30 Hours free childcare

[Jazzyboo]

Hi everyone, I am after some advice regarding the 30 hours free childcare. At present my DC goes to nursery through out the year. We have applied the 30 hours but the nursery is saying my doc is entitled to 22.5 hours per week over the course of the whole year. Which implies that she would be entitled to 30 hours if it's only term time.
Is that the case or is the nursery having me on?

Yes the 30 free hours is currently only term time - 38 weeks a year, and nurseries can agree to spread it or to just apply it in term time and charge more in holidays.

That is absolutely correct I’m afraid. The 30hrs is term time only and most 52 week settings will average it out over the year exactly as you’ve been told.

That’s correct, the 30 hours funding covers term time only so at my nursery it’s averaged out across the year.

Yes it is term time only it can be stretched over the whole years. Every bit of information will have said TTO in reference to the 30 hours funding so you’ve probably been a bit selective about what you’ve digested.

Yup for some stupid reason it's term time only - because LOADS of people don't work during school holidays obviously 🤔

don't resent the nursery in their need to make ends meet. providing the care they are giving will have costs almost certainly exceeding the amount they get per hour for the "free" hours so they will be making a loss there. if they can't find ways to make a profit elsewhere they will close. so pay the bills you are asked to pay and don't quibble.

its not a stupid reason at all @itwasalovelydreamwhileitlasted - the 30 hours are not "childcare" they are early years education, "pre-school" but can be delivered via Ofsted approved providers that don't operate like a school if you prefer. school is 30 hours a week 38 weeks a year so no reason for pre-school to be more than that.

@ApacheEchidna
If that was truly the case Childminder's wouldn't be able to claim the 30 hours payment - but they can.....

Childminders deliver the EYFS curriculum exactly the same as preschools and nurseries.

@GeorgieTheGorgeousGoat
Certainly not the Childminder's I know - my 30 hours is split 15 with the pre school 15 with her - 100% her 15 hours do not consist of any type of curriculum

Private nursery tend to offer 22.5 over 50 weeks

Preschool is 30 over 39 - term time

Works out exactly the same amount of hours in the end.

Private nursery can't do term time as they have staff working all year.

Private nursery,s can ofdfer term time and then you have some paying extra for holidays or only do term time. A registered child minder has to stick to the EYFS.

its not a stupid reason at all @itwasalovelydreamwhileitlasted - the 30 hours are not "childcare" they are early years education, "pre-school" but can be delivered via Ofsted approved providers that don't operate like a school if you prefer. school is 30 hours a week 38 weeks a year so no reason for pre-school to be more than that.

You’re getting confused. The 15 universal hours is explicitly for early years education. The 15 additional is equally explicitly for childcare in families where all adults work (with limited exceptions where they are treated as being in work while not meeting the criteria) and was always pitched as alleviating the cost of childcare.

@itwasalovelydreamwhileitlasted

It’s not an option in or opt out thing, it’s what Ofsted inspect on and the basis of what a childminder is. You won’t see it in the form of a curriculum at school, it will be learning through play but the children will be observed and planned for using the EYFS framework.

Thank you everyone. My DC is in a private nursery; she was with a childminder but had to change because the childminder was being difficult. This is why I was unsure of the 30 hours due to previous difficult situation. Plus I found the information out there is quite confusing.

The reality is that the funding thing is a huge political con-trick in which politicians alternate between calling it "childcare" or "education" according to what best suits their ends at the time.

Yes, childminders do deliver the same EYFS curriculum as other settings.

Ofsted inspects under The Education Inspection Framework. As the name suggests, the emphasis is overwhelmingly on education, and any practitioner not delivering the curriculum will crash and burn. The EIF states that "The EYFS educational programme provides the curriculum framework that leaders build on to decide what they intend children to learn and develop."

The educational performance of childminders, nurseries and preschool groups is highly comparable, with 94-95% achieving good/outstanding grades consistently over the last decade (see Office for National Statistics data.) In fact, childminders consistently outperform schools (who deliver the same EYFS in Year R) who attain well below 90% good/outstanding. So it’s curious that childminders are labelled as not being educational when people would be unlikely to level the same accusation at schools.

The reality is that the funding thing is a huge political con-trick in which politicians alternate between calling it "childcare" or "education" according to what best suits their ends at the time.

I agree the funding model is a mess - my kids’ nursery has had to work really hard on a model that is fair to all parents and ensures the funding is passed through, but doesn’t see 4 and 5 day a week parents subsiding those who send their kids for less time - we’re an outer London nursery so the funding doesn’t come close.

I also agree with the political language used about the two funds - though the legislation and statutory guidance are pretty clear on their respective purposes - it simply isn’t accurate when people say the 15 additional hours isn’t intended as childcare

The 30 hours funding is over school terms, so 38 weeks per year, but can be stretched over the year. It is made up of 15 hours universal funding which the vast majority of 3 & 4 year olds are entitled to (570 hours per year) and the additional 15 hours funding for working parents who meet the criteria income wise. This makes a total of 1140 hours per year that are funded. The funding is invariably way below the actual amount needed by providers to cover their costs, and therefore they will ask for a 'voluntary' contribution to cover those extra costs.

So many early years providers are going out of business because the income received from funding and their outgoings do not meet, especially when you consider the rise in business rates, NMW, pension contributions etc against the lack of comparable increase in funding rates. The funding rates have been frozen for several years and providers are promised a maximum of 8p per hour rise in April, but this is dependent on the Local Authorities passing on the full amount.

If you want to know more about the providers campaigning against the "free" funding wording, terms and their struggles why not search for the Champagne Nurseries on Lemonade Funding campaign.

@itwasalovelydreamwhileitlasted.
The eyfs applies to all settings maybe the difference you see is what you imagine is the curriculum. Large settings have to formalised activities with planned things like crafts on themes books the teacher picks etc. Current thinking is that children learn best when their interests are at the heart of activities so if s child sees s birds nest today and wants more on that you go with the interest putting in resources to support their next steps. It's very much in the moment planning. School readiness is not about phonics and writing that is in older years.

Also on a slightly different but related note, if you are eligible for tax free childcare then this can still be used alongside the funded hours. I only recently learned this but luckily not before I can benefit from it.

@itwasalovelydreamwhileitlasted
Certainly not the Childminder's I know - my 30 hours is split 15 with the pre school 15 with her - 100% her 15 hours do not consist of any type of curriculum
What kind of curriculum are you looking for? It sounds as If you are thinking that learning can only take place in certain situations. In reality, the EYFS covers everything from feeding yourself with cutlery, using the toilet, learning to count, reading stories, role play, small world play, making marks. Are you telling me you are leaving your child for 15 hours a week (or more) in a Registered setting that isn’t doing any of those things? I’m afraid I am judging you as much as the setting!

Op, yep, I’m afraid the government have told parents they are entitled to 30 hours free childcare. If you look at the small print it will say it’s term time only, but obviously they don’t shout about that bit. Far better to let childcare settings discuss that with parents who then think we are trying it on with them (and I completely understand why you think that after being led to believe it’s all year round). All year round care is 22 hours a week, so the nursery are correct (this is called a stretched offer).
It also only covers care, so please don’t be surprised if you also get a bill for food/consumables. In a lot of areas the amount of funding the local authority provides fall quite short of what it actually costs to provide the place, so settings have to make up the difference through charging for food/lunch time care/craft items etc.