers and see what their response is and decide from there what to do next!

Im sure i will be back on here all the time now tho! its great that there is somewhere like this for CM's and other childcarers and parents to get advice!

It's all to complicated

I find as soon as we get sorted the children change or OFSTED changes the rules or something

you are certainly right there!

we have found that too!

You never know whats round the corner either with the children or with OFSTED!

Its frustrating that when full we get lots of enquiries and then all of a sudden someone gives notice (4 weeks) and no enquiries now!

In the past something has always turned up but its hard sometimes when you are waiting for it!

You would think that after OFSTED I would be cheerful but it all seems a bit much atm

I think I suffer from inability to deal with anti-climax

My certificate says:
When working with another childminder ...
2 under 1
6 under 5
12 under 8
2 overnight

It depends on your space and your own children too.

Hi HSMM space wise we have been told we can have up to 10 children and neither of us have our own children so that doesnt affect us.
We just want to be able to have 7 under 5 years, but from the replies on here i dont think OFSTED will allow it.
We have written to OFSTED so now just need to wait and see what they say!
Watch this space!

Do you have anyone to work as an assistant for those odd days/hours?

No dont really have anyone we could ask to do that, and we both agree that we wouldnt feel comfortable having someone else come in some of the time as and when, and laying them off when no longer needed!

Will have to wait and see what OFSTED come back with now!
Thanks for the idea tho.

Short term we have had a student, a MIL, a parent, a DH, an auntie all sots really just for pin money

Hello. We are thinking about starting childminding. We run kids camps and clubs at the moment and would like to do things in the day. In very early stages, but we have a 1300sqft studio that we are converting at the moment, so this is where the children would play and things. We have two friends that want to do it with us, one of them has a Level 3 working in nurserys and myself and my friend are registered childminders. Are we allowed to work together, and if so what are our numbers. Our house is in 3 acres so the kids would have tons of fun, and we have a 15 seater minibus, so days out would be no problem. And help would be great. Thanks