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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

whats the difference between a nanny and a CM?

40 replies

spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 12:34

hi just wondered what the diffeerence is ?

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southernbelle77 · 18/02/2008 12:36

A nanny works in your home and a cm works in their own home. A cm has to be Ofsted registered and inspected.

EffiePerine · 18/02/2008 12:37

Nanny usually looks after your child in your own home and works for you alone (or with another fmaily if a share). CM looks after child in their home and may look after several - limited to 1 under 1, 3 under 3 I think?

With a CM you'll be paying an hourly rate, with a nanny you may be paying NI etc. on top of that (but have never employed a nanny so not entirely sure)

avenanap · 18/02/2008 12:37

Nanny's look after the child in the child's home, they are pretty much unregulated, Childminders have children in their home and are registered with the local council and come under Ofsted. You pay more money to a Nanny because they only care for your children, whereas a childminder can have a few.

BirdyArms · 18/02/2008 12:46

Nanny normally does the children's washing, will cook their meals, tidy their toys and rooms etc. With a childminder you may have to provide meals, need to take nappies etc.

With a nanny you don't need to worry about getting your children out of the house in the morning but you do need to leave your house in a reasonable state and make sure that you haven't run out of the basics.

Also there is additional reposnsibility of being an employer if you have a nanny.

spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 12:52

hi im based in brighton and ill be returning to work two days a week full days when dd is nearly a year . id like her to get one to one care[as i dont like the thought dd might not be watched all the time and only have say a third of someones attention iykwim?] in the CM own home
do some childminders just look after just the one for more money of course
how much should i expect to pay

or is it impossible to get a CM one to one

don't like thought of nannys operating unregulated, childminders sound a bit safer
how often do the cms get inspected ?

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EffiePerine · 18/02/2008 13:01

Inspection yearly, I think. Ask around for locals CM's : my CM just has DS for most of the day and also looks after an older child after school (and her own son, also school-age). There may well be a CM who only wants to take on one child due to circumstances. OTOH, I think the 'family' atmosphere of having a few kidsa round of differnt ages is a big benefit of using a CM.

spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 13:13

do they normally have large houses and big gardens ?

where do they nap?

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LoveMyGirls · 18/02/2008 13:14

cm's get inspected by ofsted every 3 years, one to one is possible but i'd say it would be rare, you may find a childminder who has older children that are school most of the day and if you paid more might be willing to only care for your dd.

I'm a cm and personally wouldn't like to offer to only care for one child, I like the way they all mix and play together, I think it's important for children to learn social skills, I don't think its a bad thing for them to learn that they cannot always get one to one attention. Encouraging one to one may cause problems imo because the child might then not settle well in busy environments or if a sibling comes along they won't be used to sharing (attention as well as toys) I think encouraging children to mix from a young age is a positive step. I've also found younger children learn a lot from the older children and are more forward with their development and they love watching the older ones play there really is a lot to be said about a childminders setting compared to that of a nursery or nanny but of course the choice is there so we can chose what is best for our own children and in this case i'm biased!

A childminder would only be able to care for 1 child under 1 so the others in this case would be older/ more independant.

(if you're wondering how I have time to type this, my 2 are both asleep and i'm having lunch )

LoveMyGirls · 18/02/2008 13:17

My house is a normal 3 bed semi with a garden large enough for 10ft trampoline, 2 swings, sea swa slide, playhouse etc, dd2's bedroom is the largest in the house so I use her's for childminding, there's room for 3 cots and her single bed but all setting's vary so the best thing to do is arrange to see a few and see how you feel after that tbh.

spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 13:20

lovemygirls thats sounds wonderful

do you feel a cm is the next best thing to mummy ?
what made you want to become a cm ?

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LoveMyGirls · 18/02/2008 13:37

I think we can offer a second home to children we care for, I wanted to become a childminder to create happy memories for children (as I have/ am doing with my own) who come to me in an environment that makes them feel comfortable and at home as long as they are happy (and their parents) then i'm happy. I also get to be with my own children and my own children get other children to play with all the time I love what I do, everyday is different but the same in a comfortable way iyswim?

I think it's important to find a childminder who has a similar parenting style to your own then it can work out long term as we care for all ages we can care for a child from tiny all the way to high school which i think is brilliant and hope to do that with my mindee's, I've only been doing it 2 years and haven't kept any mindee's longer than 1yr yet but my 8mth old mindee who has been with me 6 weeks and has settled wonderfully i'm hoping will be one of the children I get to keep for a long time, his mum has already said she is going to try and keep him with me until he starts school at least!

abidabidoo · 18/02/2008 13:50

My CM usually has two others at the same time as my dd - they are similar ages, which I liked before we started and it has been great - it is like a another family for her. She will learn to share much more I think, and to be considerate of others feelings because she spends consistent time with them (rather than at a toddler group IYSWIM).

