Concerned nanny

[Emrae]

Hi,

I’m wondering if anyone else’s bosses are driving them insane as we are spending more time with them than normal. I started as an after school nanny with two boys, 6 and 10 in January which has changed to full time now since lockdown . The boys are ridiculously obedient and respectful that sometimes I think they are not normal LOL! I am glad did this of course as mostly nannies get treated quite badly by this age group as they tend to get a little sassy. To be fair the parents are not rude at all and treat me very fairly so I can cope for the most part.

The problem is that I’ve realised I don’t agree with their parenting style at all and never realised it until now since I never really saw them parent in action. The mum’s style of parenting is ‘power trippy.’ She seems to get a kick out of intimidating her kids. The dad is also overly strict and just punishes for slight misbehaviours. Instead of letting me handle things on my own, they come downstairs if the children are being ‘naughty’ and shout at them really aggressively and give them severe punishments (like a TV ban for a week) even though all they were doing was being giddy and a bit OTT. The eldest one is quite immature and I do get annoyed with him for not listening. However I think the style of parenting is causing both children to act immature as there’s no room to make mistakes sort of speak. They both get called ‘dumb’ and told to ‘shut up’ on a daily basis. Even when they’re not doing anything to warrant that kind of talk in the first place. One day the youngest one have his mum a hug and she told him not to be so dumb, that she was trying to do something and another day the oldest child was trying to tell me something but the dad was also trying to explain the same thing to me and just told his son to shut up. You could see this child break right in front of you.

I will give you some examples of last week:

The kids and I were having a lovely creative day (I notice the parents encourage TV and ipad instead of fun things to keep them quiet so I have been trying to get them to do more creative things instead), we spent the afternoon making things, painting and learning to draw things from YouTube videos. They were so well behaved all day (as they usually are) and at the end of the day as I was about to go home, they began to get a bit giddy and loud). They do this quite a lot and it is annoying as they are probably too old for it and the parents are trying to work upstairs. However, I explained to them that they can’t be loud and silly inside as your parents are working but you can play like that outside. I guess the parents could still hear as the mum stormed down the stairs and told them off for not being quiet. That’s fair enough but she just acted completely OTT, she shouted at the top of her lungs and the youngest one looked frightened. She then just sent them both into the living room to watch TV which I thought was a pity because they were so happy doing creative things previously and i think it gives them the impression that playing and having fun is wrong but lounging around and being on a screen is better.

Another day last week the boys and I were getting ready to go out to the park. The oldest one is very studious and had spent three hours doing his schoolwork all by himself (with no complaining) while I helped the youngest one. They had been quiet all morning but as soon as we were about to get shoes on etc. they got so hyper and started messing with each other, wouldn’t calm down and be quiet like I’d asked them. I gave them a warning and they sort of calmed down but the youngest one threw his sock playfully at the oldest which set him off. All he said was ‘go away’ loudly but that was enough to get the dad to come down and tell them off in an OTT manner. It’s not as if I wasn’t handling it, the kids had their shoes on at this point and were just about to leave but obviously they were being loud so probably annoying to the parents, I understand that. The oldest one explained to his dad why he told his brother to go away but the more he talked, the more the dad got angry. He gave him a one week TV ban and everytime the child talked (only just to explain himself) the dad upped his ban more and more. I told the dad that it was actually the youngest one who threw something but that just got them both a TV ban. Then as we walked towards the park the mood was just so low and I felt so sorry for these two little boys. The eldest boy cried saying he always gets into trouble for nothing (true) and I told him that if you guys just stop being loud then you’re parents won’t come down and tell you off. I told them that I am trying to punish less and notice your good behaviours but as soon as your parents hear you’re not listening to me and getting carried away then they are going to punish you.

Another thing that I feel really sorry for them for is that they can’t ride bikes yet, they’re parents haven’t bothered to teach them yet even though they have bikes. I tried to teach them and they did so well (despite the parents telling me their too clumsy to ride bikes) but now they’ve the bikes locked away for some reason and anytime I ask about them, they make an excuse. It’s so strange. I think they are just old fashioned, slightly lazy parents who don’t care about the emotional well-being of their children.

