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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

Am I being unreasonable...

26 replies

DitavonTeese · 06/04/2008 21:10

...to not expect to pay a childminder when her children are sick and she therefore can't look after mine? I'm currently interviewing childminders and one of them, who's great and has two children at school, has said that (a) I'll need to pay her for bank hols and 4 weeks' holiday per year (I understand that this is standard, so I'm okay with it) and (b) if her children are ill and she can't take my daughter, I'll still have to pay her EVEN though it means I'll also have to pay for alternative childcare to cover that period.

I know she can't help it if her children are ill, but there have to be limits! I can't afford to pay £100 a day if her kids are sick and I've still got to go to work.

Does anyone else have the same arrangement?

OP posts:

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aGalChangedHerName · 06/04/2008 21:13

I am a CM and i don't know anyone who charges when their dc are ill. She is taking the piss i'm afraid.

Wouldn't touch her with a barge pole!!

mollythetortoise · 06/04/2008 21:19

don't agree to this. I stupidly agreed to this arrangement with my last CM and she used these days alot (about 5 times a year for 3 years) my dd was only with her 2 days a week so it worked out an extra 2.5 paid weeks for her.. it really use to bug me and I would never agree to this again

dmo · 06/04/2008 21:22

i wouldnt pay if her children were sick how silly
i understand you paying if your child is sick but not hers

Original poster

DitavonTeese · 06/04/2008 21:28

Thanks so much for your advice! I work as a freelancer which means I don't get holidays or sick pay or anything. A CM is also a freelancer, basically, aren't they, so already they're getting a good deal by getting holiday pay.

On that score, is it the same if she's sick? Do you charge/ pay when the childminder is sick?

I really like her so since you all say it's not the norm I will go back and negotiate with her, but if she doesn't budge I'll have to find someone else.

OP posts:

WallOfSilence · 06/04/2008 21:29

No!! I just turned down an otherwise very good childminder because of this!!

Why should you pay twice?? Makes me mad that some people are just in it for as much money as they can get.

Find someone who loves having kids around them, not just the money!!

mollythetortoise · 06/04/2008 21:30

my cm had 5 days a year for her/ her dd's sick. She was never actually sick apart from once but her dd's sickness used up the days. I wouldn't agree to pay for her or her children's sickness. Your child's sickness you should pay for of course.

Original poster

ditavonTeese · 06/04/2008 21:34

Thanks everyone, I'm really glad to see that I'm not just being unreasonable or stingy!! I'll go to see her again this week and it's really helpful to know that most CMs don't charge this.

Molly - sorry you had to learn the hard way!

OP posts:

looneytune · 06/04/2008 21:38

Taking the piss if you ask me. I'm a CM and although I know NCMA recommend we should get paid 4 weeks hols per year plus paid bank hols, I don't charge if I'm not available to work (whether holiday, my sickness, my child's sickness etc.) Being paid for all that makes it all too easy for her to decide at last min to say one of them is ill and she still gets paid!

crace · 06/04/2008 21:44

Same here, I don't work for whatever reason, bank holiday/holiday/sickness whatever - I don't get paid.

LynetteScavo · 06/04/2008 21:47

YANBU, it's just ridiculous for her to request this. Is she an NCMA member?

£100 per day? Sounds a lot. How many of your children will she be looking after?

Original poster

DitavonTeese · 06/04/2008 22:05

She charges £50 per day, but presumably I'll have to pay that again to replace her when her kids are ill. I know it's expensive, but we're in Portobello Road - v pricey London district. (Great name, btw - I LOVE Lynette!)

And yes, she is NCMA registered; I think you're all correct in saying that she was trying it on. Ha! She didn't bank on mumsnet, did she now??!

OP posts:

CarGirl · 06/04/2008 22:12

My CM works in her holiday pay etc into her hourly rate which IMO is much fairer when you do part time etc. If she's available you pay her, if she's not available you don't pay her, simple.

dmo · 06/04/2008 22:54

you dont pay when the cm is sick or her children are and she does not work

ayla99 · 07/04/2008 08:55

I heard of a childminder who charged 1/2 fees for all sickness, whether it was the minded child or her own family. But she's in the minority.

I've never heard of anyone charging full fees when they are closed for their own family's sickness.

Presumably none of the other childminders you've visited do this?

