CM Club: Help with wording my new fees regarding holidays, absence etc

[KaySamuels]

So my current fees are £2.50p.h and if a mindee is off with less than 4wks notice there is half their usual fee charged, if they give me 4wks notice there is no fee.

However it is getting seriously taken advantage of, this week I have lost over £50 just through kids illnesses! Another mindee has been telling me this morning about the lovely holiday she will be taking soon (that I know nothing about) - the same child also went to work with her mum not so long ago when I was told she was off work!)

I want to change to full fee when mindees are absent, no fee when I am absent. Then was thinking what about parents holidays? Don't know what to do about those what does everyone else do?

As a parent I think the following is fair:

1- your holidays. Charge nothing, give at least a month's notice, and make an effort to arrange another childminder to look after the kids for the same rate they pay you (not always doable I know but the parents will really appreciate this).

2- Mindee is sick, on holiday or otherwise unable to show up for the day. Charge full fees. You were there and availble to work. She/he wasn't.

3- Bank holidays. Do whatever other childminders in your area do. To be perfectly honest I always thought it was a cheeky to scharge for a day when you don't want to work. So, I think either you should charge full fees (not double!) and be prepared to work or you shouldn't charge for this day. HOWEVER, I accept that my view may be different from industry standard. So, just see what your competition does and follow suit.

Basically, if you are available for work, expect full fees. If you are not available for work, expect no fees.

Message withdrawn

Message withdrawn

Well I work bank holidays (except xmas and new year as these are in my time off) and I charge double fee! So don't need to worry about that one.

Yes please shosha will email you now.

So if i put parents/ mindees time off including holidays at full fee as my time off is no fee this seems ok? I am expecting a little grumbling to say the least as they have all really been making the most of this one!

Because you are not an employee. You are a business owner. Parents are clients, not bosses.

However, you have been more generous than my suggestion overall because you are only charging half when they don't show up. Why is that? Why do you take a loss when they are the ones who are not available?

Of course, as a prfitable business owner, you may need to put up your hourly rate up in order to make money at the end of the year. That's your choice as a business owner. So what really matters is the total value of the package.

Another benefit to having their time off be full fees is that it wil encourage them to show up. So if say the parent has a couple of day of holiday to take, if her fees are only half she might think hey I can save some money by keeping x home with me and then I only have to pay half fees. Hwoever if she knows she is going to pay full fees anyway she will probably go ahead and send x to you, and then you will have x to look after but you will make full fees instead of half on those two days.

So, charging full fees for her time off is an incentive for the kids to show up more. (and for you to keep your income up)

PS Where are you? £2.50 sounds awfully cheap.

Yes thats what is happening and is exactly why I want to change it to full fee, it will encourage them to come unless there is a good reason, and then I won't keep losing money.

Also a big factor is I prefer to have at least two mindees here so they have company - I find it quite draining looking after just one as I feel they need constant entertainment whereas if there are two or three they play together, make up their own games and generally have fun together. The mindees say this too and when parents are keeping kids off, the kids that are here often comment that they were lookin forward to seeing them etc.

I do need to make a profit obviously and I do, but I have low outgoings and am more of the attitude if I can pay my bills I am happy .

Anyway am off to story time so will pop back in later!

I was going to say that too. I was paying £5 p/h at least 3 years ago (albeit in london). It was part time, so don't know if that pushes the cost up. It's the only time I've used childcare outside of Ireland (where it's largely unregulated still.)

The one thing I didn't get, which I wanted, was a "daily rate" for the holidays. Was paying for DD to be minded before and after school at an hourly rate, but come the holidays, I had to farm her out to family some weeks as it just wasn't worth working if I had to pay CM £250 p/w for full time in the holidays. I wasn't earning much more than that myself.

However, as a parent, I believe in paying if I'm not available (as they have still made themselves available to me) and not paying if the CM isn't available. At the time, I was working as a temp, so that was almost like being self-employed. Your "holiday pay" was "tied in" with your hourly rate and left up to you to keep it separate if that's what you want. I didn't get sick pay. (Think temp rules may have changed since then...)

