Sob my 10mth old mindee is leaving to go to nursery!! Please read.

[childminderjanet]

My 10mth old mindee who I have had since 5weeks old gave notice yesterday. I was really shocked as his mum had mentioned nursery a couple of months ago when I decided to change my working work from full time to part time. I thought I'd done a good job of puting her off, explaining how young children are much happier/develop better with one loved carer rather than being in an institution riding along on the baby jail conveyer belt (Have you guessed I hate nurserys) I said to her back then that if I couldn't have her baby then I would be able to recommend another childminder. I know she doesn't have a problem with the care I give her baby and she was very upset when she told me and said her husband wants the baby to go to nursery as it will be better for his development. I am an NNEB qualified nursery nurse with 20 yrs experience graded outstanding by Ofsted. I really love my job and work very hard to give the children I childmind the best care possible. Maybe this is just hitting me hard as its the first mindee to ever leave I've only been a registered childminder for a year and normally I would have a child from birth to school. I'm not sure what my next move is I can easily fill his place that's not a problem, but I just feel so bad in not doing anything and just letting him be sent to nursery.
What would you do? Take this on the chin or put up a bit more of a fight?

casmum - childminders are registered with Ofsted so are therefore just as well regulated as nurseries.

Our homes are checked and it is a requirement that we hold regular fire drills.

Also all adults regularly in the house have to be CRB checked.

You say all your babies are loved and cuddled - well that's great but I am talking from experience when I say that is not the norm.

I have a very good knowledge of child development thankyou casmum and I know about the effects an environment can have on a child. I also know that child adapt to their environment and tend to accept the level of care on offer, becoming quite placid if not given high levels of attention. I have witnessed this quite a lot within my work.

Thank you for your suggestion of my writing a book on babycare. I might just do that

A lot of people think nurseries are preferable to childminders. I think I do actually, on the whole. Slagging off nurseries (baby jail ) and trying to influence them other's decision probably didn't do you any favours - I certainly wouldn't have appreciated it.

Sorry you're upset, but it's the nature of your job I'm afraid - you care for other people's children and they leave when their parents think best. It won't be the last time you'll have to say goodbye to a loved mindee.

I'm just a mum I have used and collected other children from diff cm and nurseries.

There are some AWFUL nurseries there are some AWFUL child minders I used one fantastic nursery (very small, v low staff turnover) I have a fantastic childminder.

You do have to hunt through a lot of rubbish to find the good ones in either case. The other thing that parents don't seem to realise it's partly done to the personality of their child some suit diff sittuations much better than the alternative dd2 would not have coped with a day nursery - too introverted, to easy to ignore but I know other young toddlers who have been happier in the on the go buzzing environment of a day nursery and a cm has been too calm!

It's quite appalling to see childminders on this thread saying that the mother is being bullied by her husband, the baby's father doesn't know what's best for his son, the baby's parents are making the wrong decision and sending their son to jail

If you are going to continue minding other people's children, you need to learn to mind your own business as well.

my childminder is like a third parent for ds, so of course i am biased.

but i have come across parents who are actually pleased that their children (babies!) do not develop a close relationship with a carer as this makes them feel insecure.

I don't want to get into a pro or anti nursery for babies debate as I have no experience of sending a baby to nursery.

My two baby sons were each in turn looked afrer by childminders - differnent ones in each case as there is a five year gap in age between ds1 and ds2 and we moved house.

My baby sons were happy with their childminders AFAIK. I chose CMs over nurseries because they offered a more homelike environment and I believed that was important - and also they were a cheaper option and that was necessary for us, too. However, I certaintly wouldn't say I am 100% anti nursery or 100% pro childminder.

The problem that I can see, and the OP bears this out, is the degree of attachment and personal involvement a CM can have towards her charges.

This attachment can be wonderful IME
but is not always so, also IME.

I have felt at times that my childminders were telling me how to run my life and my family and their ideas about what was best for my baby were dominating too much. It was natural this could happen, I suppose, as, looking after my baby for 10 hours a day, 5 days a week they were such a signficant person in the life of baby son.

