Is a Norland nanny worth it?

[Internationalpony]

Hi all,

We’re looking at getting a nanny and I love the idea of a Norland nanny for the following reasons:

1. They’re people who have truly chosen nannying as a vocation and haven’t just drifted into it
2. After a three year degree they’ll have a real in depth knowledge of child development so will be actively developing DC not just looking after them
3. They develop a weekly meal plan and activity plan - I’d find this so reassuring and beneficial
4. It seems like they’d do things to make our lives easier in so many other ways e.g. responsible for keeping the nursery tidy, DC laundry, will even meal prep for DC for the weekend
5. There are a clear set of expectations set out by Norland on what the nanny does and doesn’t do which can help to avoid any potential problems further down the line

However they’re of course very expensive, even for a newly qualified one, and we’d only consider a live out arrangement.

Obviously affordability is very personal but my question is, how easy is it to find other nannies who are just as good and proactively focus on child development? Are most other nannies happy to / expect to do similar duties? Where else have people found good nannies?

Finally, we have recently relocated to Northern England which another reason I’m concerned about finding a good nanny - there is so much more choice in London! Would any Norland nanny want to or be willing to be based here? Has anyone had a Norland nanny in the North before?

Thanks in advance!

It's a little bit like someone who's done a college course in AAT and someone with a degree in finance, plus ACA qualified, both calling themselves accountants.

Technically the AAT folks are accounts technicians, but they always call themselves accountants as if there's no distinguishing, and generally no one corrects them any more. There's a mile between the training and output though. The AAT person can do most aspects of standard accountancy. But then if you only need AAT level work, then don't pay for the ACA qualified accountant. The ACA accountant is able to command the top salaries.

OP, only you know if you need a nanny, or a nanny.

I am a NANNY just because i didn’t go to Norland. How dare you belittle the career I’ve spent 15 years building.

That's a little bit dramatic.

You're a nanny, ok. No one knows how good, apart from those you have nannied for. Maybe outstanding. Maybe not.

Norland guarantees a certain standard. They aren't "just the same" as other nannies, or the people with the biggest pockets in the world wouldn't target Norland and employ them.

Sorry if you don't like that. But it's true. You might really rate yourself, but people want the guaranteed high standards that aren't based on the nanny saying so.

Im not being dramatic, ive worked hard to build up a career and a reputation and excellent references. For some nasty bully on the internet to put me down and belittle me. Go away!

FYI my references say I’m an excellent nanny. Don’t bother replying I won’t be reading your response.

I absolutely think you don't read any replies that hit a nerve.

If you email or call Norland, they should be able to tell you the number of people they’ve placed in your area recently. I doubt you would get an NQN (they tend to want to stick together, and work in specific parts of London) but a qualified Norlander is definitely an option. That’s a lot more expensive of course. I’d assume more than £40k but the rates are all published online

IMO they are absolutely worth it, they are reliably fantastic - I’ve never heard anyone complain about their NQN/ Norlander

ignore the chippy comments, MN can be a hive of jealousy sometimes

There's clearly a difference between Norland and other nannies and I disagree that it's just the name. From what I understand, it's not that that the nannies are necessarily better with children or anything like that (you'd hope that most nannies would be good with kids!) but it's around structure and expectations. There are clear expectations for Norland nannies in terms of what they will do for and with the children, and the employer benefits from this to a large degree - you don't need to specify that they should cook from scratch, clean up after the kids or put in place a schedule of activities, as these things are clearly understood by the nannies to start off with, and they have spent significant time working on all these skills to ensure that they are done to a good standard.

How many times do you see someone on MN complaining that their nanny doesn't clean up after the kids or only feeds them easy meals/leftovers? And the advice they're generally given is that if the nanny is good with the kids and they like her, then they should just compromise on the other stuff.

But I guess if you don't want to compromise and actually you want to come home to a clean house and your children fed home-cooked meals, then a Norland nanny is a good bet. Not because there aren't other nannies who can do this (of course there are), but because it avoids the discussion around expectations which are clear from the start, and that just makes everything easier.

@CrispieCake agree with you. Not only do Norlanders rigorously meal plan every week with everything cooked from scratch but the meals are also carefully nutritionally balanced.