They nap in separate bedrooms - CM has two kids so enough rooms.

We provide breakfast, I pay extra for CM to provide lunch (and I have to say it's a lot more varied than I would manage to come up with myself). She writes a diary of what dd has been up to which is lovely to read, and also good for knowing how long slept, when dirty nappy etc.

CMs probably tend to be more mature? Nannies younger - I could be wrong here. But I liked a bit of experience with own kids, and my CM has taught in nurseries as well which I liked.

I love my CM!

Judy1234 · 18/02/2008 13:51

Whilst it's true nannies are not subject to regulation they are usuall more expensive, have more education and better training (the CMs on this thread can shoot me now for saying that) so usually nanny the hoice of the richer more educated parents and CM for the poorer - that's how it's usually gone in the UK.

Also if you had 3 children under 4 as we did it can be cheaper to have one nanny in your house under your control rather than paying for 3 sets of CM fees.

But both can be good. Most nannies will want to work full time for you as they cannot live on half a wage so you might find a few days a week harder to arrange.

Kewcumber · 18/02/2008 14:00

"i dont like the thought dd might not be watched all the time and only have say a third of someones attention iykwim" - one fo the things DS loves about the CM is the older children. He doesn't get that at home.

Anyway looking after 3 children at a CM isn't any different to having 3 children at home with a SAHM is it?

If someone hasn;t already said it - you can;t compare all CM's with all nannies. You need to look at individuals - some excellent CM's around and some excellent nannies.

Kewcumber · 18/02/2008 14:05

I'm not sure the issue wrt nnaies is that they are better educated - I have no idea whether this is true or not. I would prefer an experienced 40 yr old mother who's raised 4 children of her own looking after DS than a 19 year old.

Rich people use CM's less often because nanies are more convenient - they usually live in and are prepared to do earlier starts, they will ususally do babysitting 2 nights a week too and you dont; have to trek off to someone elses house at the end of a long day in work to pick up your DC's. Also CM's often can't afford to live in areas where rich preople live (unless they've been there donkeys years) so there's much less choice.

I think more affluent people also like the sound of "my nanny" rather than "my childminder". My (rich) sister had soeone watch her kids for one morning a week (she was SAHM) and still insisted on calling this person her "nanny". I'd have called them a babysitter!

nannynick · 18/02/2008 15:05

I'll try to answer each question as it arises in the thread so far... as there seems to be some confusion by some posters.

There are several key differences between a nanny and a childminder. I feel the key differences are:
~ A nanny cares for children, at the child's home - a childminder cares for children at the carers home.
~ A nanny is an employee, so will do as you tell them - a childminder runs a business, and you have to fit in with how that business operates. For example, a childminder may have fixed hours they work, whereas a nanny may work long hours typically 11 hours+ per day.
~ A nanny currently does not have to be registered by government (though this may change), a childminder is registered and inspected once every 3 years (though can be more often than that, and also less often).
~ A nanny can voluntarily register under Ofsted, and may be inspected (this registration is useful for parents who get Childcare Vouchers and/or Tax Credits).
~ The registered body will check a childminder's suitability (plus members of their immediate family aged 16+) to work with children. Nannies have their suitability checked by the parents and/or agency (Registered nannies will have to meet specific registration requirements). Parents employing a nanny ultimately make the recruitment decision and monitor how their employee does their job.
Note: All childcare workers these days have an Enhanced CRB check, register nannies have this updated yearly (childminders don't currently get theirs updated as often). Childcare workers also will often have Early Years First Aid training, plus may have specific training relating to childcare - such as an NVQ Level 3 in Childcare and Education (or equivalent).
~ A nanny may (subject to contract) do household tasks related to the children, whereas a childminder will not (as they are not at your home).

There are no doubt other differences, but I consider the above to be the major ones.