This intensity can sometimes backfire, I think. Perhaps for the OP, the father is sensing that there is this significant other in his child's life and he is wary of it. Perhaps he feels that his baby will be less under the influence by an individual carer if put in a nursery?

I am certainly not saying what is right or wrong about childminders and nurseries, just saying that the very intensity of a one to one CM relationship with a baby can be the reason why some parents fight shy of this option.

good point, tigermouth.

I think we should all have a group hug and be nice to each other. I think (as a childminder) that we will all have to respect each others viewpoint with regard to our childcare choices.

I really understand how you probably feel, childminderjanet - whenever notice is given, and for whatever reason, I think it is hard not to take it personally. (One of my families emigrated, but I choose to believe that it was nothing to do with how I cared for their child!) I think it's part-and-parcel of the job.

The mum already knows how you feel about nursery, so I don't think you should "put up a fight" as such. Is she upset because you have changed your working hours? Perhaps it's caused her a problem? Were you suggesting splitting the care between you and another childminder?

I think you will have to wish her well, but say that you will still be around if she needs you.

Sorry (for the second time on here today! ) I was rather abrasive and harsh earlier. I do still think you have to back off and accept the parents' prerogative to make their decision for their child - but I didn't give enough consideration to your feelings, having had him every day since he was a newborn. It must be really hard to say goodbye to a child you have cared for and loved, especially if you have strong feelings about nurseries. I am really sorry you're feeling upset about losing him

You did say you had changed your available hours childminderjanet...perhaps that meant she had to make alternative arrangements?
I'd have to move my child from any form of daycare if it switched from being full to part time.
I don't like the generalisations on this thread either about nurseries. Some are good, others terrible. You could say that about any form of daycare. I was very pleased and relieved to put ds into a nursery at ten months after it was apparent his registered childminder wasn't really doing her job.

I looked after a 9 month old on a temp basis until she turned one and started her place at day nursery. I was really sad when I had to take her to settle at the nursery and her mum was sad that she'd be leaving me but she settled so well in the nursery and everyone is happy and it's working really well for them.

I don't have much exp with nurseries but this particular one seems really nice and everyone I know who uses it is happy with the care they provide.

As a mother and c/m I feel it's every individual parent's choice how they bring up their children and which form of childcare they choose.

If the hours you can provide aren't enough for this family then there's not really much you can do about it. It must be really hard for you as you've had him from such a young age but it's just one of those things that, as childminders, we have to deal with.

Could you suggest they do part time with you and part time at nursery?

I feel for you childminderjanet! I too had a mindee from 4 months - 2 years and then they moved too far away for me to mind her. She was the most adorable child and although I have been minding for 10 years, I see all my past mindees around, apart from this one. I miss her terribly, but its part of the job I'm afraid. Imagine if you were a foster carer? That would be dreadful - I couldn't do it.

I agree about foster caring, I've considered that several times and concluded that I don't have the emotional resources to cope with it. Too hard, too raw, too much. Maybe later, when I'm older, I tell myself.

I've never really seen childminding in that light before, I've always related it more to nannying or babysitting (no offence intended - just the phrase "child-minding" and the fact that parents pay by the hour etc) - there are significant differences between that and fostering in my view. But in terms of having a little child come to you every single day, and loving and bonding with that child (which of course is what people are hoping and paying for if they choose a CM over a nursery!) - I'd never seen it that way. It must be gutting to lose a mindee. You are laying yourself open to hurt if you allow yourself to love your charges. I still think to a certain degree it's hard cheese if your mindees' parents decide they need to move on - it goes with the territory. But I can now see that it must be difficult to accept sometimes, and painful. Maybe my attitude towards childminders has been a bit.... off. I'll think about it.

I've remained in touch with many of my long-term mindees - there's a few who have only officially finished with me in September when they started secondary school (who I've had since they were babies!) However, depending where I am going during the Easter holidays, they have informed their parents that they'll still come for the odd day - I think this means for trips to safari parks rather than the local toddler group though! They don't really require "childminding" any more, but still like to come.

