Nanny and time off problem.

[knackeredmother]

I would be grateful for some help and opinions on how to handle this.
We've had our part time nanny 2 years, we had a LOT of teething problems, mainly around us being pushovers and not really managing things very well. She was very inflexible and we were too flexible (e.g she couldn't stay 15 mins over finishing time even once in an emergency despite regular early paid finishes).
Anyhow we had a frank chat and we improved our assertiveness skills and things have been much improved.
Fast forward to today, we mainly need our nanny to cover school holidays and obviously the 6 week holiday. We suck up the year round cost when kids are at school so that we don't have to worry about the long holidays.
She had asked for 2 weeks holiday in August which isn't ideal as I can't take 2 weeks leave then but I said yes as I appreciate the need for a holiday. Today however she has said she wants 3 weeks holiday (something to do with better for flights). She has suggested her nanny friend covers the extra week and she takes it unpaid (She doesnt have enough leave left to take 3 weeks as leave).
The other nanny can't work the same days as my nanny so we would have to do a lot of rearranging.
So basically, we employ a nanny mainly to give us cover for school holidays but our nanny wants HALF of the 6 week holiday off.
Now I can't work out if this is a piss take or the fact she has presented a solution is fine?
If it is fine how would this work? Would I have to employ the other nanny for that week? Could she invoice me and I just pay and she sort her own tax and NI?
I have no doubt that this is non negotiable for my nanny.She would leave if I say no although there are few other jobs where we are so she may stay but just hate us! If she leaves I then have the hassle of finding a new nanny.
This is long and rambling but I could do without this hassle. A nanny is supposed to make life easier surely?!
I would appreciate any thoughts, thank you for reading.

I also recognise I should have in her contract no holidays in the 6 weeks. However she won't take her dc out of school to travel in term time and likes to visit her family for 2 weeks in August.
She knows we struggle to cover this. I have told her verbally many times but I appreciate we need to be nice employers and respect she has a family too.
She knows we really need her for the rest of the 6 weeks as I had asked her if she could possibly work some extra days in the 6 weeks. I have explained we have no family, can't afford a temporary nanny, can't take leave in August. So although I haven't written this into her contract she certainly knows I wouldn't want her to take more than 2 weeks leave (or less if possible) in August.
BTW she was not happy to work the extra days until she realised we may need to make her redundant and employ a nanny who can work more hours as we needed. She is working 2 extra days in the whole 6 weeks but we really needed more and she knew this.
So she was well aware of our 6 week holiday childcare problems.

Just say no
She is taking the mick

So you're not ' happy for her to take her 3 weeks of chosen leave whenever she wants, school holidays or not'. If you're being as unclear with her as you are here, it's no wonder she feels able to ask for extra holidays etc.

To quote Grange Hill, just say NO.

If she leaves, she leaves. When you get a new nanny spell it out to them at interview and in the contract exactly what you need in the holidays. Don't employ someone who has children and family in another country and therefore needs time off in August.

I'd find another nanny who is more flexible tbh.

Your request for 3 weeks holiday (dates) is refused. Your previous request of 2 werks holiday (dates) remains granted. Please confirm that you still wish to take those two weeks off, or please submit alternative dates for consideration.

It can help to track things if all holiday requests plus approve/deny is in writing (or email these days).

Thanks nanny nick. I try my hardest to be a good and flexible employer but it just seems to cause problems/ confusion.
I really don't think I'm cut out to be a nanny boss (Im clearly not good st managing people, i find it difficult to say no and be assertive) and need to think about alternative childcare .
Thanks again for all the help.

It's a shame knackered, but some people will take advantage or maybe just struggle to understand hints/subtle communication.

I think it helps if you are fair in the contract and then stick absolutely to it for the first year. Then if they've proved themselves reliable etc maybe be a little flexible.

I know my employers are much more flexible with me now, 5 years in, than they would have been when I first started. It's because we've built up a relationship, I've been flexible for them and they will be for me. I've done the same, if they were late coming in early on, I would have pulled them up on it. Now I know them, I know they don't take the piss, if they're late I don't complain/charge overtime because I know they'll be a good reason and I remember the times they've not compained when I've been late or forgotten to do something etc.

I've found myself somewhat changing my view with this tread. If the nannies contract does not stipulate that holidays can't be taken in school holidays, then she's perfectly reasonable to ask for holiday whenever she likes. I think it's a little mean for a contract to say you can only take one weeks leave at a time- we all like our two weeks in the sun! Lol. However, she's asked for 3 weeks... Don't think this is unreasonable either really. It might not be ideal, but she's given you plenty of notice, and tried to help with alternative childcare. Obviously 3rd week would be unpaid and subject to your approval. I originally thought nanny was asking for time off despite contract saying no hols in school hols.
Choice is simple really:
If you value your nanny, think she's doing a good job, and want to keep her, then I'd suggest you try your best to accommodate her request. Obviously if its impossible, then theres nothing you can do, say no.
Or
You don't feel the nanny is not very good/ suitable/ flexible enough... Etc, and you say no to her request, possibly upset her and have her leave.
Basically do you feel strongly enough about this issue to possibly lose your nanny and have to find a replacement, if yes, then say no to holiday, and deal with the possible consequences. Or if this issue really isn't that big of a deal, and alternative arrangements could be made, then say yes to holiday and maintain harmony.

My point of view from an outsider on this thread.

You've stated in her contract that only "one week can be taken at time" but yet you've let her take 2 weeks off before to visit family and are doing so again, so basically you've been going against the contract YOU made for her, so of course she's gunna try and take more since you've been ignoring your own rules based on the contract.

Sometimes Verbal communication isn't strong enough to get your rules and point across. You still have to be professional and if she isn't listening to you or is upset at the word "no" then maybe you should write her a letter explaining the agreement and contract once more and that things need to change, because obviously from what's been said things can't go on as they are.

Golly, I think this nanny sounds dreadful, personally. I've never been in a position to employ one, so I know nothing about it, but I'd always vaguely imagined that people had a nanny to make their working lives easier/possible IYSWIM.

You need a nanny so that you have someone to care for your DCs in the school holidays. Yet this one has had 2 weeks at Christmas last year (causing you problems), Easter and now wants 3 weeks of summer holidays off...

It sounds as though you are hopelessly at odds with what she wants as an employee and what you require as an employer/family.

Frankly I think you need to refuse her request - and either let her go or give her notice, explaining that it is not working out for you. Then I would be looking for another nanny and putting a contract in place to say that their annual leave may not be taken in school holidays. After all, if that is what you need someone to cover then there is no point employing someone who can't/won't do the 14 weeks of the year that you do actually need them to be there!