These boys are the most well-behaved and respectful children I’ve ever looked after. The worst thing they ever do is get giddy and a bit loud. They are kids and I love seeing them happy. Even when we go to the park, they struggle to play on their own and need constant direction from me. The oldest one breaks my heart, he is so loving. Never once has he been sassy, he doesn’t rough play or talk back to me. One day we went for a picnic and a treasure hunt and he kept telling me how happy and grateful he was. He was also so proud of himself when he was learning to cycle and said to me that he thought he would be bad at cycling because his dad says he’s clumsy, I feel so sad that these happy memories are with me and not his parents. I feel sad that I am the one trying to teach him how to ride a bike and not his parents.

What do I do? I am trying to subtlety let the parents know that they’re kids feelings are hurt. Like when I told the dad one day the oldest one was upset because he feels not listened to. I also try and tell them what good behaviours the children have done but in their view, their children are badly behaved, loud and rude. Not true at all.

I actually worry about these children and what would fe one of them as adult men. Will they be oppressed, scared to show emotion or expression ? Act obediently when they shouldn’t or become helpless and bullied by others?

Would love to hear some advice. I’m not sure if there’s much I can do really. I can’t change a parents style can I ?

Sorry for the typos and bad grammar of their and they’re 😅

Give them the number for childline.
They need someone to talk to.
Their parents are awful

Poor innocent kids

Wish they could have some respect for them

This is a Safeguarding concern , emotional abuse. Ring your local Safeguarding officer to talk it through. Or ring NSPCC anonymously for advice.

Thanks for the replies. If I report them to a social worker I’d imagine it would be obvious it’s me that reported. It’s a very tricky situation as I personally don’t think it’s bad enough for an overwhelmed social worker to get involved with but at the same time I do think it will affect their well-being long term. I will look into NSPCC for advice.

Can you not just broach it with the parents in a perhaps softer fashion...so as not to offend to the point where they fire you out of shame that their behaviour had to be addressed?! Perhaps if you had a meeting (no kids) where you can tell parents that they really are the best behaved kids & reinforce that...but explain that if you sre too compliant & can have no mind of your own or voice that it leads to other problems later on...not to mention the sadness now. Also they are paying you to look after kids & you do discipline & they should leave you to it.

You are the childcare professional with the training, make them believe that you do know what you are talking about.

Also, can you not just put your hand out for the storage keys to get the bikes...like 'I realise you are busy so I will get them, I would rrally like to cycle with boys today & stick your hand out in front of them?

It is a difficult situation you are in, poor little boys...

Yes I will try talk to them but for some reason feel really uncomfortable mainly because they are the type of parents to never question themselves or ask for my opinion. You are right though, I do need to explain that these problems now will lead to more problems later. The thing about the bikes is, they have the keys somewhere and I always have to ask if I need something out of the shed. I kept getting the same excuse ‘I will get the bikes tomorrow as I have a call now or it’s probably better they go on scooters as they can’t cycle yet.’ It’s just getting annoying now and I don’t want to be pushy. I think tomorrow I will say to the dad that the oldest boy was very upset last week as he said nobody listens to him.’ Hopefully he will see his kid is human with important and very real emotions.

I dont think you in position to tell them how to parent....they won't like it...you are employee...you would be putting your job on the line. .but you can be assertive in pleasant way about asking for key to bike shed and saying you would like to take them put on bikes.
And you can call nspcc and talk through. See what they suggest.

..and abusive/bullies/such types just will not be receptive to what you say.
Sadly no they wont start seeing kid as human ...

You could speak to their school safeguarding lead in confidence. Are they in state or private?

Firstly, they are lucky to have you in their lives. So thank you for what you are doing for them. Children who grow up in emotionally damaging households remember those who are kind to them and they also remember those who ignored their emotional abuse and did nothing to help them. I don't say this to make you feel like you are 100% responsible for their emotional well being but to add to the mix of your thoughts on the matter.

It is GREAT that you are allowing them to be creative and are taking them out to the park and teaching them to ride their bikes. Thank you!!

There are things that you are already doing and things that you can continue to do to help.. make time to talk to them, to listen and to explore their feelings.

Read ' The book you wish your parents had read'as it might give you some insight into their parents.