I'm actually godmother to one of my mindees now, my dh is godfather to another one, and have been "left" yet another one in the mum's will!!

I love being able to offer long-term care, and when you take on a new baby, you expect them to move onto nursery and to school in due course, and you gradually take on a lesser role. It is more upsetting when they leave completely particularly, as in childminderjanet's case, when it is unexpected.

ThePrisoner, you have spoken brilliantly on this subject, as usual.

I know that there are so many carers per children in Nurseries, but if they are all 18 and having a fag or discussing what hair colour (this has happened) then they are not looking after very young babies.

Equally, if your childminder is an old soak, leaving the kids in front of the telly whilst doing the housework drinking gin, then they are not looking after the children.

I would phone your local NCMA co ordinator if you are looking for a CM.

If you are looking for a nursery - good luck.

I think it's lovely when an childminder bonds so well with their mindees, but I have experienced the other side as well.

I felt that one of my son's childminders bonded better with some of her charges than with others. She had him for a year. He was 7 months old when she took him on, and she kept telling me how 'difficult' he was and contrasting him with other babies she had cared for. At times when I collected him, she'd seem really upset and I'd ask her if I could do anything to make it easier, she said no, there was nothing nothing practical that I could have done. I did not find my baby son particularly difficult when I was looking after him - lively, yes but difficult, no. I think this made her feel even worse

The care she offered was professional at all times AFAIK and my son seemed happy to be left. However I know she felt very guilty that she didn't 'love' him more. She said as much to me.

After a year, she asked me to find another childminder for him - allegidly because she'd decided not to look after any more babies. This was a face-saving way of saying to me that it wasn't working out between my son and her. She lived locally, we kept in loose touch and she took on another baby soon after.

This situation would not have happened if my son had been in nursery. Luckily my son settled in happily with his second childminder, and all was well.

Thankyou all for your input, it's always helpful to hear other people views. Yes I have changed my working hours but this didn't matter to this family as mum doesn't work so it doesn't matter to her which days she had childcare. Of course I wasn't so ott when discussing nurseries with her I didn't say that it was baby jail to her, just that young children/babies are better off with one loved carer. I do accept there are good and bad nurseries and childminders and when I posted this I had been up since 5.30am as it was on my mind. Maybe I was taking it too personally, as I said earlier I've never lost one before. I'm also in touch with all the children that I've looked after over the years as they really are part of my family and the parents are all happy that I love their children. I just felt that nursery was especially wrong for this baby. Sorry to anyone that I've offended, your right I have'nt been to every nursery in the country. One of the great things about mumsnet is you can have a rant, let off steam, get a wide range of opinions and things can look a whole lot more rounded in the morning.
Thanks again this really has helped me xx

I'm probably gonna regret asking this question , but did you just say the mother DOESN'T work? Why does she need cm or nursery then?

I wouldn't ask on here princess - you never know what response you might get!

Is it morally wrong to seek some help in caring for your children?
My reasons for sending my children (admittedly they were a bit older than 10 months) to nursery (part time) were:

• they need to learn english
• 3 and a half years ago, when ds was 15 months, I still felt very unhappy in this country. I felt isolated and my experience at p+t groups had made me feel even more isolated. I wanted my son to be able to play for a few hours alongside other children and interact with other adult people. Play with different toys
• We don't have family here, and I needed a few hours off. Shall I be ashamend of this?

Does this make me less of a mother?

Well said franca. Of course it doesn't make you less of a mother. Sweeping assumptions are virtually always wrong, funnily enough.

. (obviously I have a loooong list of things that make me feel less of a mother... )

but does a non working mother need full time care for a baby from the age of 5 weeks?!

Come on!

Quietmouse there could be several reasons why the mother feels that she wants her child cared for even if she isn't working.

well, I couldn't even imagine to stay away from my 5 week old babies, however, I've never suffered from depression, and I was lucky to be in Italy with all my family around when both the dc were tiny, and always someone chatting with me during breastfeeding marathons... who knows what are the motives of this woman... we can't really speculate, I think.