A question about ratios

[squinker45]

Does anyone work with another childminder e.g. their husband? If so, how many under 8 in total does it state on your certificate? On mine it states I can have 4 on my own (2 kids of my own) or 6 when working with him. On his it says he can have 6 on his own, and 5 when working with me! What's going on?

How old are your children if either or both of them are 8 years old or older then your rations shouldn't be affected except by space. However if you have under 8 year old children then one or both of them should be taken off your ratio's. Your certificates are certainly conflicting, but then they will alter from tomorrow after the revised EYFS comes in. If you clarify the ages of your children then we can advise you better.

Each of us can have 4 when working on our own (we have 2 of our children under 8 just like you). But when we work together we can have 10 under 8 in total.
Seems somebody made a mistake best check with Ofsted as your ratios when working separately should be the same ... and when working together your own children should be subtracted only once.

Our certificates are mirror images of eachother / the same.

HSMM remember that from Monday you can decide how many under 5s you can look after Look on p21 of EYFS 2012 Childminders can decide in 'exceptional' circumstances the number they can care for....(this has caused much debate as some are against...some for it)

Also you should have received the Ofsted publication no 080293

www.ofsted.gov.uk/resources/factsheet-childcare-numbers-and-ages-of-children-providers-early-years-and-childcare-registers-may-c
Page 3 is just for c/ms and page5 relates to those with assistants

Hope it helps

Thanks so much for that. The Ofsted lady made me feel like I was being thick, so I didn't question her further but it really doesn't make sense at all - the reason I was looking at it again is because when mine goes to school in Sept 13 we should have another space, but if the certificate only says 6 in total then we wont, and we won't be able to live off childminding for much longer as the numbers of under 8s will be made up of mostly school age children. I really want to ring them up but I know they are busy right now....
My children are 9 months and 3 at the moment.

In September all c/ms will receive another letter from ofsted and then a new certificate removing all 'conditions' and paving the way for 'exceptions'

There are criteria you must follow to care for more than 3 children under 5 and, where before, you had to apply for dispensation now you decide, discuss with parents, reflect on resources and logistics and you are free to do that

Ofsted unfortunately have been totally taken over by DfE...any question is answered by text book replies...Gove has his ways !
Your LA will probably come out with 'advice' as will all others I am sure and ...I bet you £100 this issue will be debated for ever and ever !!!

Yes I know Italiana. Can't wait to see what rubbish Ofsted send through.

It's really the same as before ... without the phone calls to Ofsted

Not really the same because some c/ms will end up with up to 6 under 5 if they judge it correct ????.... before the max was 4 under dispensation
You are right no phone call...mind you the previous system was appalling as it could take a month to sanction dispensation (with numerous forms to be filled) especially when it was needed as an emergency the following week

This is 'deregulation' or less regulation, whichever way you want to see it.
You may remember that E Truss MP suggested we look after more children? for me this is it... but it will end up in tears as many will abuse the system and LAs will be on alert and start doing unannounced visits to check

Unfortunately I do feel there will be serious accidents with so many little ones in one's care...hope not but I fear it !

Right well that should clear that up then, hopefully the new letter / certificate will say we can have 6 under 8 each. Watch this space....

PS we won't actually have this many - far too many in my opinion! But we would like to be able to have 8 between us counting 2 at school.

The reasons for having more than 3 under 5s are not really changing, we just don't have to phone/write to Ofsted any more. Some CMs had 5 under 5 with an Ofsted variation and I don't know if anyone legitimately applied for 6 under 5 and whether they would have got it.

I have 4 under 5 on my certificate at the moment, but they are 4 existing children, not just any 4 children I feel like taking on.

I don't think the deregulation will affect me really, wouldn't want more than 3 under 5 and I think I will be avoiding it at all costs....it would be good to be able to have 3 under 5 and 1 under 8 though like everyone else!

I think you need to read the revised EYFS and see where you stand...some do not want anymore than 3 children, some will do that as long as they can justify that and the children are safe...remember it is an 'exception' not the rule!!!

Watch this space indeed as we will be arguing this point for a long time....

I have read the revised EYFS - the issue is that under the current rules (former rules?) i have been arbitrarily limited in numbers for no reason I can see - 2 childminders working together can usually have 6 under 8 each but that's not what we are allowed, only 6 maximum between us (3 each in total under 8) which is what you are allowed as a single childminder so what's the point of there being 2 of us? The point is, we don't want any exceptions just to be allowed up to 4 each (3 under 5 and 1 aged 5 at school). I can easily justify it under the new EYFS, as it is much lower numbers than everyone else was allowed under the old one.

No ...you are allowed many more now
Under the old framework you could have 3 or 4 with dispensation
2 c/ms working together could have 6 in total...that has changed now as they can have many more...look under c/ms with assistants and you will see the changes when both c/ms are registered...

I know it sounds complicated but we will get used to it and soon there will be lots of explanations from ofsted...who have been quiet so far..once inspections start and people start questioning they will have to explain but they do give examples in their publication...look for what suits you and what you can do and decide

The numbers of children also relate to available space.

yes.... and resouces and equipment and resting space and car usage and outings and safety while out and school pick ups and logistics...
many many factors which we need to take into account on top of keeping them safe....it sounds very easy but it requires some thought and i am sure many c/ms will think carefully..