Rubybees · 07/04/2008 15:21

just catching up and YANBU

bloody cheek!

Same as most, if I'm unavaible no fee charged

HappyMummyOfOne · 07/04/2008 19:54

No, I wouldnt pay a childminder if her children were sick or she was on holiday. I would expect to pay if my child was sick or for our holidays.

Part of being self employed is not being paid when you are unavailable for work.

NotABanana · 07/04/2008 19:56

I am confused.

If Cm are self employed why do they get holiday pay?

NotABanana · 09/04/2008 15:45

I would be interested to know this answer.

ASAIK Self employed people don't get holiday pay, CM insist they are self employed, yet they insist the families pay them holiday pay, seems double standards to me.

imananny · 09/04/2008 16:00

Good point,notabanana

As CM are SE, in thorey they shouldnt be paid for holidays

when i was a temp/mn i was se ( a few years ago now) and I didnt get paid any holidays I had off

my DH is SE and he doesnt get any paid holidays,so all holidays cost us double - the price of a holiday and then 2 weeks of no salary coming in

nannynick · 09/04/2008 16:05

I think part of the issue is that some parents will shop around on price, when it comes to childcare. Childminder's rates are sometimes listed by their local council (and on ChildcareLink) and to keep the hourly rate down, they have additional charges - for example: outings, food, school pickups, and retainer fees for during holiday periods.

Childminders could increase their hourly rate, to take into account that they are not paid during their own holidays - as is the case with other self employed people. But if one childminder does this in an area, and the others don't... then that childminder will look expensive compared to the others.

MrsThierryHenry · 09/04/2008 23:34

When I was looking for a CM I had two options: one who I thought was brilliant, who charged less and asked for hols pay; and one who I had some reservations about and charged £10 more per hour but no hol pay.

In the end we went for the brilliant woman, because we had most confidence in her. I then calculated how much I'd have to pay them in a year and it turned out that the one who didn't take hols pay would have worked out more expensive in the long run. Work that out if you can!

vInTaGeVioLeT · 10/04/2008 09:09

jeez . . . she's totally trying it on!!!!
go back and negotiate - my son has just had a sickness bug and i've lost 3 days pay[school holidays too so double normal pay] but that's just my tough luck!!!

i don't charge if i'm ill
i don't charge if my kids are ill

i charge half rate if mindees can't come due to illness - as i find if you charge full parents will bring them ill but not tell you they are

i think you should pay a c/m 4 weeks holiday and she should offer you 4 weeks extra holiday at half-rate.

vInTaGeVioLeT · 10/04/2008 09:20

oh and i charge half-rate for bank holidays

and for the self-employed shouldn't get paid when unavailable brigade . . . . sigh.

holidays - me and minded families try and co-ordinate our holidays - so it's no different to paying me if they are on holiday. iyswim.

bank-holidays - i am available to work.

raising the hourly rate to include holidays/bankholidays/food/outings - if i did this it would price me out of the market as other c/m in the area don't do this

also yes i am self-employed but i don't charge a massive hourly rate and a call out fee like plumbers/mechanics etc

tinkplus1 · 11/04/2008 17:06

Hello there I am new to this site but have worked as a childminder for the last 3 years. I charge all my parents 1 month in advance for their contracted hours. If THEY do not arrive for the those hours for whatever reason then I still keep the money. However if I am sick or if my daughter is sick then parents recieve a credit on the next months bill.

If a sick child arrives and mum doesn't say anything I will call parents back as soon as it becomes aparant that the child is unwell. I also enforce a 48 hours clear policy, so i will not accept a child for 48 hours after their last episode of d & V. Parents are asked to sign a copy of this policy which forms part of the contract.

Whilst I think this cm is taking the mick by asking for pay whilst her children are sick. As a self employed person she is entitled to charge what she wants. Even if it means she loses out because some parents won't go near her.

purplebee · 11/04/2008 23:50

I have a CM who has ds of her own, we never had a formal agreement, but when her child was poorly, I paid her for the time she was off because I would be lost without her! I think if you have a CM you are fond of and you trust,it makes sense to look after them.
I am self-employed myself and got no maternity leave and I don't get compensated when I or my child is poorly and it makes things hard so I guess that makes me a lot more sympathetic towards other self-employed people.

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