Kids saying that the nanny has called them stupid??!!

[Minki]

We have a new nanny who started with us almost a month ago. She seems quite good and had good references and experiences. The children seemed ok with her to begin with but over the last few days have said they don't like her (they have said that about nannies before), that she is the worst nanny they have ever had (they have not said that before) and that she calls them stupid! The first two comments I understand but I am very worried by the third comment as it is not ok for anyone to call them stupid. Not sure what to do though will obviously have to raise this with her and see what she says. The children (aged 6 and 4) are quite naughty/high spirited but they don't usually lie. There have been a few other niggles, in that she leaves the lounge and their rooms messy and she also just texted to tell me that she cannot work on Thursday as she has an appointment somewhere. Bit strange really that she would "tell me" rather than "ask me" given that she is only a few weeks into the job and employed as an after-school nanny. I should be able to take Thursday afternoon off but wouldn't usually be able to on such short notice. Starting to get a bad feeling about this, or am I being paranoid?

I don't want her available full time in the holidays!! I MAY ask her to cover additional hours IF SHE WANTS.

Not having a Written Statement is a bit of red herring I feel - a contract is formed when a person agrees to do work for someone. The contract at present is probably oral and may have some bits written in the form of email and text communication. I like many nannies would want the written statement before starting work as that is better than trying to remember discussions which may go back some weeks/months.

Without there being the written statement which would detail things such as amount of notice for taking a day off, then how would your nanny know how much advance notice you required. Yes I agree they should have Asked you, not Told you, so maybe communication between you needs to be improved, which may come about from you creating the written statement and having some way for you to communicate with each other whereby a record is kept (I suggest email and using a calendar).

The nanny should not call a child stupid but do you know the full circumstances of the event? People say things (often the wrong things) when under stress. Did your children say if they had done anything which may have resulted in the nanny saying they were stupid, or being stupid?

Given your children's history with nannies, are they in the phase of testing out this nanny, pushing their luck to see what they can and can't get away with? Could it be that having a word with nanny about being careful about the language they use may help?

I find there is always a time when the realities of the job hits home. Sometimes that is after a couple of weeks, other times it may be a bit later. Often though it is within the first two months - the novelty wears off and the job may not look as attractive it did initially. It takes time for everyone involved to adapt to the new situation. Whilst the children have had a nanny before, they have not had this nanny, so I expect they will be testing to see what is permitted and what is not, thus seeing at what point nanny gets cross. Nanny may be bit a confused about how pay is being structured, how much notice there needs to be on both sides for 'flexibility' requests.

So at the moment I feel this is coming down to communication issues and children pushing limits. You may or may not agree, after all you are there and I am not. Give it some more time, cross the t's dot the i's, do review chat (bad news sandwich style if necessary) to make sure nanny is happy with the arrangement and problems are brought to your attention quickly, resulting in quick resolution.

I don't agree with many of the poster here. I have worked with some families that require flexibility, and I never asked them to pay me an extra hour every day just in case they ask me to stay later one day.

I also worked with stay at homes mothers that would telle me the hours they needed one or two days before. I was alright with that. As long as you know that when you start to work, I don't think it's so horrible ;)

To be honest, I was happy when they asked me to stay, it's more money and it was rare that I couldn't (and I would just say no then).

archery Ann, I always insist that my employers register for tax and insurance so don't understand the comment "so few do,"

Nick is right about getting a written agreement at the beginning as it can save a lot of grief later.

sunshinenanny, good for you! A while back I employed a nanny part-time (legally, with Ni and tax and sick pay and whatnot) and knew a lot of other nannies socially. Hardly any were legal - not because they didn't want to be, but because their employers were tightarses. My nanny's other employer - who was mildly famous and about a billion times better off than me - paid her cash in hand, no holiday pay, no sick pay. Tight bastard.

Yes, but I also need flexibility and made it very clear that I would need more/less hours with v little notice

I disagree that I am asking to have my cake and eat it. I am just asking for a degree of flexibility. I appreciate she may say "no" or she won't be available if I need more hours and that she has the right to say no

Not quite the same thing is it??????

