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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

Shocked at what dd told me about travelling in CM's car

26 replies

Toots · 11/11/2006 14:52

DD1 who's 5 told me last night that she went with her CM, who usually walks her home from school, to collect another mindee in the car. She said she was in a seat like DD2's one, a second stage one, the kind that still has an integral harness - ie far too small. Bu - and hold on to your hats - that that the seat WAS NOT SECURED BY THE BELT, and that when the CM stopped she fell forward in the seat and and was pushed back by the CM and that this happened several times.
I am really shocked as you can imagine and need to bring this up with the CM. Would appreciate some thoughts on how to go about this.

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MrsApron · 11/11/2006 14:56

i would not send your dd back and i would report her to the police and ofsted (think thats the right people). it shows a total disregard for her safety. wrong seat v bad. seat not even secured wtf?

hairymclary · 11/11/2006 14:59

OMG that is awful.
I would talk to the CM first and just ask what happened, see what she says.
I don't thik i would send dd back again though

emsiewill · 11/11/2006 15:20

I would talk to the CM, and find out her side of the story (not that she really has a leg to stand on).

If you have been happy with the CM up until now, it seems harsh to just sack her without giving her the chance to explain. And reporting her to the police? seems over the top to me.

I know how hard it is to find a good CM, one that your dc's are happy with, so just 'binning her off' without investigation seems a little hasty to me.

hairymclary · 11/11/2006 15:24

btw, you can get bigger car seats with a 5 point harness.

Tan1959 · 11/11/2006 15:25

Your childminder has failed to meet one of the National Standards as set out by Ofsted; Standard 6, SAFETY. In addition to this:

Have you given written permission for your dd1 to travel in childminders car?
Does childminder have appropriate motor Insurance ie for business use?

Obviously doesn't have appropriate child restraints!

I remember when I used a childminder (20 years ago) ds1 arrived back from an outing to the beach only to be found, by me, sitting on childminders lap in front of vehicle; she was certainly ing.

I would certainly consider whether to continue using this particular childminder.

MrsApron · 11/11/2006 15:35

I don't think it is ott tbh.

She put toots dd in the wrong seat presumably because she doesn't have the correct one.

She knew that the seat was unsecured but didn't stop and sort it out.

Most accidents happen on short journeys. If she had had a collision toots dd1 could have been seriously hurt.

It is a legal requirement for everyone to secure their children properly in the car, toots now knows that this woman doesn't do it.

If the child in the seat had been younger they wouldn't be able to tell their parents about it. Personally I think reporting her is the responsible thing to do for the safety of all children in her care.

NannyL · 11/11/2006 15:44

absolutely outragouse

she needs reporting for the safety af all the children she cares for

have to say if it were my own child they would not be going back EVER again, whether they went on car journeys or not

could never trust someone who shows such blatent disregard for a childs safety or life!

smeeinit · 11/11/2006 16:02

think you would be wise to get cms side of the story before doing anything.
i think its totally outrageous that someone would behave like this but i really think you need to talk to her,you will know if shes lying to you!

Tan1959 · 11/11/2006 16:08

Definately need to discuss with childminder, preferably face to face when you drop dd2 off then ask her if she can show you the seat she placed your dd1 in; you could see then whether seat is secured

gooseegg · 11/11/2006 16:50

Just speak calmly to the childminder and ask her to answer your concerns.
I have some older children who absolutely know the rules about not taking their arms out of the seatbelt but who still sometimes do it when I am not looking. They are very firmly reminded of the rules as they know better, but it's easy for some children to remove a shoulder strap which means that they would fall forwards if I had to brake.

NannyL · 11/11/2006 17:05

true goosegg.. but it seams the seat itself was not straspped in!

NAB3 · 11/11/2006 17:06

We can all forget to do things but the fact that she pushed the chair back several times clearly proves she doesn't take the responsibility to someone elses child seriously.

Original poster

Toots · 11/11/2006 17:26

yeah, I will speak to her when I collect DD on Monday and report back. (I know that they are walking back from school).

Thanks for all your messages. I'll let you know what she says. DD is very keen on CM. We've only been with her since reception started in September. I knew she was a bit slack on paperwork but I got a good feeling from her and an utterly glowing reference from a mindee's mum I spoke to on the phone. She's just what dd needs after a day of school. Very relaxed, focussed on dd and happy to do what ever dd likes. She's always in the middle of reading to an egrossed dd when I arrive. I will wait 'til I can see her face to face, that's good advice. Then I'll take it from there and ask for clarification. Please check in on the thread on Monday!

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Original poster

Toots · 11/11/2006 17:29

Was just such a surprising thing for DD to come out with. Sure there's some truth in it though which is enough to make me feel like looking elsewhere.... it's a chance I would NEVER take myself. I've had a friend trying to convince me to drive with her own dd would be fine slipping inbetween my two with a lapbelt and I've refused so the idea that someone is taking chances without my knowledge is quite upsetting.