What is your relationship with their parents like? Do you want to carry on working for them in this way?

Could you set a meeting with them to talk about how things are going and your plans for the future with the children, especially if you will be their nanny during the holidays?

You could talk about how difficult it must be for the parents to work with a house full of people and if there is a way to make this better. Suggest them letting you know at the start of the week / day if there are particular times where it is important for the household to be quiet so you can plan quiet activities.

Also talk about outdoor and noisy activities and maybe ask them to brainstorm ideas with you emphasising activities outside of the house and use this as an opportunity to ask for things from the shed / ask for your own key. If you have a meeting time agreed for this, use this time to see if you can wrestle the key from them and agree a place for it to be kept. Keep asking for the key when you start every day until they give up (slightly tongue in cheek as they sound weirdly obstructive about this)

Talk to them about discipline and the importance of consistency and allowing you the space to have the authority to talk to the children and give your own punishments (which should be constuctive, chores maybe). Agree on what constitutes bad behaviour and what consequences there should be and frame this around the importance of consistency between care givers.

Perhaps discuss how the parents can communicate with you if the children are being noisy (text with a specific alarm from them so you know to check their texts and not every text you get) and discuss how they might be disturbed by noises that do not disturb you so if they make you aware earlier, you can deal with it rather than have it interrupt their day.

Maybe you can also have an end of day hand over... We have had a great day today, we did XY and Z. Kids behaved really well. When they did LMN, we discussed how to do P instead and they responded well.

CAVEAT: don't put the children in the position where they might expect praise from their parents and might be crushed by their lack of interest or worse. Also don't expect that the parents will necessarily respond well to this so tread slowly as it is possible that they will respond to NONE of this.

Do you have a mentor or someone you can talk to about this? Old college tutor. What support networks are available in your situation? Maybe other nannies can advise. I would be tempted to suggest health visitor or as someone else suggested, Safeguarding officer but these route may have repercussions and I guess this is the ironing out thinking you need to do.

When I have seen other nannies confront their bosses about their parenting styles, it can go in many different directions, immediate dismissal / resignation being one of them which would mean you loose your job and the children loose their ally. Another being the nanny biting her tongue for much of it but managing to create structure around the children which makes it appear that it is for the children, while the nanny is actually parenting the parents.

You are a kind, compassionate and insightful lady and these children are lucky to have you. You are in a difficult position and I wish you the best.

Thank you for this, this is very well said.

I have actually asked the parents loads of times if there are times they want us out of the house and they’ve said no, that they can just work around us. They are high-up in their jobs where they seem to have meetings constantly. The funny thing with the handover is that there isn’t one. I’ve worked for parents who worked from home before and they would always greet me in the mornings and come down to let me go in the afternoon (I work until 4). However, the set up with this family since lockdown has been.. I get there in the morning and the kids are glued to the TV or iPad with parents already on calls. I get on with the day, do their schoolwork etc, at home time the parents are usually on calls and if they’re not they just don’t come down to say goodbye, even though I shout yo to them to let them know. I’d imagine they are just very busy and I don’t really judge them for that. They are very much workaholics so they just think that’s normal I guess. My relationship is good with them, they are very respectful towards me which I’m grateful for as I’ve had some strange bosses. It’s weird they don’t have the same level of respect for their children.

I have actually been doing what you mentioned above about implementing a structure which is for the kids but more for the parents. What I do is give them a marble in the jar for positive behaviours (centred around emotional maturity) and they get a ‘special day‘ at the end of the week if they get enough (they always do as they are so good). I’ve also written these ‘good behaviours’ up on the whiteboard for parents to see and try tell them exactly what the boys have done well. I started this weeks ago when I realised they were being punished for having very low-level conflict between each other, no hitting or anything as they never do that but just bickering and teasing. I mean, this is an important life skill, you need to bicker a little with your brother. So I’ve been rewarding them for resolving problems with kindness and they’ve been so good at being patient with each other. Before the parents would make a little argument into a HUGE deal where usually the oldest one would get into trouble although he was only expressing a bit of anger. Part of me is glad that they hardly ever fight, are never cheeky with me and generally do as I ask just as soon as I ask them, But a part of me is thinking that they might just be obedient because they’re scared.

