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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

UPDATE! The old nanny v the temporary maternity cover nanny!!

31 replies

ziopin · 06/11/2007 10:52

The temp nanny still absolutely fab! We are desperate to keep her!

Still no word from old nanny regarding coming back to work (without baby) or not!

Am thinking of asking her towards the end of the month if she's had time to think what she wants to do after her maternity leave, and saying that if she has decided to leave, then she could have all her maternity pay (it's sitting in my bank account at the mo) all in one lump sum at the end of the month. Obviously she would have to give me her letter of resignation first.

What do you think?

OP posts:

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ExpLEUSIveS · 06/11/2007 11:01

Nice thought, but I don't think you can do that. She has until the end of her leave to decide if she's coming back. But, she's not. You know that don't you? Just stand your ground about no baby, and it will all work out.

Although I do appreciate your desire to cut her loose as soon as possible seeing as she is such a coniving little witch.

susie100 · 06/11/2007 11:28

Just a quick question as a future nanny employer (2 months time!) do you have to pay maternity leave and a temp nanny (GULP!)

Ziopin - I have followed your threads and I hope your old nanny decides not to come back, she sounded pretty terrible! Glad you have found a nice new one!

Original poster

ziopin · 06/11/2007 11:43

Yes - you have to pay maternity pay, but you claim it all back from the IRev - plus a little extra (3%) I think!

I'm hoping, (fingers crossed) that we can keep our lovely new nanny, but it's old nannys call at the end of the day!

OP posts:

susie100 · 06/11/2007 12:03

Thanks for that clarification, I was going to have to re-think a nanny if it meant double paying potentially!!

Good luck

ExpLEUSIveS · 06/11/2007 13:40

Susie100, you can write a fixed term contract. Then you have no obligation to renew when it expires, freeing you up to replace the nanny rather than fork out for a temp nanny while you hold the permanent position.

flowerybeanbag · 06/11/2007 13:52

For the avoidance of doubt, someone on a fixed term contract cannot be treated differently. Maternity rights are based on length of service not whether a contract is due to 'expire' or not, and that includes the right to return to a job if there is one there. So if a woman meets the necessary requirements for maternity leave, is employed at the right time, the fact that she is on a fixed term contract is irrelevant, and if there is a job there when she is due to return, it is hers.

here.

Just didn't want anyone thinking calling a job a fixed term contract was an easy get-out of maternity responsibilities.

flowerybeanbag · 06/11/2007 13:54

And here about rights of fixed term employees, for further information.

NAB3littlemonkeys · 06/11/2007 13:56

Obviously I have missed this but a question. If previous nanny was so bad why wasn't she sacked?

I would get advice about maternity pay. Doesn't sound like she deserves a wodge of cash and if she can't bring her baby...

She won't sue you for constructive dismissal will she because you won't let her bring baby?

ExpLEUSIveS · 06/11/2007 14:06

I'm not suggesting you avoid paying maternity pay, but it will keep you from having to save the job throughout her maternity leave. A fixed term contract ends when it expires. And the employee getting pregnant does not extend the length of the contract. This is perfectly legal.

ExpLEUSIveS · 06/11/2007 14:09

She has no right to bring her baby back to work. And it doesn't give her grounds to sue for anything... and I'm sure she has looked into it.

flowerybeanbag · 06/11/2007 14:24

Eleusis I was just concerned that someone reading your post may think that employing someone on a fixed term contract avoids maternity responsibilities.
As I said, I was posting for the avoidance of doubt and giving further information about fixed term contracts in case someone might consider this as an option- if they did they would need to be fully informed about the rights of fixed terms workers. As I am sure you are.

ExpLEUSIveS · 06/11/2007 14:26

Another option is to employ someone who is here on a holiday maker visa. She can work for 12 months and that is it. So you aren't making her redundant but her right to work here has expired.

nannynick · 06/11/2007 22:48

Could always opt for a male nanny - though they could get 2 weeks off for paternity leave

susie100 · 07/11/2007 09:51

Thanks for all of this - flowerybeanbag, Eleusis and nannynick. Becoming an employer for the first time really is a minefield!