With one child for whom you want 1:1 care, a nanny may be your only option, as a childminder will probably have other children to care for, at least at some point during the day (such as from school collection time onwards). Part-Time, Live-Out nannies in some areas can be hard to find, while childminders may be more able to accommodate a child attending 2 days per week.

is it impossible to get a CM one to one

I would say that it may be very hard. A childminder just starting out may like the idea, but established childminders I feel will want to care for a variety of ages of children. So you may find that a childminder who cares mostly for after-school children, could provide 1:1 care for part of the day.
Cost is hard to know as childminders run their business as they like and thus will charge what they like. 1:1 care would not be the norm, so you would need to ask each childminder specifically about that.

A nanny I would expect to set you back maybe around £79-£100 per day (inclusive of taxes) - a quick search of Part Time Nanny Jobs in Brighton resulted in salary offers of £7 net per hour to the nanny. Thus if it were a 10 hour day, that is £70 per day, which for 2 days is around £152 gross per week (if you are their only employer) or around £185 gross per week if on BR tax code. Added to that is Employers NI which for £152 per week is around £6.66. Thus total of say £159 per week, thus £79.50 per day. Useful Tools: E-Gismos PAYE Calculator ListenToTaxman PAYE Calculator

do they normally have large houses and big gardens?

No. It will vary hugely between childminders. In a city especially, you may find that it ranges from childminders working from a 2-bed flat, to childminders working from detached houses. Big house does not always mean big garden, as land in the South is at a premium and gardens get developed. Childminders will often use a local park.

where do they nap?
Childminders rarely get time for naps
Neither do nannies
Oh, you meant the children! Sometimes a bed is provided (not all childminders will have bedrooms included in their registration), though some children will nap in buggies, on a mat on the floor, in a portable cot, that sort of thing.

do you feel a cm is the next best thing to mummy?
Could be next best thing to daddy as some childminders, like some nannies, are male. With young children having consistency I feel is vital, so having a primary carer, is I feel better than having various carers (as could occur at a nursery).

spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 15:21

hi nanny nick thanks for that in depth Analysis

id love dd to have a male cm or nanny

i agree with kewcumber
some excellent CM's around and some excellent nannies
id also rather go for experience
which i understand you can get with both

i suppose i just want someone that will look after dd just the way i do.

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nannynick · 18/02/2008 15:29

Finding someone with lots of experience and who does things the same you do, will often be your ideal match. They will have a vast knowledge about children of various ages, so can help prepare you for upcoming stages in your DD's development, plus spot if anything appears not to be following usual development patterns. This can be very reassuring for new parents, who can benefit from having someone to ask about child related things.

I would advise that you look at childminders (from your other posts, it looks like you are heading in that direction already) and not for 1:1 care. Small homely environment with a childminder who cares for a variety of ages of child could work well for you - babies are usually centre of attention, and benefit from having older (almost sibling like) children around them.

spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 15:32

thanks nick i think your right. i suppose i just want her to be pampered to the max lol
although i can do that for 5 days of the week so maybe other children a couple of days a week will be good for dd

wish i didnt have to go back to work, and i could be with dd allday everyday but needs must i guess!

yes i think a cm is more what im looking for

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spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 15:33

oh one last question ....

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spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 15:34

my dd dosnt have a routine at all and shes a really happy baby sleeping well at night and in the day etc always smiling and happy

so i like not having a routine as it means we are free spirits and can come and go as we please, dd will sleep anywhere! will the cm need her to have a routine or put her in a routine when shes there ?

thanks

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nannynick · 18/02/2008 15:38

A childminder works in partnership with parents, so you can tell a childminder that your dd does not have a regular sleep pattern and it's fine for her to nap as and when she feels like it.
As a nanny, I care for a 9 month old like your dd... no daytime nap routine, but sleeps well at night. Some days she will have a nap, especially if we've been doing an energetic activity - such as swimming. She will often cat-nap when in the carseat, while travelling to/from activities.

Judy1234 · 18/02/2008 15:39

I actualyl one way to make having a CM or nanny work is (and I've had various difference ones for nearly 23 years now) is that you accept they will not do things the way you do (obviously within reason - yo udon't someone who smacks or is really strict if you're quite free etc) and that the child will benefit from the differences.

Nannies are kind of more yours, you stipulate more- take it to XYZ child gym at 10.30am etc. - they are employees in that sense.

If there are more children even more younger siblings the more likely you need some kind of a routine.

spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 15:41

yes thats just what my dd does somedays she has a several naps others she doesnt
and she does like a good nap after swimming

btw ive just looked at your website, its very good and well laid out. i wish your where in brighton.

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spottyzebra · 18/02/2008 15:45

btw nick can you tell me what CACHE stands for as ive seen it one many sites ive been reserching trying to find suitable childcare for dd

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