The big thing about Norlanders for me is the degree; the importance of play, child development, speech and communication, attachment theories - all of this is incredibly useful.

They are also great the practical stuff stuff such as sewing which is great and of course always tidy up and are sworn to absolute discretion. People fixate on the uniform but in a way the whole uniform and very strict rules for the 3 years in place is a way of making sure they are suitable. If you’re not going to stick by the rules you won’t make a good Norlander. Which true for a lot of careers.

I worked as a nanny for over 15 years and half of my nanny friends were Norlanders. Some of the Norlanders were great nannies, others weren't.

Hiring a nanny is often more down to compatibility, do your views on raising children align, do you get on together, do you have similar thoughts on taking the children out and about, will you be working as a team or will the nanny have complete sole charge. Each family and each nanny are different, and the key to successfully hiring a long lasting nanny who enjoys her work is often about making sure you are both on a similar page.

Lots of people who have chosen nannying as a vocation don't have the money to go to Norland, it is very very expensive.
The nanny duties you want are very standard and you can easily write that into a contract for any nanny, Norland or not.

I'd personally save your money on hiring a Norland nanny and use that money to use a local nanny agency to find a nanny. Be specific in your job description that you want a nanny who focuses on child development and anything else that is important to you - then you'll be more likely to find a nanny who is on a similar page to you and works in a similar way.

Someone is a bully because they point out that someone with high-level qualifications obtained through a selective institution may be regarded differently from someone who does not have such qualifications?

You might also want to check your grammar and punctuation if you want to make the point that you are just as good as a nanny with higher level credentials.

I do not know a single nurse who earns below 100k in the city I live in in the US - most are on 125k plus.77k is a starting salary and most nurses earn more than that in the urban areas and the nanny salaries keep pace with that so a Norland nanny salary sounds like a bargain as I assume anyone hiring one in the UK is probably earning at least 60k so will come out with some income after they pay the nanny. There are so many good things about the UK but salaries are not one of them- they seem to have stayed the same as when I graduated twenty years ago. I would have thought a regular nanny makes at least 40 k never mind a Norland nanny if they are to ever buy a home that costs what 500k even in a provinicial town never mind London, that is still 12 times a nanny salary.
I think there will be less Norland nannies up North because there are simply more jobs in the South where there is more of a concentration of wealthy families I would guess, I think that is what the OP meant.
I was a stay home mum for a period of time, and I saw a lot of 'nannies' on their mobiles phones- the good nannies really stood out and they were maybe 30% of the ones I encountered in day to day life so if you are going to go and pursue your career, yes make sure you put a good, intelligent, caring and kind person in your place to raise your child for the hours you are working till you get home from work to take on the parenting because they will be parenting your child whilst you are working and a great nanny will do a great job equivalent to what you would do if you were not at work, but a mediocre nanny will do a mediocre job and then perhaps the trade off is in the long term not beneficial for your child. Finding the right nanny and paying them the salary they command is very important if you want to be able to focus on your career without anxiety about how your child is being raised whilst you are working for an employer to bring money in, get your own intellectual stimulation/sense of identity or whatever other gains you have deemed are worthy of the trade off of your child being with someone else. Plenty do it and it works out just fine, but it all hinges on having the right person doing the work you would have been doing with your child had you not been working. Those people can be hard to find but they are out there.

The health insurance in the US does take some getting used to and it depends upon what kind of job you have what kind of coverage you get but I tell you what alarms me more than working in the US is calling for an ambulance when you have symptoms of a heart attack (in the UK) and being told it will be at least 6 hours. It was a family member in that situation and they died before the ambulance could get to them. Thing is that 300 million people live in the US and they do find a way to make the health system work so whilst it is different in that you pay towards it you get excellent care and that ambulance that yes you pay towards, it arrives within minutes when you call it.
The NHS will not survive unless people start pumping more money into it- what I pay in the US towards my health insurance is a little less to what I paid in NI in the UK and for that I get excellent health care and no wait for specialist care and having visited the UK and waited 11 hours in A and E for care I know that I have lost faith in the NHS in the state it is currently in. In principle the NHS is the best system but it is just not working anymore is it? People are not getting treated in a timely manner and so I feel safer under the system in the US and I would be alarmed to have to depend on the NHS if I got seriously sick- it seems like a lottery what kind of care you get over there now. I do think the NHS is preferable to the private system in the US but only of the NHS can deliver and it just seems to be crumbling. People who have no income or low income in the US are able to access healthcare for free or at very low cost equivalent to National Insurance contributions- I don't think people are fully aware of that in the UK.