I had not really considered a male nanny, funny isn't it although I can see it being a huge advantage with 3 energetic boys for example. I have actually found a lovely young nanny who speaks Italian (big plus point for me as trying to bring dd up bilingually)

So just to be clear - a fixed term contract expires after whatever time you set it for. Maternity pay is unaffected but you don't have to hold the job open for the nanny to come back to of the contract expires during that time?

I must start reading up about this!

susie100 · 07/11/2007 09:51

And sorry for hijack Ziopin!

GloriaInEleusis · 07/11/2007 13:47

Yep, Susie. That is my understanding. Of course, I am not a lawyer. So you might double check it. But I would write a 12 month fixed term contract with a 3 month probationary clause. Also, think about how much notice period you want. 4 weeks is standard, but you can put less if you want. The probationary period usually has something like a week's notice required on either side.

If this is a live-in nanny then you should also have a set of house rules. And it's nice if you can organise a welcome pack for her and put it in her room for her arrival.

Piggy · 07/11/2007 13:57

Whilst I agree with pretty much everything Eleusis says about hiring a nanny and about nannies in general I would just mention that a one year fixed term contract might put some people off applying for the job. A lot of nannies I have come across are looking for something a bit longer term (although I entirely accept that the fixed term can be renewed)

Just a thought.

GloriaInEleusis · 07/11/2007 14:54

Ah yes. That's true Piggy. As with any job negotiation you have to weigh what you are willing to offer with what the market of potential nannies will accept. You could always put it in the contract and then if she queries it and says it's not okay, you might have to be willing to make it permanent.

But, permanent seems a bit misleading since surely the children will grow and then you won't need a nanny. So any nanny job seems to have it's limits in length of service.

Think I'll stick with my holiday maker visa applicants, who can only work here for 12 months anyway. The down side is sometimes you have to say good-bye when you don't want to.

GloriaInEleusis · 07/11/2007 14:56

Ziopin, sorry about the hijack. Keep us posted on the pending departure of your soon to be x evil nanny. You know we are always interested!

RahRahRachel · 07/11/2007 14:57

Trying to think up ways of avoiding holding jobs for pregnant workers seems pretty mean to me - how would you feel if your employer tried to do that? Aren't these rights that feminists have fought for for ALL women, not just the highly paid ones?

GloriaInEleusis · 07/11/2007 15:08

I was in fact diddled in a simlar fashion when I was pregnant with my first child.

The thing is childcare is barely affordable for so many of us. Then the government turns round and treats working parents like profitable businesses. I just can't afford to take any financial risks. I barely scrape by as it is. And I can not take the risk of having to pay even higher prices for childcare. I simply can not swing it.

I am not a small business. I am a parent. I find it outrageous that Gordon Brown taxes me like I am profitable when in fact he is the reason I'm not.

RahRahRachel · 07/11/2007 15:11

I'm sure that will be of great comfort to the nanny who finds herself pregnant and unemployed. If you were in a similar position yourself I'd have thought you'd be a bit more compassionate towards other women.

GloriaInEleusis · 07/11/2007 15:23

There are plenty of people who have it worse than nannies.

GloriaInEleusis · 07/11/2007 15:26

Besides, we aren't talking about prenant and unemployed. We are just talking about not hiring an inflated price temp nanny to cover maternity leave. She can get another job when she is finished with maternity leave quite easily. And I wouldn't ever let her go because she was pregnant. I am just saying that I couldn't hold the job and pay a temp nanny for 12 months of leave.

susie100 · 08/11/2007 08:36

Thanks for this Eleusis, very helpful. It is indeed the idea of paying for a temp nanny that is terrifying me to be honest. A nanny is going to be a stretch for us but a sacrifice I am prepared to make as I think it is the best care for a young baby!

I only get stat. maternity leave so I have been effectively with no pay for 6 months...things are tight! I agree it does seem a bit mean unfeminist but it is a reality for a lot of women unfortunately.

Shall we start a petition for chilcare costs to be payable out of gross income? Surely it must have been done already?

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