Nannies: market rates (bit controversial)

[Tanzie]

Having read on another thread ("Paying Nannies when sick") gripes from UK nannies about jobs going to girls from accession countries who will work for less, (and do more in the way of housework), is this not just pushing the market rate down for qualified/experienced nannies?

I am not in UK, but I would look at it as providing more affordable childcare, provided you can find someone trustworthy and reliable. I lived in UK briefly about 4 years ago and a nanny friend of mine was earning GBP 25,000 and got a flat thrown in with it. This is more than I was earning at the time and could never have afforded this sort of money for someone to look after my children.

I am not suggesting slave labour from Central European girls, or paying them an au pair's "pocket money" for what is essentially a nanny job, but paying them a reasonable wage and providing free accommodation means that a lot of people, who could not afford a nanny or nursery fees, will probably be able to get back to work.

Of course, there will always be those who want a Norland nanny and can afford one, but it seems to me that your average Mum would welcome these Central Europeans with open arms...

I'll run and hide now...

Another curious behaviour on this thread is that some of the nannies seem to be defending their own behgaviour by criticising the parents' behaviour. I hope you don't do this at work. If my boss pulled me aside to tell discipline me, say complain that I spend too much time on mumsnet, it would be wholly inappropriate for me to respond with "Well, you come in late and leave early" (which incidentally he doesn't do). And, if I did respond in such a manner, I would expect not to be promoted or given a raise when my annual review comes around. In fact, given the current climate at my company, I would expect to see my name on the redundancy list.

and it scares the hell out of me now that I'm looking for one

Thanks Issy,
I'm not biased towards/against any nationality. It's the tax and NI that's the killer

I can honestly say I have never moaned about a parent who I have cared for their child to anyone. That would be unprofessional of me and I am not employed for that purpose anyway. I have never had an employer who I have found impossible to work with but I feel communication with the parents is the key. Further, sometimes your carers approach and the parental style do not always mix and therefore the relationship is set for disaster. You learn early on which parents you can work with and those who will be more problematic.

However I do meet some outstanding standards of parental childcare and often want to shake people. Again I am sure that sometimes people want to so the same with me. For example Supernanny, there were some very judgemental comments on this site about the parents and children on this programme. Can you imagine if you were a carer for the 4 year old at his nursery or in the older children's school. You'd be pulling your hair out with him and his parents, yet would be limited on what you could say or do.

By the way I am not saying for one moment that any parent on here is a poor parents. I don't know you, have not see you with your children for any time and therefore not in any position to judge. However when you are in a nannying position you are required to be the family more than most childcare work and become more involved with the family. The especially the case with live in positions. This can often be very difficult for all concerned and needs a certain level of respect from all sides. Having read this thread I am grateful I have never worked in a live in position and have finished nannying for the foreseeable. Its a minefield regardless of which side of the fence you are on. Though I have to say I would prefer to be the parent than a nanny/au pair as you

1. have more legal rights
2. can choose alternative childcare
3. will only need a nanny for a relatively short period of time.

I'm a nanny too. I work 60 hours a week with 2 under 4s. I do the kids and parents laundry but not their ironing. I make sure the kitchen is clean and tidy by the end of the day (often cleaner than when I got it in the a.m but thats ok). I cook two healthy and varied meals a day. I do the shopping. I keep the kids rooms tidy and clean. I take the kids swimming, to the park, library, softplay,etc a different activity each afternoon bsically. I ensure they have a sleep, they eat and drink well, they do age appropriate educational activities and they go to the HV regularly. I basically feel I do anything a SAHM would do to make sure the children grow up in a loving, stimulating, if a little chaotic sometimes environment.

The children are happy, healthy, well adjusted, and secure. This is turns makes the parents happy and they show a great deal of appreciation for the hard and dedicated work I do. I get paid £300 per week live in. I am British.

My point here is the fact I am British comes last in the grand scheme of things. As long as I do my job to the very best of my ability then my nationality is not relevant. I'm sure a Czech or French or Russian or African nanny could do my job and do it well. The parents chose me as I fit in with what they want, and that is someone to love their children and take the very best care of them in their absence. All the housework I do, I choose to do as my job is to ensure the smooth running of the family unit. So I am happy to do light housework, and to clear up sometimes even if I or the kids didn't make the mess. I take a look around me and think "This would help the parents" I don't think "Hang on this isn't in my contract so I'll leave it". I don't let the parents take the p*ss, and nor would they try. We have a healthy mutual respect.

Anyway, I am sorry for the long thread!! I just feel some nannies, British or otherwise, have a stick up their behind.

And I'll be the first to admit I am by no means perfect. I have just committed the cardinal sin of watching Neighbours and Doctors. The kids are asleep and the house is tidy. Thats my lunch hour, and I thoroughly enjoyed it

Nannyk, you sound ideal.

NannyK, you sound very much like me. No offence meant but I think your job sounds like many nanny job. Standard hours and expectations but maybe I've lead a very sheltered life. I may have been wrong all these years working with children and have been working harder than the standard. I don't think I'll change though.

By the way your hourly rate is about £5ph, which again is very standard. Perhaps someone could work out how much that would cost a parent.

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glad I never had to think about it

Don't know about baddie, but je suis la vache, apparently.

And I'm so nice IRL.

£5 per hour sounds OK to me for live in - no mortgage to pay, no household expense, no food bills - that takes care of about 75% of most people's salary!

£5 ph in normal live out salary around here so if I were to earn this

1. I'd be below minumum wage
2. I'd have to feed, home, clothes myself pay travel expenses etc etc etc and thats if you don't have a family of your own (which I would never see if I did work as a nanny). My family couldn't survive on my full time salary as a nanny I would have to find alternative work which paid more like cleaning which around here pays minimum £6 per hour more like £7.

NannyK's hourly rate is £7.28 (gross). That's roughly £22700 per year. And, I'm asssuming that she is live-in. And, therefore, she has no rent, utilities, food bill. I think that is actually a pretty good living by today;s standards.

I don't pay a nanny in net. I pay her gross, and then (as required by law) I am responsible for deducting her employee taxes from her paycheque and sending them off to Mr. Gordon Brown every quarter. Okay, now come and get me...

'I'm a nanny too. I work 60 hours a week with 2 under 4s.' 'I get paid £300 per week live in'.

£300 divided by 60 is £5. She doesn't say whether tax is included or not but generally I would say not. So that income would be taxed. The employers contributions would obviously be added on top but not received by the employee. I think Uwila is better able to tell be that.

£5/hour NET is not below minimum wage. The current minimum wage is £4.85 GROSS. This will rise to £5.05 in October, but it will still be gross.

yes, Marypop, I assumed that her quote was a net figure. So, I translated it to gross (£7.28).