I had a trainee Norland Nanny join me for a week as a placement. It was really weird. She put plastic gloves and an apron on to change my baby's nappy like he was somehow toxic. She also was quite rude about breastfeeding and seemed to view my overall presence as a hinderance. Bearing in mind she was 20/21 and I was in my thirties and in my own home, I actually felt really undermined by her constantly telling me I was doing perfectly normal things 'wrong', like letting my 5 month old sleep in my room. Very old fashioned 'Dr Spock' vibes.

I had an amazing Norland nanny. She was waaaaaay posher than me but a total sweetheart and stayed with us for 7 years. There is certainly a preconception but actually she was wonderful and we are still in touch 2 years later.

but the most important thing in hiring a nanny is your instinct- that doesn’t lie. Qualifications are helpful but personality and fit is all. Don’t be blinded by some name.

I think it depends a lot on where exactly you are based. You want live out so if you are in a city/suburb which is affordable and attractive for a young adult relocating to your area to live you may find a Norland graduating nanny interested in your vacancy whereas if you're rural you may find that there's no suitable housing within a reasonable commute or it could be too expensive.

What else you are offering matters too - use of a car? Allowance for classes and excursions? Etc.

The only norland nanny I know personally graduated last year and stayed in Bath, live in but private annex, use of car and £40k on top!

Thanks! We live in a city suburb, a 5 min walk from the high street with lots of restaurants and pavement cafes and good transport links so it’s definitely a desirable area for young adults. The immediate neighbourhood is expensive but as we’re close to the city we are very close to the student areas which are much cheaper.

We only have one car because transport links are very good and it’s easier to get around on public transport but we’ll offer an annual travel card.

Our house also has a basement apartment which was there when we moved in but we never use. It has an open plan kitchen/living/dining room, large bedroom and bathroom and french doors to a small terrace so I think it would be perfect for a live in nanny. However, access is via the house and DH feels it isn’t private enough if the nanny and her friends are coming and going via the house at weekends and evenings. He likes to feel like our house is an oasis to switch off and relax. However, live in isn’t entirely out of the question if we’re unable to attract a live out nanny.

Well said.

I am with you on this. I do not cook. Avoid it as much as I can. There is nothing wrong with it. My mother does not cook either.
It is a very misogynistic to assume all women to be able to cook. Women are the worst in attacking other women. They would never ask a man this.

I would ask a man that tbh. Very interesting go hear there are people that don't cook, I am going to seriously consider it!!

I never cook, it's beyond tedious but then DS has left home.

I had a norland nanny come for a placement with me. They were really clinical. I wouldn’t have left my child with them (I was on maternity leave).

@Internationalpony

Did you ever find your Nanny ?

We’ve had three nannies over the years, as we moved house. Two were wonderful, but our nanny who trained at Norland had a different level of bond with the DC. She had chosen to spend three years training to work with small kids because she genuinely loved them, and the DC absolutely adored her. She could have chosen to do a degree in anything, but she chose this. Sadly, she’s moved to the other end of the country now so we haven’t seen her for a little while but she was a much-loved member of our extended family for years. I also cried when she left!

She never wore the uniform or ironed muslins or anything like that and she had a good network of nanny friends to help organise play dates when the kids were little but she was also very focused on the DC’s development. In lockdown, she was the homeschooling queen. She had a fabulous imagination and she was much better at being a dog or a rabbit or a spaceman than I was. One year, along with her birthday present, the DC wanted to give her a full size Disney princess costume because the three of them spent so many hours dressing up together and playing imaginary games. Neither of our other nannies was up for that intensity of imaginative play, lovely though they were. I was crap at that, and so was very happy to pay to ensure that the DC got that experience. She was worth every penny to us!