I think i also showed the mum I wasn’t impressed with her today, the youngest boy fell off the last step of the stairs and she shouted at him saying ‘what are you doing? don’t be so dumb.’ I asked him if he was ok which is really what you should do if you think someone is hurt. She looked embarrassed and I hope she is.

It sounds like you are doing a fabulous job and I’m sure the boys really appreciate you and what you are doing for them!

I don’t think anyone has pointed this out but I thought it would be worth saying, I am not excusing the parents behaviour at all by the way. However I think this ‘lockdown’ situation has been very tough for everyone and it is possible that the parents are struggling at working from home and are not acting how they normally would. I have worked in a very demanding job myself, constant daily meetings, high pressured etc and on occasion the stress does spread over into family life. On top of the worries with lockdown and the virus they might be acting a bit out of character or have a much shorter fuse than they usually would. You mentioned you hadn’t really noticed this before lockdown so perhaps it is just heightened at the moment and this is why you have noticed it more.

That being said I don’t agree with the way they are treating their children however I would be careful in what you say to the parents as you don’t want to risk your job and how you raise your children can be a very sensitive topic, they may feel you are not the right fit anymore. And it really does sound like these boys need you at the moment.

If you did feel like you had to say something I would go down the route of reinforcing your position e.g I am their Nanny and I am here to look after and discipline them when needed, you could say you feel like it is undermining your position when they discipline them without letting you deal with it. I would be really careful with anything personal about their parenting style though.

I hope this helps but it really does sound like you’re doing a great job and are looking out for these children.

I’ve decided I’m not going to confront the parents but just try and lead by example and praise their children in front of them. I don’t think it’s the lockdown stressing them out, they said to me that not much has changed since lockdown as they still wirk the same amount. They also have me there most of the day so it’s not like they’re multi tasking like some parents are. I probably didn’t notice how OTT the parents were before as I didn’t really see them. I would only see them for 10 minutes in the evening before I left.

These children are being abused.
Emotional abuse.
You are turning a blind eye by not reporting.
People always do don’t they.
Every time we read of children who die at hands of parents people come out of woodworks and say they thought this, saw that, but did nothing.
I’m not saying the abuse here is on that level but it’s still abuse.
It will affect these children and cause damage.
Please at least ring the NSPCC and talk to an expert.

I understand your concern however there’s not a lot social services can do about emotional abuse unless it’s really severe and obvious. It’s even very hard to prove as the kids probably wouldn’t be able to explain this treatment. They think it’s just normal. Social services are under a lot of pressure and a lot of time’s they won’t intervene unless the child is in immediate danger. If I thought the children were completely neglected emotionally, I would do something. All I can do now is be firm in my views about parenting and share them with the parents when the opportunity arises. They have a very authoritarian style of parenting which I don’t agree with. I may contact the school actually to see if they could do something in a confidential way as if I went directly to social services now, it would be confidential but they’d have to share the information with the parents and it would be obvious where it came from.

I don't think you necessarily need to go direct to social services but you could call the NSPCC to raise your concerns just to seek some advice from them. The children aren't in immediate danger so I don't see them intervening or referring it anywhere. However I am sure they will have lots of advice and suggestions about how to manage the situation and ways you could try to speak to the parents to minimise any conflict etc. They're experts like @Florencemattell has already stated so I really think it is worth a call and you can also have some reassurance for yourself that you've reached out to them regarding your concerns.

As a nanny, I would have to have a chat with the parents - not confrontation, but if you’re there, you’re in charge and they don’t need to be coming downstairs every time they hear a noise because you’re dealing with it and you have it handled. I would also have to mention how detrimental it is to the children to be called dumb or stupid. Sounds like you’re already very positive towards the boys but I would really up the positive reinforcement whenever the parents are around. Might make them stop and think.

Yes I agree, whenever they say anything negative, I usually disagree with it. They really see their children in a negative light and I don’t really understand it. Most parents are usually the opposite, not being able to notice when their child has a behavioural issue or not noticing their child is a bit spoilt. It’s all very odd but the mum has quite a neurotic personality so maybe she’s just a bit warped.