As far as I can see, as a parent, you are paying a CM for a service. You are not their employer. I believe it can work differently with a nanny where they are "employed" by you and you have to pay their NI and tax.

I do the same pay structure with cleaners. I pay them for their services, I do not employ them. To be fair, if I go away, I leave them a "spring clean" to do as the usual jobs like changing beds and stuff don't need to be done - particularly if away for more than one week. That way they get to work and I don't pay them for nothing.

I am in Hull, this is the average rate here. There are 4 minders at local primary school two of us charge £2.50, two charge slightly more the two who charge the least are full, the others have trouble filling places. Sad but true that for parents here money is a big issue.

Dont understand why parents think we are not entitle to paid holidays - everyone else does so why not Childminders.?????

Everyone else? Don't think so.

Childminders are self-employed. The vast majority of self-employed people do not get paid holidays.

I had mixed feelings about the paid holidays - while I agree with the self employment part and therefore if you aren't working you aren't paid.. but then we all need time off.

I compromised and did 1/2 fee for when they are on hols and 1/2 when I am on hols. Sickness or whatever is full though if they are not coming but I am available. If I am sick then nothing.

If you're self employed and a sole trader, and you don't work, you most certainly don't get paid. And some employees get Statutory sick pay only - rather than full pay. Paying yourself sick-pay as a sole trader doesn't really apply, because you generally don't pay yourself out a salary - you just keep the profits.

Surely CM's work on a sole trader basis, rather than registering as a company and having to submit accounts? Therefore they can claim Incapacity Benefit, if unable to work for a period of time.

Unless you are an employee of your mindee's parents and they pay your NI contributions and tax, then sick pay isn't relevant. Doesn't mean they can't choose to pay you, of course. I would probably be a bit miffed if it were actually in a CM's contract, tbh, though would most certainly pay CM if child was sick and didn't attend.

We don't charge for being off ill though..

No, I know some don't crace... Just a couple of people said "why not?" That's all.

I allow parents to take 2 weeks holidays without paying me, if they take anymore than that they pay full fees.
I take 3 weeks holiday per year (2 weeks in August and Oct half term week) dates fro which are given out to parents in January and I do not get paid for these(parents often coincide their summer holiday with mine).
If I am ill I do not charge.
If parents/mindees are ill or they just take a day off etc (and they have used their 2 holiday weeks)I charge full fees.

This is all in my policies and all parents seem happy with this (well non have complained about it so presume they are ).

I have to admit - I don't charge if someone is ill. I find it hard to enforce. I bill for the hours the kids come.

I have 2 weeks hol at xmas and 2 weeks in the summer - give notice in Jan. I don't charge for these 4 weeks.

I am way too soft - I know I am running a business but I just can't be bothered with the animosity.

Another cm local to me gets paid full-pay for her holidays and criticsed me for asking parents to pay admission fees for outings. I said to her well as a parent myself I would much rather help out to pay (approx £20 per year)for treats for my own child than pay my cm for 4 weeks holiday.

It actually doesn't matter what you do - there will always be someone who isn't happy.
People don't seem to like parting with cash when it comes to their kids - if it's their ironing or cleaning however thats a different matter.

Message withdrawn

Message withdrawn

Yes it's all done! Chickened out of handing it out in the playground yesterday as was worried they might all come up at once (I hate confrontation) but gave some out in the evening, some this morning, just got two to give out this aft now.....will let you know how they all take it!

Here is the text from the section of the newsletter...

Changes to Fees
I will not be increasing my hourly fee in 2007; however I am making changes to fees regarding absence (see below) during contracted childcare hours.

New payment structure regarding time off:
I f children are absent without 4 weeks notice ?full fee still charged
Parents booked time off (with notice given) -full fee charged.
This is as I am available to work and will be holding your child?s place for them when they return.
If I am absent without 4wks notice ?no fee charged
My booked time off (maximum 4wks annually) -no fee charged
This is as I am unavailable and you will need to take time from work or arrange alternative child care.

These changes will start from 19/2/2007. I will be printing you all an amendment to your contracts for both parties to sign and date, of which we will both get copies to add to our existing contracts. If you have any questions please ask.

Message withdrawn