AIBU - Nanny wants extra payment

[MoneysTooTightTooMention]

We have an after school Nanny, ie someone who looks after my children for 3 and half hours after school every weekday. That is what she is contracted to do.

This is not a cheap option, by any means and is just about affordable for us if we scrimp in other areas.

Thing is, once a week child B goes to an after school club for an hour and has just started a club 5 minutes drive from us. Child A also does a class twice a week. Child A is in senior school so doesn't really need looking after but isn't comfortable being home alone for more than half hour or so.

Child B has been round a friend's after school today and Child A isn't doing her usual club today.

The Nanny has asked for extra to cover petrol costs for this week. Aibu to feel a bit put out?

Agree with other posters. Whether or not someone is self employed depends on the nature of the working arrangement. She's not self employed just because you or she say they are.

The premise of your question is wrong. She is not asking for 'extra payment'. She is asking to be reimbursed for a cost you are asking her to incur in the course of her duties.

Of course you should reimburse the three pounds. She shouldn't have had to ask!!!

Show her more respect or risk losing her to someone who does.

You clearly resent the money you pay her. Frankly it must be really pissing her off she's even had to ask you for the petrol money. I wouldn't be surprised if she's actively looking for another job. One where her employer actually treats her with respect and appreciates her. You certainly don't. You think it's reasonable to not give her a pay rise because you give her petrol money?? Petrol to drive your kids around in her car??

Sheesh.

Are you able to use tax free childcare from the government? It's available to everyone earning under £100,000 per year and it's 20% of childcare costs! We use it for our cm for our 3 dds. Childcare is expensive but then I refuse to scrimp on my children's care as they are my priority.

Ok, fair enough. I am BU. I suppose it's just her wages are a huge chunk out of our wages and have been trying to think of other ways to get childcare that won't disrupt the children. I will pay it but when we're trying to save money then get another extra charge it just stung a bit, is all.

You keep going on about what a financial struggle it is for YOU. This is not your nanny's problem. Is she supposed to subsidise you because you're a bit skint?!

Why don't you become a nanny then op, seeing as how you seem to think she's so well off?

It's not an extra charge. It's reimbursement for her extra costs due to the plans you've made for your children.

She’s v unlikely to be self employed.

If HMRC ever looks into this arrangement, or if she ever falls out with you and complains, you will find that you need to pay all of the tax, national insurance contributions, pension contributions, sick leave and holiday allowance that you should have been paying all along.

You could then (in principle) say you’d accidentally overpaid her because you thought she was paying those costs from her self-employed rate and try to recover that money from her, but she probably won’t have it.

Far too many people go round claiming they have “self-employed nannies”. It’s really unlikely.

She may be se. She may work for others 7-3

Tho if legally se she can tell you she isn’t working a date or send someone in her place - as I can do as I’m a se maternity nurse

Tho if se she wouldn’t be charging you for mileage but put it down as an expense - @nannynick would you agree ?

Sounds like your arrangement is cih

As others have said it’s not your nanny’s problem you are struggling

If you do pay mileage then needs to be 45p per mile

How old are your children ?

And yes if struggling stop clubs

No, if she is running her own business she would be setting fees for any services offered, so she would be deciding how much to charge for transporting children... could charge whatever she liked for that.

If she is running her own business and doing ad-hoc work then if a client is not paying the fees charged, then that client won't be able to book any more childcare. Very easy for her to stop accepting bookings as there is no mutuality of obligation - she does not need to provide the service and the client does not need to use her service.

How old are your kids? Looking after oneself is part of growing up. So if there relatively responsible with a phone that allows you to see where they are I'd be letting them walk 1.3miles to be honest.

Bet she’s not working for others 7-3, and even if she is she has fixed hours for OP and must turn up X days a week and perform the job personally - ie an employee.

I find it really funny that even the op refers to what she pays the nanny as wages.

I've had many contractors before, decorators, plumbers, graphic designers. Not once have I ever referred to the money I give them in exchange for their services as wages.

Maybe you could give your nanny some holiday pay and pension alongside those wages op?

A nanny isn't a contractor though. She's an employee. So what OP is doing is actually illegal.

@CarrotPuff that's exactly my point. If she was truly a self-employed contractor, as op is claiming, the op wouldn't be referring to her fees as "wages".

The nanny is an employee and deserves all the benefits that come with employment.

Fine fair to op. If he nanny said she was se then not her fault

But yes fixed hours and says and it’s employed work

It’s not her fault you clearly can not afford to cover childcare costs.

Don’t take the piss. Re think your arrangements or pay her accordingly.

Fine fair to op. If he nanny said she was se then not her fault
It is if she's employing someone without undertaking due diligence.I can't imagine HMRC buying "oh they're actually my employee.. I had no idea and was totally unaware".

If she's dictating the nanny's hours and working pattern then the nanny isn't self employed. It's all over nanny websites and advice pages.

Given the OP is quibbling over entirely standard expenses and the cost, it's hardly a leap to suggest they're choosing to claim a self employed arrangement because that keeps it cheaper for them, avoids them paying PAYE/NI contributions, ensures they don't have to pay the nanny sick pay or holiday leave and so on.

The fact that her wages are a huge percentage of yours is irrelevant. The fact you are struggling to afford it is irrelevant, it's not her fault if you want a service you can't afford

You are trying to save money not her, again another irrelevant facf. You pay her appropriately for the work she does, which means paying her properly and paying her expenses. Petrol is and expense, if you have asked her to drive an extra 6.5 miles this week then you pay her for that. You are being a bit of a Cf expecting her to provide a service that costs x for less because you can't afford it

This thread just gets worse

Pretty sure you’re breaking the law here, OP and avoiding all associated costs of being an employer?

If I’m wrong please correct me and I will apologise.

Even if she works for another family from 9-3 each day, it’s very unlikely that she would be counted at self employed. It’s almost certainly two part time jobs.

You and the nanny are at risk of falling foul of the IR35 regulations and being investigated by HMRC. I don’t see how your working relationship meets any of the marks of SE.

Control: you have complete control over what, when , how and where the nanny works ( when she’s working for you )

Substitution: the work requires a personal service so the nanny can’t send someone in her place

Mutuality of obligation: you are obliged to offer work and the nanny has to accept it. She can’t say “ I’m busy this Monday night but I can work for you Thursday morning instead “.

I think you need to get advice from an accountant before HMRC catch up with you.

It’s so infuriating parents hiring Nannies this can’t really afford and then resenting paying them or providing them with expenses. Nannies are premium childcare.

The op presumably wouldn't quibble about most other services, but she resents paying her nanny. Maybe she think the nanny should work for less money but provide the same service?