Overnight nanny

[frontlegsofacow]

I'm tentatively looking at employing an overnight nanny for 2-3 nights a week.
I have a job where I am on call overnight but highly unlikely to be called out past 8pm. I may be seeing patients beyond that time if I was called in the afternoon.
My mum currently stays at mine and covers this but she's not getting any younger! She would still pick up from school and stay till 7.
So they could combine this with another job in the day if they wanted as they would only need to be at my house 7-7, could go to bed anytime from 9/10 as children will be asleep and wouldn't have many duties at all if I was out and none if I was at home.
Would I need to pay them their full hourly rate to sleep? My children never get up in the night and happily take themselves off to make a bowl of cereal if they wake earlier than normal on a morning.
The other alternative is someone very local who could be on call from their home and come here to sleep if I had to go out. Again how would a retainer work out?

There is a court case which I think is still ongoing which is related to this subject. Latest I can find is this www.brownejacobson.com/health/training-and-resources/legal-updates/2020/02/tomlinson-blake-v-mencap but if anyone knows of a final outcome please do post details.

If the final ruling agrees with the initial ruling, then NMW is payable throughout a period someone is sleeping at work. In my view this is not unreasonable as that person is responsible for, in your case, the children and the property. Yes they may be sleeping some of the time but they won't be as rested as them being in their own bed in their own home. Having done overnights I can testify that you don't sleep as well as you are aware that the children can wake up.

The job role must be appealing to applicants, or you will not find anyone to do the job. If you offered a fixed rate of say £50, then you probably won't find anyone. If you offer NMW throughout you probably won't find anyone either in my view.

7am finish time may not work in combining with another job. I often start my nanny job at 7am. So finishing am overnight job at 7am would not work for me. Daytime nanny jobs can be 7am-7pm, can be less, can be more... I've worked 14 hour days in the past.
It will all depend on the particular applicant and it could change over a period of time. Jobs come and go so something that fits now, may not fit later.

Until the final court ruling I would offer at least NMW throughout and I feel you will need to offer more to get any applicants - but advertise and see what you get.

That's really helpful, I didn't know that. Re the 7am finish I could change it to a 6am finish as if I got called at 6am (rare as hens teeth event) it would bounce to the day team anyway so that might work better.
It's a bit if a mare to sort out. My old nanny used to do on calls from her home when she worked for a surgeon and she got a £50 retainer and hourly rate if she got called out. I'd rather someone on call, not for financial reasons but because an overnight call that requires me to go in is rare but I have to be prepared to should it happen.

Au pair?

I'm not in an au pair worthy area! Medium sized village, very pretty but nothing going for a young person wanting to explore an area and improve their English. The nearest city that would appeal is 30 miles away and it takes two hours and two buses/trains to do that journey. I have thought about it though :-)

You’d be surprised! Local to us there are some in the most boring villages. Give Childcare international a bell and see what profiles they have!

I would try and get 2/3 nannies so one would be able to do the night

How much notice do you get

And yes minimum nmw

@Blondeshavemorefun

I would try and get 2/3 nannies so one would be able to do the night

How much notice do you get

And yes minimum nmw

I have a 90 minute response time including a 40 minute drive door to door

So you know the nights you work but sometimes you need overnight cover but get literally 30m notice ?

If uou need someone to be on call then you have to pay them

Can’t your mum manage if they are in bed

Assume no dad /partner in picture ?

I know which nights I'm on call and I have a 90 minute response time. It's rare I get called out and often just have to give telephone advice but I have to be prepared to go out if needed.
My mum copes fine currently but she isn't getting any younger and I am tentatively planning for when she can't help any longer.
Ex can't even manage his own life and I never tell him I'm on call if he happens to have the children overnight as he cancels having them at short notice to try and cause me maximum inconvenience.

Yes, you would have to pay someone just to sleep, and also to be on call, as they are not able to get another gig if they are on call for you.

YY to 6am as opposed to 7am end time.

Does your mum have any current health issues?
Has she expressed any problem with helping out?

How old are your DCs? They are presumably getting more mature and responsible too.
I wouldn't discount the idea of an au pair. Not all of them are looking for the big city lifestyle. But I would continue with your mum as long as possible.

My children are primary age and one has ASC so being able to leave them overnight is a very long way off!
My mum is fine doing it at the minute but I don't want to blindly assume that situation will continue forever.
Helpful to just put the feelers out on MN as I wasn't aware of paying normal hourly rate for an overnight nanny. That's been helpful.

My friends were drs and had an au pair in a village. They provided a car.

@movingonup20

My friends were drs and had an au pair in a village. They provided a car.

Nice idea but way beyond my income. I can just about afford to run my own car!

Au pair doesn’t have to have their own car. We always have older ones (mid 20s) who are seasoned drivers and they use ours. So far in our family we’ve had a paediatric nurse, two trainee teachers and a trainee psychologist- so all sensible responsible adults.

Where are you based @frontlegsofacow?

@saywhatwhatnow

Where are you based *@frontlegsofacow*?

I'd rather not say specifically but I'm far enough north to be classed as a Scot with their head kicked in 😂

Have you considered someone older? You see I would be happy to be at home on a retainer and on call. My children have grown up and flown and I have just resigned from my TA job. Someone like myself might be ideal for you.

Do you need childcare in the day, as maybe a live in nanny would work better as she will sleep in the house?

I had a maternity nanny/night nanny for a few weeks after having my second and she was paid a daily rate, so we definitely paid while she was asleep.

I think you could find someone quite easily actually. How often are you on call? I know quite a few women (obviously it’s always women) who work night shifts at the supermarkets so they can be home during the day/go and do a day job... I think you’d find takers if you advertised.

I think the nanny responses you got initially are reasonable for a professional nanny, but like someone else said a local trustworthy person would be enough. They don’t need to be a professional nanny. I can think of a few mums of secondary aged children who would be fine doing this or sensible students who tend not to be so bothered by late nights. I think it would be reasonable (assuming it’s legal to do so) to have an hourly rate until 10pm and then a sleep in fee. So maybe £12ph for 7-10pm = £36 and then £50 sleep in fee. So overall £86/night.

The other alternative is an after school nanny for the hours from school pick up until 8pm say. Then your mum does the easier bit of sleeping in your house.