Improving Reputation of Childminding: what can be done?

[BerkshireBella]

Childminding can often seem to have a bad reputation, with lots of reports in the news etc. I am just starting out and am wondering your opinion on what could be done to help raise the profile of childminding.

I know this is controversial, but does anyone else think that charging too little brings everyone down by "cheapening" the service offered? The pay is so far below minimum wage.... what does this say about this type of work?

Also, I've recently met a CM with 6 mindees who was proud of the fact that they NEVER went on outings beyond the garden; is that even LEGAL???!

My feeling is that parents have already paid tax on the money they have earned to pay me, by charging all inclusive, and not payong tax, the taxman dosnt get it twice.

What's wrong with paying tax? Surely it just means you are richer?

But what if the parents don't much care if their child goes on outings.

But my parents do, that is why I have a waiting list and have never had a space.

It is what I do, and it is the type of CM I am.

We swim, soft play, Children Centre drop in, Field trips, as well as lots of garden and home time.

Ther is nothing wrong in paying tax, but as the parents already have on the money they pay me, I would rather spend the money on their children.

WhatDidI... - that's lovely and I'm sure the parents and children are completely delighted with the service you are offering

But you cannot simultaneously complain that you don't earn enough if you offer that kind of bells and whistles experience and don't want to charge extra for it.

Anna I'm not complaining (I have changed nickname back) I do this job, cos I love it, although am getting close to retiring, not over pay but over paperwork (but that is a toattly other thread.

Just stating that when people go on about how much CM's earn they tend to forget how much we pay out on the children from that fee.

Even those that charge on top, at least half of the fee goes back on the children.

I think that different CMs offer different experiences, and on that basis their per hour take home pay will vary hugely.

Basically it's an issue of how much you charge and how you manage your costs, as in all businesses.

Also, wouldn't that be the same as someone earning similar to you who has to pay for travel to/from work plus childcare? And, assuming you work most of the year, even if half of what you earn goes back to the children, I'm still mystified how you manage to not pay any tax at all. But maybe my adding up is up the wall.

Most Cm's dont earn enough to pay tax, i donr know one that does.

juuule - my hourly rate per child isn't £4.03 per hour [i wish!!] £4.03 is what it works out at per hour. There is no way i could charge that much the normal hourly rate per child here is £3 p/h.

i have my own 3yr old - so i can only have two under 5's termtime/school hours.
i live in a not very densly populated area - within a 5 mile radius of my house there are 58 childminders - i cannot fill the space vacated by my now school aged mindee.

i work 10 hour days - i choose to work 3.5 days so that i can spend some "quality" time with my son so that for one day a week he isn't playing second/third fiddle to my mindees.

i do find it annoying when people assume that i'm raking it in - i am so not. If anyone asks what i earn per week i'm actually embarrassed to admit how much.

and by the way i'm not whinging i'm just stating the facts - i earn enough to stop me being poor. When ds is at schhol then i can earn £9 p/h - hoorah!

I don't think childmindes have a particularly bad reputation. Do they?

I think that one needs to be very clear about the nature of the expenses that are available to charge against tax. A childminders taxable profit is not the same as their incremental income, because they are able to charge expenses against tax that are not fully incremental costs. So a childminder is able to charge a proportion of housing, electricity, gas, car etc against income even if these costs would not go down if they stopped childminding.

A better way of measuring a comparable income is to measure the fees less the direct costs (cash outlay) such as toddler clubs, school run petrol, food for mindees etc.

If a childminder gets paid £3 per hour for an 8-6 day then that is £30 per child that the childminder receives. As a rough guide toddler club might be £1.50, food £1.50 and petrol to get to toddler club 50p plus say £1.50 for other direct costs - so that leaves £25 a day direct incremental profit, per child in this example.

SoapBox 'If a childminder gets paid £3 per hour for an 8-6 day then that is £30 per child that the childminder receives. As a rough guide toddler club might be £1.50, food £1.50 and petrol to get to toddler club 50p plus say £1.50 for other direct costs - so that leaves £25 a day direct incremental profit, per child in this example'

Good example but figures a bit awray

it is not just food and outings and petrol,
what about, toys, safety items, cleaning, wipes, time before and after children have gone that you are not paid for, but which you need to set up/take down playroom.

Petrol used to go buy the food (which is more than £1.50 per day)
Petrol to go to courses (some of which are compulsory)

Equipment such as contracts, paper for PC, photos taken, there are so may incidentals that have to come out of that £30.00 per day, that the profit margin is a lot lot lower.

Shoshe/Soapbox - but if I understand you correctly, once direct costs have been deducted from the £30 and the CM is left with, say, £15 per day, at the end of the year she can deduct some costs for heating, lighting, housing, petrol etc from her total earnings and only pay tax on the remainder?

Yes, we can deduct 10% for heating and lighting which is deducted weekly/monthly, (or portion of percentage if part time) and 10% overall for wear and tear.

Not Petorl tho we get a tax allownece of 40p a mile, which until the latest hike in petrol prices wasnt bad.

I pay out now about £200.00 a month in petrol, (this includes school runs, which I have started to charge as a extra at £1.00 per pick up)

When I bought my 8 seater Mazda Bongo I also had to but car seats as well. I have 14 depending on what combination of children I have in the car, another cost.

Shoshe - that's fine, to charge extra for school runs.

Basically I would have thought that you need to charge parents as far as possible for all costs and ensure that you are getting a decent hourly minding rate on top. Surely the easiest way to do this is not to ask for an all-inclusive hourly rate but for one that is exclusive of all extras?

Then I would price my self out, parent will only pay the market price. Dosn't matter how good you are what rep you have.

i have friend who did priced the way you have suggested, so appeared alot cheaper than me, but ended up alot dearer.

And what do you do when one parent then refuses to pay for a outing?

Not go so that all the children miss out because of one?

TBH, I have never thought of CMs offering outings that incur a cost. The CMs I know all live in very rural areas and entertainment is watching lambs being born and the cows being milked and playing in the garden or the village playground.

You pay out £15 per day per child That seems a lot.

If you actually went through every cost that goes into the day, it can cost that much easily.

If you actually thought how much you spent on your children a day, in real terms.

I dont mean food and such, but toys, paper, crayons, car seats, equipment, all the things you buy for safety reasons, Pushchairs, cots, highchairs, and divided it from birth to 5 you would be surprised.

Anna where I live we have to travel to school, groups swimming and such. I live on a Army Camp which is behind the wire.

There is a toddler group but that is all.

I can fully understand why you would need outings to civilian facilities.

I can also understand why your customer base doesn't have much money to pay over market rates for a first-class service.

You are in a niche market, aren't you? Maybe it isn't quite so difficult for CMs in other circumstances. I know a CM who is a farmer's wife; she has four children of her own (one is SN) who are teenagers, and she childminds lots of children and keeps her family fed on it now that farming is such a lousy business. But she doesn't take the children anywhere other than out on the farm or up the road to play in other people's gardens.

It is a niche market, but since Soliders can now be mothers (they used to have to leave on Pregnancy) we do have a captive client base, I only take full time children (as do the other CM's on base) which is easier than lots of part timers.