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LadyOfTheFlowersIs1Baby1Bump · 11/11/2006 17:50

i think that is awful and it needs reporting, definately.
i wont take either ds anywhere in a car without a proper seat, obviously securely fastened.
my mum wants to take the ds' everywhere without seats and it frives me mad coz i think she would without me knowing- 'in my day....' blah blah blah.
she probably could have been hurt even more in the car seat loose in the back of the car. she would have been better off just strapped in the normal seatbelt i would have thought?

NannyL · 11/11/2006 18:11

lady of flowers

you can now tell you mum that ist is the law that your child travels in a seat, and the police will NOT be happy if they catch her driving him without one

not to mention the fact that she could kill her grandson which would surely make her feel guilty!

happynappy · 12/11/2006 11:03

This thread reminded me of similar situation with our DD's CM who turned up to collect her without a seat for her (DD was three at time). DH spotted no seat and came close to having row with CM who huffed and puffed and eventually evicted her own child (four year old with special needs) from a seat for our child which left us feeling awful but compromised. We had originally thought this CM was great, looked ace on paper as was former primary teacher but turned out to be one of the most unfeeling people and unsuited to being a CM. She is so unprofessional that she blanked us as soon as we stopped using her when I took maternity leave including our DD who was most hurt that the woman who told her to call her auntie would not speak to her. See this CM all the time as her children go to same school as DD. Really feel very nasty towards her now and wonder what else she did that we don't know about. Harsh contrast to our first CM who was wonderful with DD and is still our friend. (couldn't stay with her after we moved) With her the children were her motivation for the work, not the cash. Was the other way round for the rubbish CM who seemed only to want to make as much as possible. We still mourn for first CM as now have baby and going through usual agonies of who should be trusted with DD no 2.

possumhead · 13/11/2006 22:26

Toots, what happened with the childminder? Was it sorted out?

Original poster

Toots · 14/11/2006 09:52

OK... I'm glad I didn't phone and panic and stuff at the weekend. This is a real lesson in trying to keep an open mind until you see both sides of something.

Had a look in her car as I turned up. The seat IS the right kind. It's a booster with a back with the car's seat belt through its loop. It's a dark fabric - a bit like dd2s one, in other words.

CM says that as they neared other mindees school dd1 ducked her head under the belt to look out for other mindee and that she reached out to sit DD1 back.

I believe her and am satisfied. Looking back to Friday, I think I may have asked DD1 some quite leading questions to come to the version of events that I posted. Particularly given DD1 then agreed with CM's version!

Thanks for all your input.

OP posts:

smeeinit · 14/11/2006 10:15

glad you got it sorted toots!

Bozza · 14/11/2006 10:19

Toots I am glad you sorted it out. I did wonder about the description of the car seat being like your DD2's and how accurate that was. But not about the car seat not being secured.

Mummahontas · 14/11/2006 12:29

I have just been reading this thread and am now quite concerned that I have the right car seat for a 4 yr old mindee that I look after. I pick her up from nursery in the afternoons. The car chair that I have got for her is exactly like the one in her moms car ( I know because I had to borrow it before I got one of my own). It is effectively a booster seat with a back. It did have a harness but I took it off because of the weight ranges. This then means that once she is in it, the seat belt is the only thing that is holding her and the seat in place. IS this right?? Please help, I would hate to think that I am not doing the right thing by my mindees.
Also, she sits in the front of the car with her mum, but I prefer her to sit in the back, should I let her sit in the front with me?

Bozza · 14/11/2006 12:35

TBH mummahontas what you are doing sounds just fine. If she is the right weight to have the high back booster with just the seat belt (and most 4yos are) then that is what she should have. And back of car is definitely safer than front.

MrsBadger · 14/11/2006 12:40

What you're doing sounds fine.

Children from 15-25kg (about 3-7) need Group 2 seats, which are boosters with a back and 'wings' that use the adult seatbelt to secure the child.
I guess what you have is a Group 1-2 seat that you can use with a harness up to 18kg and with the adult belt for children over that, which is absolutely fine.

And yes, she's better off sitting in the back.

LIZS · 14/11/2006 12:41

Mummahontas it could well be fine as it may well have a removable harness and become a highback booster but not many models do. There should be a label on the side confirming it conforms to the BS/EU standards and which shows how the seat should be configured for which weight stage with diagrams to show the appropriate car seat belt routing ie Stage 1(usually 9-18kg) with a harness for child and seat restrained by car seat belt, Stage 2(15-22kg) car seat belt to restrain child and high back seat and perhaps Stage 3(22kg up) where you remove the back and have it as a booster cushion again using the adult belt.

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