Childminders and data protection

[kys]

I was under the impression that we only needed this if we were storing records on a computer. Ive just been told i also need to register if im going to use a camera/phone to take pics.
I was always told that aslong as i had signed permission from parents that was enough. Apparently not. I spoke to 4 other childminders this morn and only one of them had data protection. Are any of you registered?
Any way im now im £35 poorer and registered with data protection.

Well, I asked my Ofsted inspector at my registration visit about this and she said she'd never heard of it! As far as I'm aware we are supposed to, & I would have done if she'd told me to, but given her response I must say I haven't bothered. My mindees are all the children of friends in any case, so I figured I'd probably have photos of them on my computer anyway. I think it's completely & utterly ridiculous - what exactly does your 35 quid pay for?

I have it

My £35 paid for a piece if paper. An expensive bit of paper, should be gold plated

My inspector said I should but to pretend I didn't know and there was nothing they could do so I didn't bother.

If you hold data about children and their families you are a Data Controller and therefore need to pay the ICO your fee...it is the law.
No inspector would tell c/ms not to bother..And I would report that to Ofsted for clarification....if in doubt ring the ICO and ask them directly

The fee and certificate are part of our job and type of business we run

I have it but agree that it's a waste and just another way of getting money out of people. Being on a register doesn't suddenly make the data safer!!!

I was told on my Local Authority training course that we should all register as data controllers just to be on the safe side, and certainly if we use digital cameras and printers (as no doubt we all do in this day and age).

It never occured to me not to register - I saw it as just another part of my start-up costs.

It's not intended to make any data safer. We are childminders ... we are professionals. By signing the register we say we will comply and keep data safe. I have been registered with ICO for data protection for over two years now. It's not new. I really don't understand why some childminders seem to have a problem with it. You do not have to register if you do not store any details on the computer, phone or do not take photos with your phone or digital camera. It's £35 a year ... not a fortune in my opinion but if you can't afford it just avoid using digital camera, computer and phone for childminding data.

I am.

NCMA emailed all members about a year ago to say we had to have it if you have digital material relating to your work (bar accounts).

Whether you think it is pointless (I do) or not is neither here nor there - it's a legal requirement.

If I was a member of the NCMA I would want them to spend money on defending a test case, not on promoting the IMHO ludicrous interpretation of the law by the Information Commissioner's Office. I defy any reasonable person to demonstrate that it is in the public interest for childminders to pay a fee to have their names entered on a register that says they hold information about children: anyone that needs a register to tell them that is a fool. If this is the law (and at the moment it is NOT the law, it is the untested opionion of the ICO), it is bad law and should be exposed as such.

Look at it this way, there are 60,000 registered childminders in the UK, if they all paid £35 a year that is £2.1m for the ICO to spend dreaming up more inappropriate ways to spend other peoples money.

I am all for regulation - I am an accountant, my career is based on regulation - but this is regulation without purpose and for its own sake.

Thanks MrA, you put it SOOOOO much better than I did but that's basically what I meant!! :)

If you hold personal data on a computer then you are a Data Controller and have to be registered. End of story. Applies to all businesses. It's the Data Protection Act and it is law, not the untested opinion of the ICO.

ZuleikaD the Information Commissioner has decided that even if you don't store Personal Data on a computer, if you take a picture of your mindees (for instance as part of your EYFS records) with a digital camera then you need to register. This is not stated anywhere in the Act, and relies on interpreting certain provisions of the Act in a way which IMHO was not intended.

DPA says that if you store "data which relate to a living individual who can be identified (a) from those data, OR (b) from those data and other information which is in the possession of, or is likely to come into the possession of, the data controller" then you need to register.

Would anybody risk not being registered when it is obvious we need to?...it is another expense and one, I feel, I do not mind paying

Do I as a nanny need to sign up???

But ZuleikaD the word 'data' has a special meaning within the Act which I do not agree applies to a jpg file on an SD card any more than it does to a 35mm negative.

Italiana I haven't suggested that anyone should not register. I am pointing out that it is far from clear that the DPA does say what the ICO wants it to say, and even if it does it is even less clear that this is what the government that passed the law intended it to say.

If you think that this is the best way for childminders to spend two million pounds of your money (about 1/10 of the whole budget of the ICO) then fine, but if you don't I think you should do something about it.

N4NNY - generally speaking if someone processes Personal Data as part of their employment, they do not have to register.

On a strict interpretation (the ICO is fond of those), it seems that the family you work for should register because the exemption for domestic purposes only covers "Personal data processed by an individual only for the purposes of that individual?s personal, family or household affairs" - so any pictures you take are not exempt.

But hang on a minute - do you ever do babysitting? Have you got the phone numbers of parents you babysit for in your mobile? You'd better send off your £35... or not.

This is bad law.

Mr Anchovy..it is obvious that you are against paying ICO...as a c/m I do not like this fee either but there must be a reason why we are included in this and need to pay

C/ms run a business, however small, and therefore we have to follow the rules surrounding this...and not argue that we should be exempt ...a business is a business???

italiana the problem is there seems to be no reason or benefit to registering. We go on the ICO register and get a piece of paper to say we're on the register.

We get no practical support and not so much as a leaflet on keeping data safe. I think if there was an obvious reason for or benefit to registering then people wouldn't question it. However many people seem to think that as there's nothing 'in it' for them, they will feign ignorance and not pay.

It doesn't matter if you don't see the benefit - the law, sadly, is the law. I don't see why I should pay Ofsted £ every year for my registration when they come out to see me every 3 years for 2 hours and one will contradict what another has said, but I still have to pay.

Agree with Flissflaps. I DO pay and wouldn't not pay just because I don't agree. But I totally disagree and that's not because I'm a childminder and feel I should be treated differently, I am a business and don't mind paying for what I feel is worth something. MANY businesses find it a waste of money and just another way to make a huge amount of money, look at the figures MrA gave for just CMs alone. So although I think it's crazy, of course I still pay as it's the LAW!

Please remember that our registration fee is only £35 compared to day nurseries who pay hundreds £££....with Ofsted privatised they will be looking at making money

The whole thing is very much market and money driven...

I deal with data protection a lot in my job (I am a solicitor). It is not correct to say that you only need to register if you store records on a computer. You must register f you keep paper records also. The purpose of registration is not so that people can see that X stores records about children, it is so that the ICO can ensure that the data controller (that's you) is only processing data for the purposes for which she is registered to do so, and so that the subject of the data (the child, or in practice, the child's parents) can obtain copies of the data stored to ensure it is correct.

If you are processing data without registration then you are liable to pay a fine to the ICO if caught. In practice it is hard to imagine how anyone would "catch" you though and I can't imagine the ICO has time to start zeroing in on CMs. However, strictly speaking if you are processing personal data - i.e. anything that could identify the data subject - then you should register.

I think that the last message should put an end to any doubts...Thank you Peppin

Peppin The ICO has confirmed that for CMs it only relates to digital records (including photos stored on digital cameras and mobile phones) and that our paper records are exempt.