Minki you're getting a kicking on here and I do not think you should be. You have indeed had bad luck with your previous nanny (I have had similar and I know how troubling it is).

I too need 'flexibility' but I employ a nanny for 40-50 hours a week. I pay her slightly above the going rate for such flexibility and have rarely had to trouble her to be too flexible luckily enough.

As for the children saying she said they were stupid, I too would be alarmed at this and would investigate. I'd come at it from a 'we do not use that word in this house, where did they get it from' angle. If your children are used to having a nanny it would seem unlikely to me that they are simply lying to get rid of her.

A contract helps you both to know what hours duties are wanted

If you cancel nanny for whatever reason you need to pay her

The nanny should has explained why she needed thur off and was it possible to have time off

We all like to be flexible and help out employers so as Lin as hou ask if she can work late and not insist on it then it can work

Stupid - simply say kids said it the other day. Do you know where they heard it from

Agree very diff to say you are stupid and that's a stupid thing to do ie rid if bike one handed and fall off iyswim

If English isn't the nanny's first language, she maybe doesn't appreciate that 'stupid' is quite offensive.

I do think that going forward you can't expect your nanny to not work if you have a last minute request from your ex to see the children. If she has made herself available for work it is a bit off to change plans at the last minute, even if she has worked additional hours elsewhere in the week.

Have you thought about supplementing with an au pair to give you more flexibility in the holidays?

archeryann I'm not really in a position to work off the books even if I wanted too. I know there are employers who are tight or sometimes just hard up and they try to play the self employed card. but I also know some nannies are happy with this arrangement.

The employer I have just started working for said her previous 2 nannies had said they were self employed. I explained that this wasn't possible in the kind of position she was offering and she agreed to employ me legally. I cannot afford not to keep my NI. contributions up to date and the tax man isn't stupid and as my employer is claiming tax relief on her childcare by employing an Ofsted registered nanny and I also have to inform Ofsted where I am working it would be silly of her to not register for Tax and NI.

I do know that a friend of mine found out her employer had not been paying her contributions and the tax office went through all the employers financial affairs with a fine toothed comb and they were fined heavily and threatened with prosecution and had to pay all the nannies back contributions.

Christ! Thats a lot of different nannies your kids have had. They must not know which way is up.

sometimes you have appointments at short notice. It happens sometimes

Thanks LEMmingaround, way to make me feel TERRIBLE! I would love not to need nannies and be able to look after my kids myself but I do need to work and cannot stop people leaving after a year or so if they want to get married, get pregnant, need more hours. What am I supposed to do???

As for my current nanny, I hadn't got around to mentioning the stupid comment with her when DS1 took me aside and said that the nanny had said that his papa and I were disorganised and that she hated us !??? I therefore raised it with her and said, by the way, DS1 has said this and mentioned the stupid comment. She said, oh he is very smart as I think he thought I was going to say that, but I didn't (??). I then raised the other two comments and she denied saying them. We left it on good terms and I sort of said, well obviously we don't say those sorts of things etc, so she now knows but still a bit worried about it all. DSs have never made comments about any of their nannies before, other than I don't like her, but never made specific criticisms. Then just yesterday DS1 said that the nanny poked him in the side of his head when telling him off. Really at a loss as to what to do. Who am I supposed to believe here??

'he thought i was going to say that but i didnt'

total bullshit

she obv did say that

find a new nanny

Oh god, you really think so Blondes?

I'd start looking tbh. you are not happy with this arrangement.

fwiw - I have a flexible nanny - she works when I ask her to and she is able. most weeks at least a day unless I'm on planned annual leave. some weeks up to 4 days. she does other jobs and trys to fit them around us.

i work 22 hours out of 37 a week. different days different times.

it works excellently.
we are very lucky, but I don't think it is impossible to come to this arrangement.

and it is all in the set up.

Fraid so minki it's not something that would happen iyswim

apparently about to say and then the child mind reads and nanny doesn't actually say it but your child does

Hmm, even if she didn't do any of those thongs, there is clearly a deep dislike at least on your ds's side. I'd find someone else.